RE: 12 volt or 120 volt televisions power draw
Would you please explain how you use a $2000 laptop as a television and how that makes sense for use as a camper TV.
I'm assuming you're trying to inject some patronizing hyperbole, here, but a laptop doesn't have to cost $2,000 (...unless maybe you get it with an apple symbol on it).
We are currently using a couple of five or six hundred dollar PC laptops for multiple uses. Our navigation laptop, by day, doubles as a television, at night, with the help of a cable ready HDTV PCMIA card.
I tend to agree, however, with your notion that television and other complicated trappings of industrialized life are best left at home, in the first place. But for some people, having these technological trappings is what makes it possible for them to be on the road at all. To that end, they legitimately need solutions.
RE: Mouse Urine smell
For fabrics, FEBREZE Antimicrobial Fabric Freshener containing 0.13% of the active ingredient Didecyl Dimethyl Ammonium Chloride.
RE: PC in your TC?
Goes to show how technically savvy I am....I thought the post was about being Politically Correct in you Truck Camper. I try to be PC in most circumstances but in my own TC I thought ....This is intrusive....
Now that I know PC is about a Personal Computer, I'm Ok with it, except I use a Mac and PC most often refers to a a Windows based OS. So, my PC OS in my TC is MAC
There is _nothing_ "politically correct" about having the distraction of laptops and televisions in an RV. It is, and, will always be, ...disgusting! {grin!}
RE: PC in your TC?
Our first camping-PC use was a portable for connecting with family and friends; as well as a resevoir for downloading digital photographs; ...and, as a GPS/mapping device. The most frequent use was as a mapping platform for a portable GPS device that was attached via a cludgy serial connection.
Today, and now that we are RVers, we carry two portable computers. One is mounted up front and used by day for the later generation MICROSOFT USB GPS device (which is very, very good -- far exceeding the power of our old handheld device). At night, we use this portable for internet access and for itinerary updates and weather reports. We also use this unit to power a High Definition television tuner card device top watch cable and over-the-air broadcasts. The other portable is mostly dedicated to handling digital photographs.
....Oh! I almost forgot! We also run the plates of inquisitive truck camper owners that we meet and then we go burgle their houses.
RE: 12 volt Ground Location
NEC Article 551.10(C)(4): (Rereational Vehicles...,Low-voltage systems, ground connections) states...
Ground connections to the chassis or frame shall be made in an accessible location and shall be mechanically secure. Ground connections shall be by means of copper conductors and copper or copper-alloy terminals of the solderless type identified for the size of the wire used. The surface on which the ground terminals make contact shall be cleaned and be free from oxide or paint or shall be electrically connected through the use of cadmium, tin, or zinc- plated internal/external-toothed lock-washer or locking terminals. Ground terminal attaching screws, rivets or bolts, nuts, and lockwashers shall be cadmium, tin, or zinc-plated except rivets shall be permitted to be anoldized aluminum where attaching to aluminum structures.
The chassis-grounding terminal of the battery shall be bonded to the vehicle chassis with a minimum 8 AWG copper conductor. In the event the power lead from the battery exceeds 8 AWG, then the bonding conductor shall be of equal size.
"Chassis" and "vehicle" point to the understandable notion that most RVs have a big vehicle or trailer chassis under them. Of course, most truck campers do not have a large metal framework associated with them.
Due to OUTFITTER's welded aluminum framework (as an example), the manufacturer makes a bond from the 12-volt bus via a wire that is mechanically attached to said framework at the floor. Many truck campers do not allow for this option so I guess the RVIA allows a bond with the next largest metal framework attached to the camper (...which would logically be a tiedown bracket).
Most RV manufacturers use 8 AWG or less to attach the batteries to the 12 volt bus. Note that if you upgrade the current carrying capacity of your battery wires, that the above article also requires a similar upgrade of the grounding strap to the same AWG size.
* * * * *
AT NO TIME... should a 12 volt system and a 120 volt system use common connections. Article 551 goes on to state that even cable runs of 12 volts and 120 volts should be secured and separated by a minimum of 1/2 inch.
Many people assume that 120 volt neutral conductors and ground conductors are _equal_ in potential due to the fact that they are normally bonded at a building's circuit breaker panel (...and hence, that a neutral is not dangerous). You must keep in mind that if you get in series with a charged, 120 volt neutral conductor, that it will kill you just as dead as the "hot" wire.
In a truck camper 120 volt system, the neutral and ground are unbonded until the system is attached to a campground's electrical system (the neutral and ground conductors are separately gathered and _not_ bonded together in the camper's electrical panel). After such a campground distribution connection is made, you see normal responses to testing an outlet in your truck camper (assuming the campground's system is in order).
When you are using a portable generator to power your truck camper's electrical system, you will detect a "bad" ground upon testing. A portable generator used in such a casual fashion will simply not provide the protection that is usually found in a static electrical system. I would recommend that GFCI's be liberally used in RVs. GFCI's will protect you even when a ground is not present. A GFCI works by measuring any difference in the potential of the hot and neutral conductors. These devices are available as both GFCI circuit breakers or discrete devices for installion in an electrical box.
In our little 6.5 foot camper, we have two GFCI zones on our 20 amp outlet circuit; our electric hot water heater appliance circuit is protected; and our refrigerator's 120 volt circuit is protected (mostly because the outlet it is connected to is accessible from outside). Note that Code specifically exempts a refrigerator from being attached to a GFCI device.
RE: Barstow nightmare
$240 plus $70 in tips. The operator spent almost 4 hours with me, and was very kind to guide me out. My ERS will pick up the tow.
Wow. That's nuthin for an off road tow. You made out very well. Not to mention that your "ERS" ( ? ) is picking up the tab. Most insurers for stranding incidents will pretty much not cover anything off pavement.
I've towed off road in every Western state between Mexico and WA. Never run into this. Of course I don't knowingly go into sand unless I see other RVs there safely. This was deceptive ground in that it looks solid, but the solid is only a few inches deep.
Tow-ers and other big rig owners are an interesting lot -- a very wide spectrum of propensity for risk taking. I never know quite how to characterize a campground for big rig owners, for example, because some will balk if there is so much as a tree in sight (might hit the branches) and others happily go where even _I_ fear to tread.
I had a big scare a couple of years ago after fording the Freemont River to go into the northern section of Capital Reef N.P. Every official I talked to parroted that it was a piece of cake. Thing is, they had just gone through a particularly bad monsoon so every established improvement was washed away. It turned out that we were pretty much the first to take the route since the monsoon. The approach was well worn with tire tracks so that lulled me but as I crawled up onto the opposite bank, I saw nothing but a sea of deep virgin sand ! There was a _single_ tire rut -- probably a Park Service 1/4 ton vehicle that had patrolled during the last week. It was really laughable the the way I tried to fill that rut with a full-sized pickup and truck camper. I don't have much visual memory of it because my eyes were fixated on making it to the end of that track ! I didn't want to lose momentum for nuthin !
Really beautiful country and probably okay most of the time for a 2-wheel drive vehicle but it is a long way so I wouldn't want to risk it myself without the extra protection. No way I would try it while towing but I'm sure you wouldn't think it was too bad {grin!}. ...Seriously, it might be possible to tow a sturdy, high clearance tent camper in there.
At least you lived to cheat death again - - right ??? It sounds like you had quite an experience. Experience is good if you live to tell the tale. Your wife sounds pretty special pushing you to go into the jaws of death -- as I understand it was pretty much her preference to take the path less traveled. Most of us labor under the opposite influence {grin!}.
RE: Barstow nightmare
My truck is not... Not 4wd, but I sure wish I had one there. I did not think of airing down. I'm just too heavy to be doing this kind of thing without extreme caution.
Airing down probably wouldn't have helped in this case (since you're 2-wheel drive). In any case, the front wheels dig-in and the back wheels dig a hole. Airing down with four wheel drive (E rated tires down to 40 or 50 pounds) can float you just enough to get out - - sort of like tank treads.
What is kind of funny to me is all the Westerners that have been driving in the back country all their lives and then say, "Oh! Do you think I could have gotten stuck in the sand?!?!"
Some people have all the luck, I guess.
RE: Barstow nightmare
Just think, you didn't have to pay for a campsite.
Humor us though: How much did that tow cost ???
Just so everybody else doesn't get scared away, it should be stressed that you went off into the back country. There is a campground at the Ghost Town and all the approach roads are paved and the parking and campground have improved surfaces.
It never would have occured to me to tow a trailer off road but I have to give you credit: Nothing ventured, nothing gained. But... eventually everyone's number comes up. We once got our 2-wheel drive Ranger badly mired in "fluffy" beach sand. I could push the Ranger, though. With the full sized truck, I decided to go 4-wheel drive for some peace of mind. Still, I just look at the 4-wheel drive as a license to get stuck in more out of the way places {grin!}. I get the shakes whenever I feel the sand grabbing at our tires! Even your robust rig finally succumbed to the demon sand!
RE: 6 ga wire
It just doesn't come in white. If you want to make 6 gauge and larger cable "white" to help you keep track of it, I would recommend getting one of the new (relatively) spray paints (in white) for plastics. Both LOWES and HOME DEPOT sell these paints (test the paint on a small sample before you proceed). It should work fine on what is called "primary" cable coverings used in the automotive environment. I would recommend white over red (assuming your 'hots' are standardized on black). If you want to avoid buying both a black and red roll, you could just spray black cable to create your grounds.
Since RVs tend to be harsh environments for temperature (and whatnot) I would not recommend taping the ends of the cable white with vinyl tape to denote the cable's useage. The glue on vinyl tapes will eventually make it a mess. It would be perfectly acceptable from a procedural standpoint but just messy in the long run.
The first color coded ROMEX cable was created by word of mouth among electricians so that everyone could easily spot 20 amp cable from 15 amp cable. They just sprayed the new rolls of 20 amp - - usually in a bright yellow-green (a yellowish color is now standard from the factory).
RE: Outfitter Manufacturing files Chapter 11 bankruptcy
Outfitter is a great company, with outstanding products.
Good to hear that they are not going anywhere. I don't recall ever reading a post from a dissatisfied Outfitter owner.
The human capacity for complaints knows no limits ! {grin!}
But, OUTFITTER makes a great product for a reasonable price. I still feel guilty for getting such a great camper for such a reasonable price. Satisfaction always greatly exceeded the regret of loss for the money surrendered. I've looked forward to my _next_ OUTFITTER. I always feared that the vagaries of the business cycle would keep that from happening, though.
RE: Outfitter Manufacturing files Chapter 11 bankruptcy
I think the $1M to $10M liability numbers is just a rough range. It could be $1M or it could be $10M, but it is probably somewhere between $1M and $10M.
Since it is a family owned business, who knows what all is wrapped up in the finances? Vehicles, tools, equipment, material, investments, property, homes.......who knows.
Since he went chapter 11, I would assume he is just trying to get some breathing room with his creditors and plans on trying to keep the doors open and ride it out until sales improve.
I'm guessing that the straw that broke the camel's back was the real estate. There was probably a callable commercial loan that secured the plant and, the way the banking industry is going, OUTFITTER became an unwilling pawn. The commercial loan problems in the U.S. are just now coming home to roost.
"Outfitter Manufacturing, Inc. filled for Chapter 11 bankruptcy as a means of protection from our building lender. In the midst of the current recession and lending freeze, we have been unable to come to an agreement with our banks concerning our building. We had a loan for our building that was refinanced. After the refinance took place, there was a dispute over a filing error. The initial deed was filled in the wrong county and the bank refused to acknowledge the error. The bank holding the original loan then refused to let the loan go since we were using this bank as our line of credit as well.
Bingo!
RE: Outfitter Manufacturing files Chapter 11 bankruptcy
Which is why I've said in the past is that someone needs to invest some time into building assembly jigs and an automated wood cutting system so that the labor costs per camper can be kept down.
This is a bit more tricky for an aluminum camper, since robotic welders aren't cheap compared to two high school age guys @ $10/hr assembling by numbers with glue and screw guns.
OUTFITTER jigs were all hand made. Their "robotic welder" was a retired guy who worked cheap and did excellent work. Brian could also do every job in the factory (including "robotic welder").
RE: Outfitter Manufacturing files Chapter 11 bankruptcy
Anyone have an idea of how many campers Outfitter was selling each year?
I would think the number would be pretty low. When we were in Colorado earlier this year for 2 weeks, I kept a rough count on pop-up TC's. We saw a lot of Halmarks (20?), almost as many North Stars (15?), but very few Outfitter campers (2 or 3?).
In their heyday, maybe 250 a year was within their potential. The quality and relative utility of HALLMARKS and OUTFITTERS means that they are on the road for many years. I've seen HALLMARKS that are 19 years old and still maintained in mint condition. More years of production means more campers to be spotted.
OUTFITTER also produced non-recreational units to fill their time. One brake on potential production is that everyone wants to order and take delivery just in time for good weather. OUTFITTER production was always relatively light in Fall and Winter.
RE: When Animals Attack!
What does this have to do with Truck Campers?
Isn't it obvious ?!?!?
===> Truck camper owners are _DANGEROUS_ !!!
If all I had to worry about was the extremely rare wild animal attack, I would have no interest in carrying firearms. As it is, I gotta carry to protect myself from all'a youse guys !!! {grin!}
RE: Shipping TC to Europe?!?
We have friends in Europe (_rich_ friends) that have shipped their Class C sized rigs from Bremerhaven to Baltimore and back. They found this to be the cheapest route and it makes sense from a historic standpoint. However, I would ditto the comments about not wanting to jockey a full-size north American pickup truck around Europe (...and we only have a 6.5 foot camper). It's not impossible but I would find it more of a hassle then a help. If you think about it, if you need a spare part, it will have to be sent from the U.S. and they'll only take gold bars in payment. It's not like you can go out on the street and strip some yokel's F-series or 2500HD for parts - - there ain't no north American pickup trucks in Europe !
There are some important limitations for your RV, anyway. Campsites are in metric there so they don't fit north American RVs. A lot of people don't realize this ahead of time and are really disappointed. Also, don't forget that they have 240 volt hookups there and that they cook with solar ovens instead of propane gas. (...They wish! They cook with butane which freezes at 40F and it's always snowing!, even in July!)
The currency exchange rate is really bad right now, too. A dollar will pretty much buy you a nail and you can only eat so many nails before you literally get fed up. Also, gasoline costs like ten Euros per liter (a liter is about the size of a thimble). Again, because the exchange rate is so bad, don't forget to take a wheelbarrow to carry your U.S. or Canadian dollars around for fuel purchases.
I used to camp in Europe a _lot_. So I can say that you can hardly turn a corner without falling over a campground. The campground density is _much_ greater than in north America. Just get the EUROPA CAMPING + CARAVANING guide or the EEC CAMPINGFUEHRER (I know it sounds positively dictatorial but you need a guide that you can be obedient to) either of which lists over six thousand campgrounds and then go at it. The front of these guides list rules of the road and have little phrase books, too, so you can make small talk with your cell mate if you do something wrong while driving or if you need to say that you or your camper needs a dump in Slovakian (it's the same reflexive verb in both cases).
One problem for casual travelers, though, is that Europeans get about 14 months of vacation every year so they book their campsite a year in advance and pretty much stay in one place the whole time. Obviously as a north American, you are going to want to travel around and see different places. Finding an overnight space without having reservations gets trickier each year.
There really isn't boondocking over there even though people do it all the time. It's called "camping sauvage" in French and "ubersetzen macht frei" in German. If that suggests a tone as to the tolerance it's met with, ...whatsoever, then you probably don't want to risk crossing them. If there is some event where everybody is doing it, like following the Tour de France, or a Lorelei concert tour, you aren't going to get hassled. But don't count on plopping down wherever you feel like - - ain't going to happen - - not a technically legal franchise for an RVer. You can't just hook your water hose up to the town pump.
What probably makes better sense is to rent a car and get like an 8'x 8' cabin sized tent. We used to throw all our own gear in a military duffel bag and fly it over but with all the security hassles that the TSA are meting out now, you are probably better off arranging to pick up some shelter over there. I mean, if they won't let you board with a plastic bottle of Evian in your hand, why would they board your 'military' issue bag that is loaded with metal rods ???
A more expensive option than tenting is to rent a camper there. If you can stay long enough (like a month or more) it is better to purchase with a guaranteed buy-back. In my mind, the ideal camper is like a VW camping bus (with pop-top roof). It is roomy but it has pretty good visibility for driving in tight little towns and villages and you can park it pretty much anywhere you can park a rental car (when you want to get out and poke the natives). If you can get one with a small diesel engine, you can use "gazol" instead of "essence" and this will cut your cost per thimble-full nearly in half. The password at Volkswagon is "Fahrvergnugen". That's German for, "bring stacks of cash".
If you can make your camping trip to Europe work out somehow, I think you will find that it is the most rewarding thing you've ever done in your life. It will feel better than sex. I can guarantee it (...I married one). Just keep the control of those costs in mind. Better yet, contact Suze Orman first to see if she thinks you can afford it. I'm gonna guess she'll profer a ....N-o-o-o-o-o-o.
RE: Rubber roof on Outfitter?
I did do vaguely remember hearing a story... It happened a long time ago... It was either while OUTFITTER was in its startup period or some testing that went on years ago at HALLMARK but the way I remember it was that they did some testing with a latex prophylactic roof. The testing was a bit inconclusive, though. I remember hearing that one of the side effects was that you craved a cigarette
whenever you got in the camper but... it had a perfect record as far as preventing pregnancies is concerned.
RE: Rubber roof on Outfitter?
On the other hand, if you intend to drive along with the camper and truck inverted, I think that's probably gonna leave a mark on that roof.
I've been inverted with no marks left on the roof. Of course I had my shields up (a little known, but rather pricey Outfitter option). :B
Okay but I'm pretty sure they don't say anything like, "designed for offroad". You gotta be on a paved road when you hit that "raise shields" button. (I'm pretty sure about that.)
Now, I don't wanna talk outta turn here but when we told OUTFITTER that we took out a Park Service log cabin with our Caribou, they didn't say anything about _that_ being _wrong_. If you dig around in the fine boilerplate, you _might_ find something like "designed for knocking down log cabins".
I mean... come on ! What are the chances that you hit a building made out of twelve inch logs so that all the Rangers come running out, screaming like little girls, and the only bad thing that happens to the camper is that the air conditioner shroud gets a little cracked ?!?! Okay, the camper got pushed out of the bed six inches but the tiedowns held ! But accidents like that just don't happen. Outcomes like this are only by _design_.
RE: Rubber roof on Outfitter?
TPO vs Carbon Fiber offroad...this is a none issue in my opinoin. We have scraped several trees offroad with our TPO roof and never had a problem...very tough material. Quik repair could be accomplished even if it was a problem...:R
Just some background: The CEO of OUTFITTER asked around the OUTFITTER universe to see if people would be willing to hand over a considerable peice of change to have a carbon fiber roof. The bottom line was that there just wasn't enough interest to go ahead and develop it. Most people that were pro-carbon roof were quite content to let HALLMARK go ahead and perfect it (do the 'light' lifting, so to speak).
I'm pro carbon fiber because of its potential strength and light-weight characateristics but you have to figure out how to lay it so that it ends up being a strong unit -- you can't just chuck it on the ground and squirt some Elmers on it -- it takes planning and testing. So while I'm long-term pro carbon fiber, I don't see any need to rush into such a high margin item whilly-nilly.
If HALLMARK buyers want to buy into that experiment right away, (and I'm _not_ trying to be rude, here) I think everybody else is okay with them being the proverbial guinea pigs. I think there is considerable risk to being a first adopter, here, but I predict it will eventually be a must-have feature. I hope things do go well right off the bat, despite the risks, because it would be a shame if the initial designs turned out to be really bad and it turned everybody off the idea {shrug}.
RE: Rubber roof on Outfitter?
Seeing threads where folks take their Outfitters I assumed it was designed for off road.
Okay... no harm, no foul.
They're just tough -- not bullet proof. (See my recent post where I describe taking on a National Park Service log building with our Caribou 6.5).
If you want to take out a log building, the OUTFITTER is your camper. On the other hand, if you intend to drive along with the camper and truck inverted, I think that's probably gonna leave a mark on that roof.
...Just my opinion...
Three OUTFITTERs spotted on the hoof !!!
We have had our OUTFITTER since May 2006 and had been looking closely at campers in the field since the Summer of 2005. In all that time until this August, we have never, to my knowledge, laid eyes on another OUTFITTER camper off of the company parking lot.
This August proved to be a hat-trick !!! A critical mass has been reached !
First, we spotted the Caribou of an RV.net member in Yellowstone N.P. near Fishing Bridge. We talk to the owner; secret handshakes were exchanged; commorretive photos made; and speeches extolled.
Second, we spotted an Apex 8 in a parking lot of the Welcome Center in Cheyenne, Wyoming.
Finally, we spotted an Apex 8 coming in the opposite direction on US 191 in Montana.
We saw record number of truck campers this year. I stopped counting after four days when I had reached a total of 25 hard sides and popups spotted.
