No they won't install a wrap around dinette in the 1050s. I talked to the Lance Rep a couple of months back, he checked with the factory & they said no way!. Which I thought was unfortunate. Doesn't make much sense to me, but what do I know. The new 1052 or? looks really great but I don't want a camper with 2 slides, (double trouble as far as I'm concerned)
Travelnutz, yes I very familiar with the Rybovich Wooden tournament yachts! very beautiful! I would love to get back to the Carolina's to see them. The Rybovich Brothers & the old man built the top fishing boats in there day.(I know a little off topic)I currently own a Jack Hargrave designed boat that was built back there also.
I always wanted to get back to Port Clinton to see the Matthews Plant before it burned, but never made it. I still love there boats.
Yes indeed it is a small world!
I actually was thinking about a new Lance, because of what you had also mentioned because of there huge $$$ commitment for CNC equip. I figured that the tolerance's had to be better than the other guys.
I love the 1181's floor plan (rear kitchen, forward bath) but it is just a little to long for the place's where we go off road with our 880 I think. I wish they made one to match the AF 992 or the EC995 & with a wrap around dinette! If they did I would buy it! Oh well, I will probably end up with a new EC or AF.
The main thing is to get out & enjoy our TC's no matter what they are!
Apparently you have been very fortunate with your TC's & your right that I don't know about your campers etc. I just know that this is an apparent problem with these older Lance's. They actually sell a kit to repair this area (the wings). I have a dually truck (with mud guards) but it will throw a lot of spray up into the wing areas.
Once wood is wet its almost impossible to dry it out, (I know about this as I have restored a couple of Matthews Yachts) built out of mahogany & oak. Anyway my 93 880 had a 1" frame assy covered with 1/8" Luan over both sides. They covered this with a black tar paper like material on the inboard side & of course the outer metal on the finished side. This was a very crappy way to build a camper IMO, there was no way to really seal this.
This is where the steel staples & screws rusted away, you could literally flex these sides by hand. As mentioned earlier once wet you can't really dry it out & it gets dry rot started & hopefully one finds it before it moves into the flooring (plywood that will never dry out) or into the corner posts. Actually once the wood gets wet it starts a galvanic action & anywhere that a steel staple or screw is touching the aluminum outer skin it will eat tiny holes in the siding, because of the dissimilar metals, this is a real PITA.
And yes I am an expert on restoring old yachts & my old Lance. I replaced all the wood on both sides (lower areas) the cross pieces with clear fir & 1" marine plywood for the wings, all thourghly saturated with a marine 2 part epoxy. The epoxy when mixed with there powder to thicken it, it becomes stronger than the wood itself. So this procedure along with stainless hardware is really the only proper way to repair any old wood camper.
Basically my impression of my Lance was this: very beautiful & finished nice on the inside, top of the line appliances, upholstery, windows which made for a very beautiful camper. And still looks new after I had the paint matched & had all the jacks & bumper sandblasted then sprayed them to match. I just think that behind all the beautiful cosmetics that there really not built any better than the other top brands!
And yes I live in a wet area, & even though my camper has always been stored inside when not in use it takes a beating because of this climate.
I'm sorry if I offended you Travelnutz that wasn't my intent. Take care!
Well I guess I don't have any common sense Travelnutz, but it seems like to me that there really isn't much difference in cabinets, hardware, latches etc etc between the 850 & say the 1181 Lance. I may be wrong, but at least I'm not wrong about where they mount the batteries in boxes under a step! Thanks but no thanks.
I've had my Lance for over 12 yrs & really enjoy it! but have had to remove all mlgs & reseal everything & fix rot in the wings (I don't think there's a Lance made that if they have "chip board' there & used in the rain a lot that it won't rot IMO, even yours!)They never sealed the lag bolts the held the bumper to the wooden cross member & of course it rotted away, even though it was always stored indoors when not used. I guess I was surprised when taking it all apart to see all the plain steel staples, & some wood screws holding everything together. Of course these were all rusted away. I replace everything with SS.
I actually like Lance camper's, but am not so obsessed with them like Travelnutz, I think they have made great improvements in the last yr or so with there counter tops, interior wood finish, etc over what I saw 3-5 yrs ago at the Seattle RV show. They were terrible then IMO. Hard to believe that one could have had several Lance's over the yrs & never had any issues with them, I guess its possible if maybe one didn't keep them long enough for problems to start to show up, or ever use them in the rain (if they were wood framed)
It is strange & unfortunate that our local dealer in Bellingham only keeps one on there lot at a time, (they do stock several Lance trailers though) I didn't see how they could keep there franchise either. Its typical of business's locally as they struggle with the Cdn border & the large dealerships an hour away to the South.
I to have been thinking about upgrading to a new TC, (currently an old Lance 880) We looked recently at a new AF 990 & a EC 1160, not the models we were interested but what the dealer had. Both units were very nice, the EC's cabinet's seemed better finished & not quite so "cheesy" IMO. However both seemed quite well made.
The only problem I had with the Eagle Cap 1160 was on the entry & the divider by the stove. They had used that "sticky fake wood tape" on the edge of the plywood to cover the outer edge. This was a new unit & this******was already starting to lift & peel off the plywood, it wouldn't have lasted 6 months going in & out of the camper without looking like &*%#. I'm sorry for $50k they should have a finish carpenter cut wood mouldings to fit over this! I wouldn't have bought this thing for this very reason! Only way would be to come to a price then come down an additional grand or so to hire a finish carpenter.
The local Lance dealer (who only typically stocks one entry level TC) we stopped by to look at it today, not to impressed with it either! I think it was the 855 or? (no slide). At $29k I wouldn't give you a dime for it! The finish wasn't to great between the wood around the microwave area, just some large gaps in the joinery etc. I'm sure maybe its better on the more expensive models such as the 1050 1181, who knows? But I couldn't overlook the Plastic cabinet latches that looked like they would brake quite easily. After learning where they put the batteries & how they wire them, they can keep there lousy campers IMO
I don't know maybe I just think there all******anymore & should just keep my old 20 yr old Lance, (kept inside, everything still works, & rot etc repaired over the yrs.
Just hard to justify 40k for a new one & not really know how its going to hold up, the heck with it! (although when Apache gets a new 995 Eagle Cap I may have to check it out, I may go off the deep end, as I would like a new one). Guess I am just to damn fussy!
Just wondering from you newer TC owners, we have an older Lance (no slide) the dinette's on the pass. side along with the awning. We can park with the view on this side & sit out side in the rain (under the awning) or sit inside with the U shaped dinette & see the same view when its really cold. (Typical NW Wa weather for 8 months). Has this ever been a problem or concern with you guys with the newer TC's where the dinette is on the drivers side and the side awning is on the pass side?. Seems like you would have to pick & choose how you would park sometimes.
We have sat out under our side awning in the pouring rain quite often & have done just fine, where as having a rear awning instead seems kind of worthless to me in the pouring rain as you will still get wet with no protection from the TC or pickup.
Maybe I'm just paranoid on this, & haven't tried a TC with the rear awning etc?? Thanks for all the different opinions out there! (I can see in the warmer climates maybe this isn't so important, view one side & shade on the other???)
I read something about how difficult it was to access his batteries on a newer 1050S about a month ago. This to took care of me buying a new Lance 1050S! it was on my list.
My compliments to the OP, well written, & he did his homework! After viewing the pics of this sloppy installation, I too did not like how the batteries were being vented.
About 20 yrs ago a young welder was killed when working on a new aluminum boat nearby, the manufacturer had not properly vented the battery boxes overboard & it blew up! The poor young man lost his life over exactly the same potential thing here.
No way would I spend the kind of money they want for these things & have to bust my ^$@ to get the batteries out, not to mention acid leaks or whatever! unbelievable, hopefully Lance steps up & fixes all these correctly.
Well I would never consider a F-150 (or any heavy half ton for that matter) if I was ever going to haul any traditional camper IMO. My brother in law bought a new 150 in 06, long box, ext cab with the heavy GVW (what ever it was at the time). At about 35k the trans case started to slip & had metal in the oil when he took it in to the local Ford dealer (they noticed the filings in the oil)
He had just purchased my Late Mom's 8ft S&S camper & made one trip with it (fishing in BC). So it was still on the truck when he took it in to have the TC looked at, they wouldn't honor his warranty because they said he had exceeded the load capacity of the truck. (right with a 8ft plain jane camper!) We ended up weighing everything & was well within the GVW rating. They still wouldn't fix it, they said to unload it & take it to another dealer, because they had already seen it with the TC on. He ended up trading it for a 012 F-350, I would have fought them myself, anyway this is what happened to him.
I would buy the heavy F-250 etc to get the heavier drive train components IMHO
Can't understand why the majors (Lance, Arctic Fox, etc) can't build a camper with a U-shaped dinette or "wrap around". Our old Lance 880 has this feature & we love it. We like sitting & stretching out our legs & looking out the window when the weather is bad, (when its to wet or cold to sit outside).
The 1181 or the 1191 Lance are to big & heavy. Lance won't build it for the 1050S or either will AF on any of there models. Whats up with this? just cut the table down, use two pedestals for legs & put a cushion across the back & call it a day (& charge out several hundred $$$ for a option).
I guess this narrows it down to the Eagle Cap TC they list it as an option for there models! I'm a little concerned about there issue's some are having with cracked slides, delaminations under the front nose, etc. Lance also seems to be having a lot of issues also lately, I pretty much had ruled them out. But I think I would have gone with the new Arctic Fox, (like what they have done to the front nose) & I think that over all they have the best quality & customer satisfaction IMO.
I like the 992 AF or 995 EC with a rear kitchen, anybody know if one can add or change out the dinette in a AF to make it a wraparound? To bad AF won't change some of there floor plans, its a long over due IMO. I know this probably seems like a small issue to some but I won't lay out the $$$$ for a new one without it! What's your thoughts on this?
I love the looks of them! like the clean graphics, like the bathroom idea. I would have to have the 10' unit with the slide, but would be unsure about buying a unit with wood framing with a slide. What do you guys think? it didn't work out so well in the early 2000's for Lance, (cracked framing, sagging etc). I'm also concerned about delaminations with the Filon on wood. The early AF's had a lot of problems with this, I just don't know, I like a wood framed camper there warmer, etc. And with metal siding it can be repaired, but with Filon your %&^* out of luck I think!
I read the article also, I would prefer to have a fixed panel on the roof. Our old Lance has this (not sure of the size, probably not much more than 80 watts) & this keeps our batteries charged when we are boonie camping. Just for reasons mentioned I don't particularly want to move the thing around & then have to store it somewhere! Other than this I did like the new slide Illusion model, still a $30k msrp though. For that kind of money I would have to think strongly about spending almost the same amt $$ for a wood framed versus aluminum frame. I know there's advantages for both, but this is getting off the subject! Sorry
Thank you for the replys! I think maybe I'm sorry or maybe glad I was able to finally log on. Different computer at work kept me from getting on.
Anyway I'm not trying to "bash" any particular brands on this forum, however I Was looking at replacing my older Lance late this Spring. I was very impressed with the new Eagle Caps, (haven't seen any in person yet) though. But after reading the problems that they have been having with the 1160 & 1165 cracking around the slides I don't know anymore!
There saying because of the over cab weight & the drivers side slide that the aluminum frame isn't able to handle the stress! There not getting much support out of the factory other than a cosmetic repair basically to get them out of the warranty period. Whats up with this!! You lay out $ 50k's & it starts cracking on you!
I guess I'm just tired of reading all of the problems people are having with most all the new campers! I truly feel sorry for these guys. We all work hard & deal with every days stress & then am blessed with a faulty designed RV. I'm sure it creates problems on the home front, I know it would at my home! I know I'm rambin on, but I know there's others out there who must be frustrated about which Brand to buy.
Sorry, brings me to my point of all this, I was looking at the EC 995 would you guys shy away from all EC's or maybe the smaller ones would be OK. But they all have the same weight I would think overhead along with a large drivers side slide, what do you guys think?
I know some of you guys may think that I am bashing this brand, but actually I thought after reading it on a relatively small EC forum that it ought to brought into the more public camper forum, possibly the factory may read this. Who Knows! These manufacturers need to be held responsible for this stuff!
I know its kind of a silly question, (I could call a dealer) RV's come out at a different time of year than the auto industry, right?. I notice that very few dealers actually have any 2014 models yet, of course there trying to sell there 013 models. Just wondering, any stocking dealers near us are about 100 miles away. Thanks
I did this same repair to my 93 880 Lance, amazing I thought just how crappy these campers are built. Plain steel wood screws & staples & chip board they know there building them cheaply!
My steel bumper was rusty also, so I removed it & it was just lagged to the wood stringer that ran under the door & was gone also, because they hadn't sealed where the bumper & fasteners attached to this cross piece.
I recommend removing the bumper & checking this wood. I replaced all mine & replaced it with clear fir.I used 1" marine plywood for both "wings" & used West Epoxy through out the rebuild, so much stronger than any glue or even the wood itself. Besides it penetrates the wood to keep it from rotting in the future.
I used Sikaflex sealant for each screw (SS) then sprayed the inner plywood with a black undercoating to match Lance's "cheesy" black paper material that they had used on mine. I then had the bumper sandblasted & jacks all color matched. It now looks like new but only better by far!
I would strongly recommend using the marine epoxy system over glue, coat all wood with this material (thins out when warm, penetrates better)
Was just looking at it quickly over the weekend, I think the hot water heater comes out pretty easy & everything else isn't to bad. Besides if I only loosen the metal up to the side window & hold it away a bit as I repair the wood with epoxy & new materials. This may not be so bad after all, I would also reinforce this whole area as much as possible!.
Maybe for now I would just keep the old gal, as I don't have a whole lot of time to use anyway the way things are going! When one thinks about things logically $35k-40k is a lot bucks just to get a slide & more headroom! Other than this she's in good shape & everything still works (except the AC) but don't use it anyway. If I ever headed South & would install one of those Coleman AC'S Anyway thanks for the suggestions! I guess I'm going to repair it!
Besides after reading the "pros & cons" about slides, for just the two of us we probably don't need the extra room right now. I'm just going to have to install a step to help get up into the bed!
Well here I was already this Spring to go buy an EC 995 but after reading this I don't know anymore. I know all TC's have problems now & then but this is a major problem, especially if its caused by a leak somewhere! like the fellow with the EC 1050. I don't know what to buy anymore, they don't build to many of these campers so there seems to be a high % of them with problems IMO.
As one member stated they had a "dust & temp " issue going on at the factory whats this all about? I guess at least living in Bellingham Wa I'm only about 3 hrs from Yakima. I guess I'm to paranoid about hassles with a new camper that maybe I should just fix my old Lance & forget about it. I guess the EC management reads these forum's from time to time maybe this will "rattle there cage" a bit!!
Hi anybody know if the Eagle Cap Forum is still up & running? I can't seem to ever log on. Never had any problems with other sites. I seem to remember something that it was run by someone who visited this site a lot?. Just was interested in seeing feedback etc by EC owners. Thanks
Of course I'm going to disclose the damage to a perspective buyer! That wasn't the real question. It was whether I fix it or sell as is with the price reflecting the damage. Besides anybody checking it out closely would see the deformed trim piece, etc.
I'm think its worth $3500 as is, seems like all the dealers are asking anywhere from 5-7 grand for good old Lances, I know its difficult to put a value without seeing it. But what do you guys think its worth?
Need some opinions, I've got a 93 880 Lance that I'm going to sell because I want a new camper. I've always repaired as needed, kept in doors. But I hit a speed bump last summer hard & broke the rear tie down on drivers side. (Tie down is still there but came down about an 1" or so & broke the wood framing holding it). To fix it is a major ordeal,( I don't really have the time right now). The hot water tank would have to be removed & all the stuff on the drivers side to remove the metal 1/2 way up the side, to gain access to the wood frame to properly repair it.
I don't really think I would get anymore for the camper, (on a outright sale not a trade in). Probably not worth my time. Do you think I'm just better to sell as is & tell who ever buys it that it has been damaged.
On the other hand, I really hate to sell it "broken" because it really looks like new & I have always fixed things that I own. Thanks for the opinions!