hoopers
Loveland, CO
Senior Member
Joined: 10/26/2002
View Profile
Good Sam RV Club Member
 Offline
|
I've been on hiatus for awhile, but all I can say is the EPA has done more overall damage to our environment than they have ever saved.
I was in Europe for awhile and at least a third of the cars over there are diesel these days, all getting great MPG and power. I saw diesel after diesel cruising down the autobahn at over 100 mph.
I rented a tiny little Renault diesel car...it cruised effortlessly at 80 mph and achieved great MPG at the same time. There was no black smoke or anything coming out the back tailpipe.
What a joke the EPA diesel standards are. With the mandated dry diesel fuel and the restrictive standards, what car maker will want to clear the EPA hurdles of trying to qualify a high mpg diesel auto? So instead, we continue to produce lower mpg gasoline autos producing much more emissions. They need to look at emissions per mile driven, or some such formula. At least that is the way it seems on the surface.
2011 Silverado CC DRW 4x4
2013 Bighorn 3670RL
Texas gulf coast, Colorado, or on the road camping somewhere
|
MM49
Brighton, MI, USA
Senior Member
Joined: 12/28/2004
View Profile
|
hoopers wrote:I've been on hiatus for awhile, but all I can say is the EPA has done more overall damage to our environment than they have ever saved.
I was in Europe for awhile and at least a third of the cars over there are diesel these days, all getting great MPG and power. I saw diesel after diesel cruising down the autobahn at over 100 mph.
I rented a tiny little Renault diesel car...it cruised effortlessly at 80 mph and achieved great MPG at the same time. There was no black smoke or anything coming out the back tailpipe.
What a joke the EPA diesel standards are. With the mandated dry diesel fuel and the restrictive standards, what car maker will want to clear the EPA hurdles of trying to qualify a high mpg diesel auto? So instead, we continue to produce lower mpg gasoline autos producing much more emissions. They need to look at emissions per mile driven, or some such formula. At least that is the way it seems on the surface. We comply with the same diesel standards as Europe. I think you need to take a look at the new diesels. You really don't know what you are talking about.MM49
|
jmtandem
western nevada
Senior Member
Joined: 01/18/2006
View Profile
Offline
|
Quote:What a joke the EPA diesel standards are. With the mandated dry diesel fuel and the restrictive standards, what car maker will want to clear the EPA hurdles of trying to qualify a high mpg diesel auto? So instead, we continue to produce lower mpg gasoline autos producing much more emissions. They need to look at emissions per mile driven, or some such formula. At least that is the way it seems on the surface.
Mabve you did not think about the VW TDI, high mileage and low emissions, just like Europe. In fact it comes from Europe. What is so different?
'05 Dodge Cummins 4x4 dually 3500 white quadcab auto long bed.
'09 299bhs Tango.
|
Turtle n Peeps
California
Senior Member
Joined: 06/23/2008
View Profile
Offline
|
hoopers wrote:I've been on hiatus for awhile, but all I can say is the EPA has done more overall damage to our environment than they have ever saved.
Where does that idea come from? Have you seen charts from the 70's AQ in the LA basin? And then charts of AQ now with 10 times the people living there? Look it up.
Quote:I was in Europe for awhile and at least a third of the cars over there are diesel these days, all getting great MPG and power. I saw diesel after diesel cruising down the autobahn at over 100 mph.
I drove to work today and everybody was going about 55 getting WAY better mileage than diesels doing over 100 MPH. 
Quote:I rented a tiny little Renault diesel car...it cruised effortlessly at 80 mph and achieved great MPG at the same time. There was no black smoke or anything coming out the back tailpipe.
I drive a diesel Caddie and it cruises effortlessly at 80 MPH and achieves great MPG at the same time. There is no black smoke of anything coming out the blck tailpipe either. But that does not make the 5.7 diesel a clean engine. Most really bad things you can't see coming out of the pipe.
Quote:What a joke the EPA diesel standards are. With the mandated dry diesel fuel and the restrictive standards, what car maker will want to clear the EPA hurdles of trying to qualify a high mpg diesel auto? So instead, we continue to produce lower mpg gasoline autos producing much more emissions. They need to look at emissions per mile driven, or some such formula. At least that is the way it seems on the surface.
You act like the rest of the world dose not have ULLSD or smog standards. Europe has VERY high standards but that are different than that of the US. Just because they are different does not mean they are easy to meet.
The EPA is not my favorite orginization but come on; just about everything you said was WAY off of the truth.
~ Too many freaks & not enough circuses ~
"Life is not tried ~ it is merely survived ~ if you're standing
outside the fire"
|
4x4ord
Canada
Senior Member
Joined: 12/23/2010
View Profile
Offline
|
I believe the EPA ratings for automotive are based on emissions per mile. We just purchased a tractor which meets North American emission standards. It is powered by a European 500 HP Iveco engine and it is getting about 20% better fuel economy than what our 1999 Cummins pre-emission engine got doing the same job. It seems like the Europeans are ahead of North America with their diesel engine and emission technology.
2011 F350 SRW short box 4x4 CC 6.7 PS King Ranch
B&W TurnoverBall and Companion
2003 Citation Supreme 34 RLTS
|
|
|
wilber1
Abbotsford B.C. Canada
Senior Member
Joined: 12/16/2002
View Profile
|
To a large degree, the EPA has concentrated on reducing NOX emissions which means higher CO2 emissions using current technology. Europe has taken the opposite approach.
"Never trust a man who has not a single redeeming vice" WSC
|
NewsW
US
Senior Member
Joined: 02/06/2012
View Profile
|
MM49 wrote: We comply with the same diesel standards as Europe. I think you need to take a look at the new diesels. You really don't know what you are talking about.MM49
Factually false.
Standards are materially different.
For a start, EU standardized on 10ppm sulfur diesel.
North America is on 15ppm diesel.
|
hoopers
Loveland, CO
Senior Member
Joined: 10/26/2002
View Profile
Good Sam RV Club Member
Offline
|
So how come there are so few diesel autos on the road here in the USA?...excluding trucks. What 1 in 20, 1 in 50, 1 in 100 diesel cars per gasoline? Ford sells all sorts of diesel autos in Europe, but NONE here. GM sells (Opel) all sorts of diesel autos in Europe, but none currently I know of.
And why is diesel fuel more expensive than gasoline here?
Diesel is 10% cheaper than gasoline in Europe, just like it used to be here.
Tell me what is different.
And sorry, I would be real weary about buying a new diesel auto with the high pressure fuel pump issues. (I own a 2011 chevy diesel by the way).
I just look at the bottom line and wonder why.
|
Turtle n Peeps
California
Senior Member
Joined: 06/23/2008
View Profile
Offline
|
hoopers wrote:So how come there are so few diesel autos on the road here in the USA?...excluding trucks. What 1 in 20, 1 in 50, 1 in 100 diesel cars per gasoline? Ford sells all sorts of diesel autos in Europe, but NONE here. GM sells (Opel) all sorts of diesel autos in Europe, but none currently I know of.
Several reasons. 1 was because of the 5.7 bomb and the Benz turtles that they made. Both gave diesels a bad name and who wants to get burned again. Another is soccer moms as a gereral rule don't like getting diesel fuel or an oil on their hands and the gas pumps are so much cleaner.
Quote:And why is diesel fuel more expensive than gasoline here?
Diesel is 10% cheaper than gasoline in Europe, just like it used to be here.
It's the way we crack the crude. We have a different way of cracking crude than over there in Europe. We want gasoline so that is how the bulk of the crude we get goes for. Look it up.
Quote:Tell me what is different.
I just did.
Quote:And sorry, I would be real weary about buying a new diesel auto with the high pressure fuel pump issues. (I own a 2011 chevy diesel by the way).
There is VERY few HPFP failures. VERY few.
Quote:I just look at the bottom line and wonder why
Now ya know.
|
hoopers
Loveland, CO
Senior Member
Joined: 10/26/2002
View Profile
Good Sam RV Club Member
Offline
|
Turtle, IMO, the bottom line is dollars. People buy gas autos here because it is cheaper. People buy diesels in Europe more because they are cheaper to use there.
I would just like to see 50-60 mpg diesel cars over here and diesel sold at 10% less cost than gasoline. Diesel fuel is a much more abundant fuel and therefore should be cheaper to use than Gasoline. If it isn't, there is something basically wrong. How much pollution goes into producing gasoline vs diesel? Does the EPA consider the pollution caused by producing one gallon of gasoline vs one gallon of diesel? From the time it leaves the oil field until it reaches your auto.
It is the same poor argument used to justify corn produced bio-fuels. Or hybrid cars that cost so much to buy upfront and the pollution caused to produce and dispose of hybrid batteries. Sometimes the simplest solution overall is the best. I just don't agree with our Govt (EPA) mandating to the free market what is best. That usually ends up with the worst possible outcome.
* This post was
last
edited 07/11/12 03:13pm by hoopers *
View edit history
|
|
|
