I am powering a battery/whole TT inverter system with one Honda EU2000. In no particular pattern I can detect, the inverter causes the Honda to trip out on overload for a split second, which causes the inverter charger to trip. The Honda returns to normal after a brief (less than 1/2 second) reset, but the charging section won't engage because it thinks the Honda is wimping out. Sometimes, the pair link up and work perfectly. Other times, they will do the strike/overload- refusal-to-engage for up to 10 minutes before they finally decide to hook up. This can't be good for the mode relay. With my old non-inverter Generac, the problem evaporates. The charger is doing something the Honda doesn't like.
It actually seems to be worse with light loads. I have banged my head on the wall with cheesy scope, meter, Hz counter, etc. for weeks now. My last remaining theory is that the charger is not power corrected and hits the Honda with a skewed load. The Honda sees the apparent power, plus the real load and trips. The Generac doesn't trip because it doesn't have the fast electronics of the Honda. BTW, everything works perfectly on wall power. Any of you BSEE types know how to slide the power factor back closer to 1:1 on the EU2000? Nearly everything in an RV tugs at the power factor. One site recommended a resitive load like several hundred watts of light bulbs, but this is not practical when dealing with limited power. I found another place that suggested putting a 270 volt 50uf motor run capacitor across the generator hot - neutral. Wadda ya think? Also, if I decide to sometime add a second EU2000, would it be better to have a cap at the output of each generator or just one after they are paralleled? Thanx!
The Honda EU2000I is an inverter generator, does it have true sine wave output? If it doesn't the modified sine waye may not be compatable with your inverter. Are you really using a converter?
Your inverterr/charger's charger may be power factor corrected so that may not be it anyway.
Your whole rig is on the inverter supplied from the Honda 2000 (1,800 VA?)including the charger part of the inverter. A 40amp charge wants 700w VA from the gen. Don't know your numbers, but eg, if the charger is doing 40amps that would leave maybe 1,100VA for other 110v items in the rig that the inverter can pass through.
At 80amps charging, you would only have maybe 400VA left for other 110v items.
Perhaps you are just running out of VA with what is on. This would also account for your variations in just when it all trips on different occasions depending on what you have on at the time?
When it does trip out and resets, the charger part is not on anymore from what you said, so the Honda can now handle the remaining 110v load the inverter is passing through.
"The Honda EU2000I is an inverter generator, does it have true sine wave output? If it doesn't the modified sine waye may not be compatable with your inverter. Are you really using a converter?"
Did I boo-boo and say "converter" somewhere? I just read my post again and don't see it. But, I've been known to mistakenly type the wrong one. I do use a converter to charge the twin Trojans that live in the TT. The bank of AGMs in the truck bed are charged by the charging section of the inverter.
The Honda EU2000 puts out a cleaner sine wave than my household current. But, thanks for the idea. I'll look at anything at this point. The inverter/charger manf. has been of no real help. They are tired of hearing from me. :-)
BFL13: The part that is puzzling is that it behaves the same way with all loads turned off or even the TT unplugged. This has led me to conclude that it is not caused by what we would normally call an "overload." I have it limited to 50 amps charging right now and the inverter limits AC input power to whatever I set. I have turned down the limit to 5 amps AC and 20 amps of charging and the Honda still trips. Those limits are considerably less than the 1,600 watts of continuous power available from the EU2000. I've even tried paralleling the EU2000 with another one for 3,200 watts of continuous power. The only difference is that the charger trips two generators instead of one.
* This post was
edited 07/01/09 11:24am by rolnrolnroln *
The solution is probably simpler that PFC. I don't know what kind of IC you're running. I assume you're running the Honda in Eco mode.
I have 2 Honda 2ks and a Prosine 2.0 IC. I experience the same issue as you if I have an IC parameter called "AC breaker size" set too high. For example, if it's set to 30 amp (the IC expects 30a service), and I'm plugged into just 1 generator, the gen will rev up and die if the IC's charger asks too much of it because the batteries are needing a big charge.
Is the inverter inverting when you plug into the Honda or do you plug in first and then turn on the inverter? Does econo throttle off help at all? Can you turn the charging amps down a bit? Have you have tested this with all 120v breakers turned off so it is just the Honda & inverter in the loop?
Seems like the trouble is high inrush current but I am no expert.
2Oldman: Check my post above to BFL13. Even with the inverter/charger limits set very low, the Honda still trips. I am using a Victron. My generators don't get a chance to rev up and die. They trip out as soon as the inverter tries to switch to charger. We're talking fractions of a second here. You have to be looking at the OL light on the generator or you'll miss it. I chased this problem for weeks before I noticed the OL lights coming on. Then the gens just putt along at idle until the next time the inverter calls for charging.
BTW, I've tried a single Honda, twin Hondas and running them at full speed off "eco". No difference. As I mentioned, my tired old Generac 3500XL works great, but zowie, it sure is loud after a few years of Honda.
"Is the inverter inverting when you plug into the Honda or do you plug in first and then turn on the inverter? Does econo throttle off help at all? Can you turn the charging amps down a bit? Have you have tested this with all 120v breakers turned off so it is just the Honda & inverter in the loop?"
Seems like the trouble is high inrush current but I am no expert.
I never really thought about your first question. As much as I've played with this thing, I'm sure it has been both ways when I turn on the generator.
I've turned the charging amps down to 20 amps, no effect. I don't bother to go lower because 20 amps is not a useful amount of charge for my setup. If I can't get it to work up around 50 amps, I'm gonna need to come up with some alternatives. The inverter has a setting to account for high inrush current but setting that did not change anything. I think it sounds like high current too, but it doesn't seem to test out.
I have tested with all AC in the TT off and also with the TT unplugged.
Ok, your inverter/charger is wired to the AGMs in the truck and so its charger section does them with the Honda supplying the inverter. It is optional to plug the trailer shore power into the inverter or the Honda. (?)
It happens with the TT not plugged into either, so we are down to the truck AGMs, the Victron, and the Honda. Your inverter/charger settings should limit the draw on the Honda to below is rating.
Is there something wrong with the wiring, plugs, and connections that adds to the draw that is not contolled by the inverter settings?
Is there something happening with the Victron's ability to "boost" power to make up for a shortfall in the gen's supply? (real vague on that business--somebody was talking about that here a while ago to get his air conditioner started before it settled down to run)
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