I got an answer to my E-mail to Johnson Controls....... So I didn't get an answer that meant anything.
This is what I expected. No company is going to say go ahead, and risk having it in writing if something were to go wrong. Expecting a yes answer was unrealistic, and that customer service on a giant conglomerate would actually know something about their product is unwise.
Mex once informed me that a sealed calcium flooded battery, when unintentionally deeply cycled required absorption voltage at 15 volts to have any hope of longevity after an unintended deep discharge
I'd noticed such a battery also tapered to nearly 0 amps when fully charged at absorption voltage, where a regular flooded battery would still accept 0.7 to 1 amp to be held at that voltage after Specific gravity maxed out.
The deeply cycled maintenance free battery I recharged after the BMW's alternator went out, is still going 2+ years later, and has been drained to jump start levels twice since that I know of.
I Did not recharge it after the jumpstarts, the owner did put his 6amp schumacher on it overnight. Time will tell Takes a while in mild temperatures for capacity to decline to the point it can't start a fuel injected engine.
I'll certainly never buy a sealed flooded maintenance free battery.
My last wally world 27 at 7 years of age,which was relegated to engine starting duty at year 2, could start the engine fine when fully charged, but take 5 AH from it and Click click click.
I'd not fear EQing the calcium maintenance free battery. If capacity has declined to the point when it is noticeable, the battery is likely near a goner anyway.
I'd certainly not think a 2 amp 'trickle' charger left on it is going to do anything meaningful in terms or restoring lost capacity. now if one were able to bring it to, and hold it at 15 volts at 5 amps per 100Ah of capacity, then perhaps, but not a set it and forget it plug in charger.
The word 'Trickle' seems to have positive connotations for some. I see the word trickle and I think about a enlarged prostate and diseased sexual organ, and am mystified at the love of the word trickle even pertaining to batteries.
'Automatic' and 'trickle' is a double negative whammy.
In the past, I have taken precisely 45Ah from my 90AH battery at an average amp rate double that of The 4.5 amps it achieved a 90Ah rating, at temps cooler than 77f.
Voltage rebounded, and will still rebound, at 400+ deep cycles, above 12.2v, and My battery manufacturer says 50% rested voltage is 12.11v.
I figure the 50% discharge test and then seeing if resting voltage is 50% according to manufacturer, is not accurate.
If it is, My AGM battery is more like 115AH capacity instead of the 90AH rating the manufacturer claims. Deliberately underrated? I think not.
One guy on a marine forum, tests used batteries for those going blue water sailing who need to know if they have to replace their bank before leaving. He has a water bath to keep the batteries at precisely 77f, and a constant programmable load which will stay the same as battery voltage drops.
He claims to draw the batteries to 80% DOD twice, then recharge fully, then equalize or condition charge them, then runs the 20 hour test at the precisely the 20 hour amp rate. Sometimes he runs it twice and after the full discharge to 0 and the full recharge and another EQ the capacity increases.
Progressive dynamics marketers should be smacked around a little bit for the temerity of calling their 15 minute bump to 14.4v from 13.2 every 16 hours destratification stage, equalization. How many has this BS marketing term confused?
Trojan ad Rolls Surrette recommended EQ voltage is 16.2v
I found that anything shy of 16v was a waste of time on one particular battery, 15.5v would not even be able to max out SG in 6 hours, but 16 could in under 2 hours.
Ignorance is such bliss.
While not learning anything, i was happy that the schumacher would seek and hold a respectable absorption voltage for almost not quite long enough on the AGM setting to actually get the battery close to full charge. It floats at 13.6, so eventually....
Now I had to go and experiment with wattmeters and ferrites and found all is not just a 'super groovy just fine'.
I wish I had the time and gumption to get the ferrite to not buzz.
But the battery charges. it is simply the one wattmeter does not like it. I have another one which does not care.
The problem only became apparent when I tried to get the unhappy wattmeter to be happy.
But is it really a problem?
So say I have various cheapowatt recycled capacitors I was willing to put on the output terminals to see if I could eliminate the ferrite buzz, and perhaps get screwy wattmeter to not jump around whack a doodle like. How do I go about finding which capacitor leads go on the + or -?
I get that new capacitors are cheap, but, I am not buying anything I do not absolutely need to at this point, and this does not even come close to that threshold.
It sounded like the noise was coming from the inside Schumacher, but I could feel the buzzing in my fingers as I closed the snap on ferrite.
I have the powerpole only 5 inches from the schumacher and the ferrite within that space so it is not so easy to tell exactly where the noise was coming from.
The buzzing it too loud to deal with. It is easily heard over a computer fan rated at 37dba
Snowman9000, thanks for the report on the Turnigy. I was very bummed that on a regular load the Windynation 8awg Wattmeter readings were so far adrift from the other wattmeters and my battery monitor.
It also froze up a couple times.
Wonder if any of the cheapowatt's capacitors could be recycled.
The outputs on the circuit board are basically male quick connects.
When I added 10AWG all I had to do was get new female quick connects and crimp/solder 10AWg to them and slide them over the output terminals.
The only real 'issue' is the Windynation wattmeter itself simply does not like the schumacher. I have a regular GTpower wattmeter that I modified with 8awg, and it has no issues reading correctly when put between Schumacher and battery.
As the WN wattmeter's AH and KWH readings are half of what they should be, although amps and voltage are fairly accurate, I figure it is just a POS, and was good enough for the POS Schumacher on a battery that should have shorted a cell a year ago.
I was just stunned that the ferrite on the outside of a single wire caused such a loud buzz.
The Schumacher keeps me from lugging the Screwy31 to the meanwell or the meanwell to the screwy 31, so I hope the POS holds on.
Are the ferrites supposed to go over both wires and not just one?
The schumacher had, and I returned, A non snap on Ferrite on the output leads 3 inches from circuit board.
The larger ferrites on the both wattmeters leads did not cause any noise and are only 6 inches away from the one that causes the buzzing clamped over only one wire.
I replaced the original 12awg with 10awg to the circuit board, and use 45 amp anderson powerpoles. I did the 10 AWG mod hoping it would keep it from going to 16.4v and perhaps the display would read closer to actual voltage.
Neither improved, and now display does not say anything but 18.8 all the time. Kind of need some deisplay on the output to see if I pressed the right buttons for AGM and for 2 12 or 25 amps.
Hoping to start a discussion, not solve any issue here.
I have a "watt's up" wattmeter clone from Windy Nation. This came with 8awg leads instead of the usual 12awg.
I'd found its AH and KWH figures were straight from bizzarro world when tested against other meters, and gave up on it. But it is still useful for voltage and wattage, So I put it in between the Screwy31 and the schumacher Sc2500a "intelli" charger whose display is now toast, but other wise operates as it did new.
So this wattmeter on the schumacher, the voltage and amperage readings just bounce around. At 2 amps it will bounce from 0.07 to 8.82 amps and voltage will bounce +/- 0.5 volts. Another wattmeter inline is nice and steady.
When placed between battery and load this wattmeter reads amps volts fairly accurately, but in between schumacher and battery and it goes battcrap crazy.
So I have some Snap on Ferrite cores that fit over both 8awg leads together, and after doing so, the battcrap crazy level of 10, falls to a level 7.
Eyebrow raised, but Eh, shoulder shrug. Screwy31 is charging. Voltage with Schumacher unplugged from 120vAC still accurate.
Today, I found another snap on ferrite core, slightly smaller inner diameter. I thought perhaps more ferrites would perhaps help soothe the battcrap crazy wattmeter. It would not fit over both 8 awg wattmeter wires, or both 10AWG wires coming out of Schumacher. So I go snap it over one 10awg Schumacher output wire.
And as soon as the two halves get close to each other the schumacher starts buzzing loudly, Surprisingly loud. Open core back up and noise attenuates. I can modulate the volume of the buzzing just by how closed the snap on ferrite is over either + or - output wire.
Sounds like 60Hz.
It seems like I can actually feel the ferrite vibrating in my fingers.
What The pluck is going on?
Getting Lead acid batteries to 100% charged is always going to take time, even at 14.8v. No getting around this.
When the charging source says "No more 14.8v for you" and rolls back voltage to some lawyerly approved level, is where many of us draw a line.
With 4 gc-2, and if you generator can handle it, i would recommend a 100 amp powermax, the adjustable voltage version, which will seek and hold your chosen voltage for as long as you decide to run the generator.
While not shown, they do offer a 100 and 120 amp version of the adjustable voltage models. Make sure you make it clear you will want the adjustable voltage model and you will Be testing output amperage into a massive bank of depleted batteries and will throw a hissy fit if it does not make the listed amperage.
Do note they are not automatic.
If one still wants some level of autonomy then the PD- 14.8v series can be functional too, but not upto 100 or 120 amps.
I use a 40 amp adjustable voltage Meanwell powersupply with external potentiometer and additional heat removal added, and my sinble group 27 agm battery does get to a true 100% in basically as little time as possible, whenever I run it.
I use the stuff sold at the auto parts store.
I did too. Once.
Here are the rusted steel ring terminals sticking to some magnets.
Autoparts cable is also SAE gauge. SAE wire sizes are 6%–12% smaller than AWG, and carry proportionally less current.
I am on my 3rd or 4th 25$ 9 cell 'high capacity' laptop battery from Amazon.
When they are near useless i have been harvesting the cells, discarding the 1 or 2 which can't maintain voltage overnight, and using them in a flashlight.
The last battery pack, all the cells hold 4.2 volts for weeks, but they are essentially useless as they have so little capacity and cannot support any significant load.
I am back to cycling my panasonic NCR 18650b instead as that Way, I don't waste time swapping out batteries, and have the full brightness levels accessible.
My current laptop battery is about 4 months old and can last about 50 minutes and I am already getting the weak battery shop now for replacement messages.
I like to tinker but I would not attempt replacing the cells myself, not without a spotwelder for the tabs, and likely not even then.
If I could get a battery pack with 9 3400 mah panasonic cells i bet it would last for 5 hours.
I was having fun today with my newly installed Bayite hall effect ammeter hooked over my alternator output cable after I disconnected the OEM parallel charge circuit.
Seems my current lifetime warranty reman'd Chrysler 50/120 alternator can go as high as 56 amps at 550 engine rpm at 14.4v when casing is 129.4 degreesF.
Previous Reman seemed to top out at ~40amps.
My battery was not very depleted accepting only 9 amps at 14.4, so that 56 amps consisted of most of my drivers seat accessible loads like all my lights and blower motor on high. 8 to 11 amps are required just to run fuel pump and ignition, ect
I suspect I will move HES to a different cable once I am bored of seeing total alternator output and want to see only amps into, or out of battery
The newly installed VR 60mm fan keeps VR below 92f. Only rises above that after engine shutdown.
I ran A terminal to alternator (+) stud instead of directly to battery(+). And this main alternator cable is Imperfect from the days when my crimper consisted of a hammer and a screwdriver.
Hard to say about fan's effect on voltage sag at idle as of yet. I suspect the temperature of the copper is the biggest cause of the voltage sag at idle. I will improve this cable in the future.
When first driving the voltage was rock steady, but as the alternator crept upwards in temp the voltage sag began at slow speeds.
I figured the VR was not getting hot enough to damage it as it is designed to be underhood.
I have noticed my voltage sag at hot idle on warmer days is more pronounced than when I first hooked everything up, and also 'seems' worse when the dashboard has been baking in the sun (the VR lies just below)
I'd also had it resting up against the firewall with little room for convection currents. WestEnd sent me a bunch of fans with the heatsinks and it was very simple to attach one to the heatsink so I figured i will try it. Flipping it over so the fan is unrestricted should also help keep it cooler. I'll see if there is an improvement in voltage sag at hot idle today. not sure the fan can be heard over the engine but I might put a Noctua low noise adapter 9 resistor) inline to slow it down if so.
Part of me wants to make a shroud so this fan pulls in colder air from outside the dashboard.
The turns counter on the potentiometer, is basically being ignored as it is not repeatable depending on the load. If the battery is full, 7.2 will have the battery shoot to 14.8v, where that setting the night before had the battery at 14.3. I don;t mind a pot twiddling but it would be nice if the turns counter did more accurately reflect target voltage on both a full and depleted battery.
I've almost got the Bayite hall effect ammeter fully functional to read total alternator current. My ring terminals just barely fit through its opening.
I still want to upgrade my alternator/ battery feed cable from the doubled 6awg to 1awg, but the doubled 6 seems to be able to get the group27 to absorption voltage nearly instantly if the rpms and 70+ amps are there.
A couple times at Idle, with a depleted battery, I noticed my voltage regulator was getting hotter faster than my alternator casing was, from a cold start.
Last time at ~ 52 amps into battery at 550 rpm, it got upto 125.4F at Idle. That is as hot as I've seen it.
The thermocouple is epoxied to the additional heatsink I epoxied to the underside of the Transpo 540hd.
I do not have the VR under hood, but under dashboard, and ventilation is obstructed.
Enter 60 MM fan.
Might be overkill.
Perhaps presenting a good better best approach for differing skill/ comfort levels.
Pulling the circuit board from the casing might be a deal breaker for some, and a one time setting unloaded voltage on original trimpot to ~ 15v, then adding the intermatic timer on the AC side, would be more than adequate for some.
Mex, what is the lowest voltage a MegaWatt will goto with a 500 OHM potentiometer?
I get that these will mostly be in thee 14.5v range where the losing some bottom end does will not matter, but I'd personally hate to not be able to go as low as the low 13's.
When I replaced the 1K ohm pot( measured at 973 ohms) with a 10 turn pot(1024 ohms) On my Meanwell, my minimum voltage dropped from 13.23 to 13.12v. More resistance = lower voltage, Zero resistance = max voltage.
I think I would lose the lower end of My MeanWell voltage range with a 500 ohm pot, making it useless floating flooded batteries, perhaps even too high for my AGM.
I feel the 10 turns pot 1K ohm is precise enough I can dial in voltage to 0.01v easily enough, and The Meanwell rsp-500-15 has a 6+ volt range of adjustment with a 1K ohm pot.
What is the max voltage of the Megawatt? Trojan now specs 16.2v equalization voltage.
Perhaps those wanting more than 15.5v for flooded battery Equalization, might want a Meanwell rsp-500-15. 40 amps, power factor corrected, and a 13.12 to 19.23 voltage range, but also twice the price of the Megawatt.
Absorption fridges will go the way of the Dodo as solar gets cheaper.
The 12-24v DC compressor fridges are efficient. and can be improved further with more insulation and a proper install, venting condenser heat properly Same with 120vaAC fridges on an inverter.
Propane is for cooking.
Most LED drop ins do not work correctly replacing a halogen bulb. Especially those with dimpled reflectors behind a smooth lens.
But that will never stop anyone.
The electronic flasher is not a cure all. I have basic reflectors and tried LEDS on all four dual filament 1157s. 2 1157s works fine, All 4 and no workee Starts acting extremely wacky..
Front Amber LEDS were Obscenely bright and dangerous. When back to Incandescent 3196 up front and kept the rear red 1157 LEDs as these were bright and visible from all angles with enough difference from low to high to be very obvious.
I see lots of LED bulbs in halogen signal lights/ Some are good, Some are OK, Some are horrid and I automatically detract 50 IQ points from the driver who thought LED = Improvement no matter what.