Having driven them both at elevations over 10,000 feet, I see no difference from almost sea level (600-700 feet) when not towing. The fuel injection, computer control, and variable cam timing on todays modern cars takes care of the previous AFR altitude problem inherent with carbureted engines. The turbocharging (NOT supercharging, big difference) is just the icing on the cake. If I was buying a Flex, I'd opt for the Ecoboost if you're going to tow often.
What? :h :S
OP, you don't have to worry about the AFR. You have to worry about the lack of O2 at 10,000. You will lose about 3% of power/1000' of altitude because of that fact.
BTW a turbocharger is a supercharger. A turbo just describes on how the compressor is connected to the engine to power it.
And a Bastard is a child whose parents are unmarried, but that's not how the term is used these days. If you point at a Turbo, and call it a supercharger you'll get a lot of snickers and fingerpointing from car guys, even if it's technically accurate.
There are two F150 plants. DTP went down last week for approximately 4 weeks. Supposed to be back to work Sept. 22. Will slowly start backup building the 2015's. KCAP will go down for retooling in conjunction with Christmas break for 2-3 weeks. In the mean time we will continue to build 2014's while DTP builds 2015's!! Crazy huh!!
Well that's not what is being reported, I have read that they (2015) won't begin to show up until sometime in February. So the Detroit Truck Plant will be back on line building the new 2015 aluminum trucks September 22? Well I can tell you for sure there are no 2015's on any dealers lot. We are just now building our pre-production models. These are not for sale. Just gonna be crashed, tested, etc.
Note I said Wrong there will be NO F-150 2015 trucks built except the new aluminum truck and that will not come out until February 2015 at the earliest. If Ford has two F-150 plants, they should have taken one down this summer and changed it over I was under the impression that Ford was halting the steel bodied trucks in Sept. but it looks like the Kansas City facility will continue to build them through the end of the year?
I don't understand why the DTP was not taken down in June so they could launch the truck in September? Who is going to buy a old steel bodied truck?
Fleets, people who don't care, people who can't wait for the 2015's.
Sometimes, we auto enthusiasts forget that more than half of the driving population probably can't tell you what engine they have under the hood, or how many gears their tranny has. They might be able to tell you that the audio system is rockin' however.
I have yet to run into someone when the subject came up about the new f-150's that was aware they would be aluminum bodied. In general, people just don't care.
I probably wouldn't trust a smart car as far as I could push it. Which, I dunno, might be farther than I think!
I too would like to hear the story behind that comment. We have had 5 smart cars, both gas and diesel, for the office. They've been driven (collectively) a lot of miles with no problems of any kind.
In fact of all the people I know of thay have had a smart car, one person was unhappy with it, but they were the type of person who could break an anvil with a rubber hammer. They merely beat the car to death.
They are cool little cars, but not for me because:
MPG not very impressive considering size. Geo Metro's from the mid 90's could hit 40MPG no sweat.
Cost too much for what you get.
No standard trans available.
A Ford Fiesta with the 1 liter 3 banger turbo can be had for less than 17 grand and should be far more engaging to drive with the stick and 120hp.
I would like to get your opinions on my TV and setup.
I have a Palomino 18frb TT with a dry weight of 3306# and GVWR of 4750#.
I never tow with full tanks (except Propane, 1 tank). I have a tongue weight rating of 410 #. My TV is a 2005 Ford Sport Trac, 4.0 V6 automatic. I have a tow pkg class 3 with tranny cooler. I always tow with overdrive OFF. The Sport Trac has 125" wheel base which is about 12" more than an Explorer. It is just Me, my Wife, and a 7# Yorkie in the TV. I load one Ice chest (aprox 30#) and a 15# gas grill in the covered bed of the truck. I use a 600# WDH and friction sway bar.
This setup seems to work fine to me as far as towing power and stopping has not been a problem, including a quick stop to avoid hitting a deer last trip. But I have read so much on this site about the right size TV and safety and over taxing your TV, that I began to have concerns.
I would really appreciate your input good, bad, or other, on my setup.
Has anyone else towed with a Sport Trac?
If it's working well for you, in your circumstances, I wouldn't worry about it. You have a longer wheel base than I, and a slightly lighter trailer, even though I've got the V8. Unless you're just looking for a reason to pick up a new 1 ton diesel with 8 million ft. lbs. of torque....and in that case, yep, you need a diesel!
Here's your sign.... anytime you want to see work get done, with heavy loads... ships, freighliners, trains, whatever, where there is heavy weight involved, invariably, the drive plant chosen is a turbo diesel. End of subject matter. It's never a race, when work needs to be done, it's what kind of power your motor makes under the peak curve that matters, and how far away you can stay from being at the peak curve while doing the required work, leaving a margin of safety for the longevity of the motor.
Actually, in many of your examples, the drive plant chosen is actually electric. Trains for example, electric motors, that might be powered by diesel gen sets. Cruise ships are powered in the same manor.
It's also worth mentioning that nearly everywhere, engines are rated by hp. Certainly in the oil field engine skids are never measured by the torque output, always hp. Same goes for those motors on the cruise ships.
what I like about this is that it brings attention to the fact that you have to look at the big picture. Only focusing on one aspect (MPG or service costs) will give you a skewed view when comparing two trucks.
From what we've seen so far the ED is getting impressive fuel economy, but depressing service costs.
As far as the light they speak of that is on back order, is that a left over part from the days of Chrysler's super cheap interiors?
awesome upgrade, both the TT and Ford look like they are in showroom condition.
Do keep in mind you can't drive or park the 350 like you could the Tahoe, I'd hate to see those hips all banged up on such a clean truck!
I saw a 2015 F150 this morning. It was Crew Cab King Ranch.
Ironically, it did not look much different than a 2014 except for the taillights. Of course, it was not real light out this morning when I was next to it.
Your night vision might be going. I'm not saying they aren't related, but I wouldn't mistake one for the other with one eye closed and half asleep.. There isn't a single panel on the truck that hasn't changed, except for perhaps the roof??
The EB downhill mileage makes ZERO sense. The fuel cuts off when coasting, and the mileage should have been well into the 30's. Something doesn't add up there. I'm not suggesting it will match the mileage of any truck with 240hp,& a superior transmission; I'm merely pointing out that the numbers make no sense. (over 100 000miles of experience with all manner of late model F150's speaking here).
Not much of a comparison, as the was NO control at all of the many variables.I don't know about you, but there is no coasting downhill when I tow. If I let off the throttle, I am slowing down.
If that is the case, why are exhaust brakes on diesels so popular? And why is the Ecoboost faulted for not having enough engine braking when coming down from altitude?
I remember the article motortrend did on all 4 F-150 engines in 2011. The one they were most surprised by was the 3.7 V6.
All base model engines are leaps and bounds beyond what they were just a few short years ago.
Thanks for all the responses.
Yes, I noticed I'm going to have to change trim levels in order to get both the HD Payload and Max towing as Brulaz said. I was online and was unable to build the truck I wanted unless I upped the truck to a Lariat which kind of sucks. I also wanted the 5.5 box not the 6.5 but I suppose those are sacrifices.
According to the brochure the Max Towing, HD Payload with 6.5 box Super Crew has 2310 lbs of payload and 8200 GVWR and 11,300 lb tow rating.
What size and type of trailer are you towing.
I wouldn't mind hearing what everyone is towing behind their Eco Boost. Size, weights etc so I can see how your comments relate to my proposed setup.
That's the XL model that will get you a 2310 payload. XLT will have less, Lariat will have even less, etc. etc.
Sounds like when I shop for the next tow vehicle alls a guy needs to look for is HP number.
With all other things being equal, yep, I'd pick the higher HP number. That or the Blue one, I have a thing for blue these days. :B
Re: 2015 F!50s: On July 28, FOMO used a tired marketing trick. The company told news media that dealers could now order the new 2015 F150s (wink,wink). In reality, a guy cannot order the truck he wants because capacities and specifications for the new trucks are mostly nonexistent. And they won't be existent for — who knows? Ford did the same thing with the 2015 Mustang: sent out bogus dealer guides (wink, wink) and much later sent out the real guides. So, the best thing to do is wait weeks or months for a new half-ton, or do the honorable thing and buy a Silverado or a Ram.
Ford doesn't want to show it's hand 4 months before the first truck can even be sold. Big whoop. The first 2015 F-150 isn't scheduled to roll off the line until October 20th, and that's if there aren't any delays. It's kinda sad hearing a grown man whine....
Strange. My dealer has 2 new 2015 F150s on the lot, a white one and a red one.
No he doesn't. The only 2015 F-150's that exist today are pre production models that were mostly hand assembled. They are not for sale. The first factory producing 2015 models won't start production till October of this year.
Well, after a lot of debate and advice I decided to stay with my current TV and see how it would do.
My TV: 2007 Silverado 1500, Quad Cab Short bed.
Engine: 5.3 V8
Trans: 4 speed auto with overdrive
Diff Ratio: 3.23
Tow Package: Stock with auxiliary trans cooler.
My TT: 2005 Kodiak 19FL
UVW: 3780 pounds
LVW: 5000 pounds (estimated loaded vehicle weight).
Okay. Today I took my rig for a test run. I have a bluetooth OBD2 scanner and the Torque app to monitor my transmission temp with. It was 100 degrees here and the trailer is weighing around 4000 pounds (still dry with only some clothes and stuff in it). I made it only 7 mile on flat ground before my trans mission temp hit 200 degrees. I drove 300 miles yesterday in my truck, unloaded without the trailer, and my transmission temp never got over 167 degrees and it was just as hot yesterday as it is today.
I was think about adding a an additional trans cooler but I don't know if it would just be better to get a lager TV. Advice?
I'm a bit surprised as well. My current setup has towed about 10K miles, and my TT is similar to yours. I don't know what the temps hit, but since it came from the factory with the upgraded tow package, I don't worry about it. Ford must have done OK building it because it hasn't blown up on me yet. (knock on wood).
You should try towing with one. I just got back from a 6000 mile trip towing 5000 pounds, and it (3.5ltr) was never close to its "limits". It was a relaxed tow, even up the Ike gauntlet and several other passes. I think opinions would start changing if they came from people that have used them.
That's actually a situation where I suggest it's a good option. You are well below the max tow rating and the turbo will mitigate most of the altitude related power loss.
My concern is as the engine ages and the cooling system is no longer operating at peak performance and other things start to wear, will it hold up as well as a larger engine that isn't stressed as much.
The first 3.5 ecoboost engines produced went into cars back in mid 2009 (2010 Lincoln MKS and MKT, Ford Flex and Taurus SHO). The engine is built stronger for F-150 duty, but if you are looking for 10 years of proven performance, you still have a few more years to wait on the sidelines.
I have no idea why people live in California.
The beaches aren't that good, the traffic sucks, and the taxes on everything are through the roof.
Now they will fine you $500 if you wash your car or water your lawn.
The California beaches are much better than the ones in Missouri.... that's right there are none in Missouri.
Yes, we have a drought but overall our weather cannot be beat. No tornados, no hurricanes, no yearly flood of the Missouri or Mississippi River. Just occasional earthquakes. We were in Houston last week and is was 90+ degrees with 80% humidity at 11pm. Air was so thick it was tough for me to breath. Guess I'm just used to smog.
Traffic is bad in the big cities, but tolerable in other parts of the state.
I have no intentions of leaving. I'll keep the beaches, Yosemite, the Redwoods, Sequoia National Park, Eastern Sierra's and San Francisco.
What day were you in Houston? A couple days last week we had highs in the low 80's, and low 70's at night. And this is August!!
Dallas/Fort Worth was beautiful last week as well, overall we've had a very mild summer, with plenty of rain.
To OP's post, I can't believe it's 500 bucks annually. That would raise my temp more than Houston weather ever could.