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RE: Roll Call Alaska 2018

I haven't taken my rig on a long trip in 5 years. The last one was a nightmare. The truck blew a head gasket, the fridge quit working, the jacks would go up and down in the middle of the night all by themselves. Sometimes they wouldn't work at all. The TV came one all by itself at full volume in the middle of the night. I blew two tires within 100 miles. Both tires were less than a year old and had less than 8000 miles on them. I'm going through my rig now to try to prepare. I had the truck engine bulletproofed for 8000 dollars. A year later I had it redone because the first shop didn't do any of the work they charged me for. I'm planning on getting new tires just before I leave and I'm replacing the jack switch. I'm going to have the RV shop pack the wheel bearings. Anything else I need to be concerned with?You need both a good truck person and a good RV person. Tire problems like yours are a result of poor quality, under inflation, over loaded or alignment. BTW The average tire shop can sell you tires but they often have little knowledge about towing or the the towed vehicle. And you need the truck and RV axle weights prior to even thinking about tires. What kind of RV shop is going to pack the wheel bearings? They may/may have adequate knowledge/skill. Based on your experience including the truck rip off you need to gain adequate knowledge so that you can understand and know when to say no. Perhaps someone nearby can help? Highly recommend you start taking trips and work out the problems associated with an apparent under used rig. Think of all of this as insurance for a very long upcoming trip. I have a BS in Automotive Engineering and worked as a diesel mechanic for 10 years prior to getting my degree. There's no way of knowing if the shop replaced internal parts on the engine without tearing it apart. RV Connections in Panama City will pack the wheel bearings and inspect the brake components.
mabynack 01/11/18 02:08pm RVing in Canada and Alaska
RE: Roll Call Alaska 2018

I haven't taken my rig on a long trip in 5 years. The last one was a nightmare. The truck blew a head gasket, the fridge quit working, the jacks would go up and down in the middle of the night all by themselves. Sometimes they wouldn't work at all. The TV came one all by itself at full volume in the middle of the night. I blew two tires within 100 miles. Both tires were less than a year old and had less than 8000 miles on them. I'm going through my rig now to try to prepare. I had the truck engine bulletproofed for 8000 dollars. A year later I had it redone because the first shop didn't do any of the work they charged me for. I'm planning on getting new tires just before I leave and I'm replacing the jack switch. I'm going to have the RV shop pack the wheel bearings. Anything else I need to be concerned with?You need both a good truck person and a good RV person. Tire problems like yours are a result of poor quality, under inflation, over loaded or alignment. BTW The average tire shop can sell you tires but they often have little knowledge about towing or the the towed vehicle. And you need the truck and RV axle weights prior to even thinking about tires. What kind of RV shop is going to pack the wheel bearings? They may/may have adequate knowledge/skill. Based on your experience including the truck rip off you need to gain adequate knowledge so that you can understand and know when to say no. Perhaps someone nearby can help? Highly recommend you start taking trips and work out the problems associated with an apparent under used rig. Think of all of this as insurance for a very long upcoming trip.
CA Traveler 01/11/18 09:41am RVing in Canada and Alaska
RE: Roll Call Alaska 2018

I haven't taken my rig on a long trip in 5 years. The last one was a nightmare. The truck blew a head gasket, the fridge quit working, the jacks would go up and down in the middle of the night all by themselves. Sometimes they wouldn't work at all. The TV came one all by itself at full volume in the middle of the night. I blew two tires within 100 miles. Both tires were less than a year old and had less than 8000 miles on them. I'm going through my rig now to try to prepare. I had the truck engine bulletproofed for 8000 dollars. A year later I had it redone because the first shop didn't do any of the work they charged me for. I'm planning on getting new tires just before I leave and I'm replacing the jack switch. I'm going to have the RV shop pack the wheel bearings. Anything else I need to be concerned with? My goodness I hope you got rid of your ghost. Our Monaco Dip always had something go wrong every time we took her out. One time we had just had everything checked in the shop, pull out of our driveway and the mirror just fell. We solved the problems by scaling down and bought a new Class C. If you are taking a tow, don't forget to check her out also.I'm sure others better than I will have other suggestions for you. Good Luck Janet
JANETRUPP 01/11/18 08:01am RVing in Canada and Alaska
RE: Roll Call Alaska 2018

I haven't taken my rig on a long trip in 5 years. The last one was a nightmare. The truck blew a head gasket, the fridge quit working, the jacks would go up and down in the middle of the night all by themselves. Sometimes they wouldn't work at all. The TV came one all by itself at full volume in the middle of the night. I blew two tires within 100 miles. Both tires were less than a year old and had less than 8000 miles on them. I'm going through my rig now to try to prepare. I had the truck engine bulletproofed for 8000 dollars. A year later I had it redone because the first shop didn't do any of the work they charged me for. I'm planning on getting new tires just before I leave and I'm replacing the jack switch. I'm going to have the RV shop pack the wheel bearings. Anything else I need to be concerned with?
mabynack 01/11/18 07:19am RVing in Canada and Alaska
RE: '14 Ram 2500 Axle Seals Leaking

OP, I hope this helps you. This is for my 2013. Fill Level - From Bottom of Fill Hole 6 mm (1/4 in.) ± 6 mm (1/4 in.) And what I find for installing an axle seal 1.Install outer hub bearing cup with Installer 8961 and Handle C-4171 . 2.Install inner hub bearing cup with Installer 8153 and Handle C-4171 . 3.Pack bearings with the appropriate wheel bearing grease. 4.Install rear bearing and install new grease seal with Installer 8963 and Handle C-4171 . 5.Slide hub on the axle tube and install front bearing into the hub. 6.Install hub bearing nut with Socket 8954 (1) and tighten with torque wrench (2) to 30 N·m (22 ft. lbs.) while rotating the hub. 7.Back off nut about 30° and align next hub nut key slot with axle tube key slot and install locking key. NOTE: End play should be 0.025-0.25 mm (0.01-0.001 in.) 8.Install retainer ring (1) with ring end in the key slot (2). 9.Install new axle shaft gasket and install the axle shaft. Great Info. That confirms what I'm now finding from other sources for the fill level and the spindle nut torque. KJ
LIKE2BUILD 01/10/18 07:06am Tow Vehicles
RE: '14 Ram 2500 Axle Seals Leaking

OP, I hope this helps you. This is for my 2013. Axle Ratio 3.73, 4.10 Ring Gear Diameter 292 mm (11.5 in.) Ring Gear Backlash 0.13 - 0.18 mm (0.005 - 0.007 in.) Pinion Torque To Rotate - New Bearings 1.69 - 2.82 N·m (15 - 25 in. lbs.) Pinion Torque To Rotate - Original Bearings 1 - 2 N·m (10 - 20 in. lbs.) Total Torque to Rotate - New Bearing 3.4 - 5.6 N·m (30 - 50 in. lbs.) Total Torque to Rotate - Original Bearing 2.8 - 5.1 N·m (25 - 45 in. lbs.) Fill Level - From Bottom of Fill Hole 6 mm (1/4 in.) ± 6 mm (1/4 in.) all torque values are the name, then NM, then FT-Lbs. Fill Hole Plug 32 24 - Differential Cover Bolts 40 30 - Bearing Cap Bolts 281 207 - Ring Gear Bolts 237 175 - Axle Flange Bolts 129 95 - Adjuster Lock Bolt 25 18 - And what I find for installing an axle seal 1.Install outer hub bearing cup with Installer 8961 and Handle C-4171 . 2.Install inner hub bearing cup with Installer 8153 and Handle C-4171 . 3.Pack bearings with the appropriate wheel bearing grease. 4.Install rear bearing and install new grease seal with Installer 8963 and Handle C-4171 . 5.Slide hub on the axle tube and install front bearing into the hub. 6.Install hub bearing nut with Socket 8954 (1) and tighten with torque wrench (2) to 30 N·m (22 ft. lbs.) while rotating the hub. 7.Back off nut about 30° and align next hub nut key slot with axle tube key slot and install locking key. NOTE: End play should be 0.025-0.25 mm (0.01-0.001 in.) 8.Install retainer ring (1) with ring end in the key slot (2). 9.Install new axle shaft gasket and install the axle shaft.
jus2shy 01/09/18 07:21pm Tow Vehicles
RE: Prep for trip..

Question: For checking wheel bearings.. I have pulled hubs and greased bearings -n- such in the past, not on this RV. This trailer is a 2017 model and the bearings have been on one good trip and a few short trips. I will take them for granted for now. But, as time moves forward, do you pull the hubs off to check the wheel bearings or something less drastic. The dealership said to ignore these bearings for ten years unless we really do a lot of long rang traveling. I've seen more than one new trailer with poorly packed bearing and grease on the brakes. First thing I did with my new trailer was do the bearings and it was a good thing I checked them as I think the factory though that the grease went in the brake pads instead of the bearings. I keep track of the trailer mileage, nothing super accurate but I write down the trip mileage and like someone already stated its surprising how fast the short trips add up. If you remove the hubs to check the bearings you might as well just pack them. I don't know about ignoring your bearings for ten years, I did some research on bearings and picked a mileage that I will pack the bearings at, had my trailer 3 years and already put 7000 miles on the trailer.
Muddydogs 11/16/17 08:41pm Travel Trailers
RE: Greasing LCI SuperLube Axles

At the factory, they pack the bearings correctly and don't bother with trying to fill the entire system with grease. So, there's a lot of air to displace. Plus, there's all that grease that gets pushed past the seal and is now contaminating your brakes. Seriously, to even attempt using a super-lube type system, you need to get the axles and hubs really warm (drive around dragging the brakes), let the grease cartridge sit in a bucket of really hot water for a half hour, then pump it in very slowly while spinning the wheel/hub. Otherwise, you're probably contaminating the brakes and making it a bigger job than just doing a hand repack in the first place. But, if it's time for the bearings to get new grease, then they also need to be inspected, which can't happen unless you take stuff apart. Super-lube systems are a gimmick for anything except a boat trailer.
mike-s 10/22/17 03:48pm Tech Issues
Packing wheel bearing

I was going to pack the wheel bearings on my 2003 Aliner and when I pulled the hub the grease looked nasty. I don't remember looking that bad the last time I packed them. I am going to order new seal and clean the bearings and repack. The book calls for lithium grease. I am thinking about using synthetic after everything is cleaned up. Is anyone using synthetic? At the risk of sounding stupid, why do the bearings need to be packed every year if there is a grease fitting on the bearing cover
airlifter 08/27/17 02:05pm Folding Trailers
RE: greasing wheels

We had a wheel come off in Biloxi, Ms and broke the drum. That was after having brakes and backing plates replaced six months prior. Would have thought they took care of the bearings at that time. Unless you do it yourself, having a mechanic inspect the brakes and bearings every year sounds like a good idea whether you pack on the mileage or leave the rig sit for long periods of time in one place where condensation can get in.
Road Phantom 08/05/17 12:33pm Fifth-Wheels
RE: greasing wheels

Well you can argue how often to attend to your wheel bearings, but consider this, while your wheel bearings may be good for a couple of years, you still need to pay attention to your grease seals and brakes! Every year you should remove wheel and hub, clean and inspect brakes, check your seals, replace as required! Now that you have done that, how much more would it be to clean, inspect, and re pack your wheel bearings? The big part is removing the wheel and hub, so again it may be a little over kill but you will have piece of mind that your good to go! A lot of brake problems can be traced to bad/worn seals along with to much grease! Oh and use a good synthetic grease!
Coach-man 08/05/17 12:08pm Fifth-Wheels
RE: Front rotors on E450 Chassis

To change Pads and Calipers ONLY, Very Easy. https://www.rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseaction/listings/forum/39.cfm Loosen Lugs, Jack Up, Support Axle on Stands/Jacks, Remove Wheel Pry the Caliper inboard so it compresses the Piston, Loosening the Pads Remove Caliper Slide Bolts, may be hex nuts or internal TORX Prepare Brake Line Caps. I used short pieces of wiper hose with a golf tee in the end Disconnect Hose at Chassis and Cap Immediately, unclip Hose from ABS wire, use a Tubing Wrench to Loosen and Tighten the Hose Fitting Lift Caliper, Hose and Pads off the Caliper Mounting Bracket Replace ALL those Parts, Hose Included Apply Brake Lubricant such as https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51JzPoUb2RL._AC_US218_.jpg width=250 Reassemble Siphon brake fluid out of Master Cylinder till Reservoir is almost BUT NOT empty, then FILL with NEW Fluid Bleed Brakes NEVER ALLOWING MASTER CYLINDER TO GO EMPTY!!! Reinstall Wheel, set on Ground, Torque Nuts to 140 Only moderate braking till Pads settle in To remove ROTORS, you need a 21mm socket/wrench, 13/16" may fit if you get all the rust off the bolt heads, 7/8" SIX Point may also work, and they are TIGHT, about the same as those Wheel Nuts at 140 Remove Caliper Bracket Bolts and Bracket, then Dust Cap and Bearing Nuts/Bearings/Seals etc to re-pack your Bearings If you need to Re-Surface or to Replace your ROTORS, I suggest you find late model take-off parts from a 4x4 conversion outfit. The parts will cost no more than a "complete" brake job of Rotors, Bearings, Hoses, Calipers, and Pads. You get all-new, Bigger and Better Brakes that are Plug and Play. I didn't even re-pack the Bearings. Nearest to you is UJoint in Fletcher NC near I-26 about 20 miles your side of Asheville. E350 and E450 dual rear wheel vehicles "donate" the same front brakes. I got my "kit" from Quigley Motors in central PA, and I got axles and all. That provides all-new Ball Joints, Bushings, and an upgraded Radius Arm design. They crated it and I arranged shipping. The palletized carton weight 400 lb and fit in my compact pickup.
j-d 07/24/17 10:03am Class C Motorhomes
RE: How many of us are there? Owners of Dodge based RV's?

An update on kingpin project, so others can learn. In addition to worn kingpins, I've discovered the wheel bearings were too loose. When we started working on the kingpins, by removing the tires and rotors, I was able to move the tires and rotors back and forth on the spindles. A little bit of play is necessary to keep the bearings from wearing prematurely but this seemed like too much, and worn kingpins couldn't account for the amount of play. The weight of the tires makes detecting actual play difficult. The rotors, by themselves without the tires, gives a better indication. A bit of Internet research, focusing on heavy duty trucks, led to examine two indicators. (Yes, what I'm working on a light truck but information on heavy duty trucks tends to be more consistant and provided by professionals rather than a lot of amateurs or shadetree mechanics who may not know as much.) The two indicators are tire tread and brake lining wear. Loose bearings, according to the professionals, cause the hubs to lean inward at the top, when the vehicle is lowered to the ground and weight is applied to the spindles and hubs. The inward lean causes the inside edges of the tire tread to wear more. Likewise, the lean tends to cause brake linings to wear unevenly. In our case, the tread wear was as predicted. Likewise, the brake pads were worn to a taper rather than evenly across their length. Further web exploration indicated the old Haynes manual we were relying on has an apparent error in terms of the wheel bearing preload torque specification. Everything I could find on the web indicate the actual torque should be two to six times what is in that manual. The HD truck procedures indicate the hub play should be between .001" and .005" and a final check should be done with a dial indicator. I have a dial indicator and accessories but most people in this thread probably don't. There's plenty of guidance on how to (re)pack, install, and preload bearings so I won't get into it. However, the range of recommended freeplay is roughly the width of two human hairs. So, if you can detect freeplay, your bearings are probably too loose. (If you have significant difficulty rotating the hub or tire when it's off the ground, then your bearings may be too tight.) Old-timers guidance, from almost 45 years ago, says tighten the spindle nut until you can't turn the hub and then back off the nut 1/8 to 1/4 turn. Calculations, based on typical spindle thread count, indicate this should be close to recommended freeplay. (There's actually more steps involved so do your research. I'm just focusing on diagnosis and calculations here, without regard to what is take to do the job correctly.)
Griff in Fairbanks 07/18/17 04:51pm Class C Motorhomes
RE: Greasing wheel bearings

When repacking wheel bearings, how full do you pack the center of the hub between the front and rear bearings?
ernie1 07/10/17 05:17pm Tech Issues
RE: Bearing repack question

Not sure what you mean by had packed correctly. I did was to pack/grease the two bearings. Beyond packing the bearings, what do you mean? Is there a potential problem if I adds more into the fitting? ThanksIf you just swished some grease on that could be insufficient. If you forced grease into the rollers so it oozed out in all directions then you are good and done. The issue with the zerk is the grease is forced against the rear seal to make it flow through the bearings from back to front. If grease gets past the seal it goes on the brake shoes. If you must use the zerk you must have a double lip seal and rotate the wheel while you SLOWLY hand pump the grease. Again this is not needed if the bearing is properly packed.
time2roll 07/08/17 04:30pm Travel Trailers
RE: EZ lube spindle AND bearing repack question

Dexter originally said that the EZ Lube was for axles/hubs that were submerged to be easily purged of contaminated grease. They has since lightened up and say it is a general purpose re-pack feature. I have had and used them for years, and find them to be an easy way to give a grease flush between repack/inspections. Patience and turning the wheel are both important to successful flushing. I do pull the hubs and have the bearings cleaned, inspected and repacked every other year on average.
fairfaxjim 07/06/17 11:34pm Travel Trailers
RE: Greasing wheel bearings

Re Swimming _spre,,wheel went flying, ripped off brake wires and burnt my hand when I touched the smoking hub to see if it was hot. (dumb, dumb, dumb.) I had treated myself to having a tech pack my bearings. Never again. I do mine every year or 12,000 miles. Regrease, replace bearings as necessary and change the seals and cotter pins every time. The tech left out a coffee pin. :(
Calgary Campers 07/05/17 08:47pm Tech Issues
RE: 1964 Roadrunner - Tow-Mater Cab-Over Bunk Resto-Mod

Today - Axle wheel bearings and wheel seals clean, inspect and re-grease (re-pack). I'm a shade-tree mechanic. That means, often a shade with come across my mind and then I can't remember what to do - or why. That's when I depend on this excellent research tool I discovered called "the Internet". But then you have to decide each time, is that hoax tips or real tips? Yes sir! The Internet can be misleading! Take me for instance; I don't necessarily know what I'm talking about, and I'm not even TRYING to mislead you. One has to be careful. The following wheel bearing techniques work for me, but I suspect there's lots of viewpoints on the matter. First and foremost, with age I've gotten smarter, or at least less physically capable, so I use crutches, like a work bench for instance, instead of a small patch of ground - whenever possible. Here's the scene. http://i.imgur.com/WxBE6wk.jpg Note the axle spindles poking out on either side, easily accessible, and all cleaned up, ready for working. And there in the middle, all the parts in the same cleaned and prepped state. http://i.imgur.com/FyqVokl.jpg When I'm taking it off, and cleaning it up, and setting it out, and putting it on, I set up a left and right that I don't deviate from. Once you've got the parts separated, you can mix things up very easily. And when it comes to wear patterns, you don't want to mix up. The bearing races (cups) pressed into the hub, and the associated inner and outer wheel bearings (cones) have run together for long enough, that put in the wrong pairing can allow previous wear patterns in each to adversely wear in future. Or so I've heard. In this case, the surfaces appear in such perfect condition, there's no point in replacement or even bearing cup removal from the hub (which you never do unless you are replacing parts - always replace cone and cup as a set). I wipe most the grease with my once-used hand drying paper towels, and then get stuff in the solvent tank. Then from there, it's off to the hot water rinse, and then the compressed-air dry. If the bearing grease is old (and relatively hard), you might have to clean the bearing cage several times to make sure all the old stuff is out. When drying, don't spin the bearings. It's tempting, and can seem pretty cool, until it explodes in your face. Fast spin without grease can create friction and heat and devastating loss to vision - and if not that, perhaps irritating facial wounds dripping blood into your eyes, and you can't see and you go through too many paper towels and rags and stuff, and the blood can contaminate and thin your grease. It's just not worth it and can create more workload and unscheduled time off. Let's look at the dirty. First off is the dust cap - in this case it's threaded, and most often it's pressed in. These are fairly cheap for a new one, but I've never looked for a threaded. http://i.imgur.com/1D90xFH.jpg Next remove the cotter pin, the lock-nut and the thrust washer. Then the outer bearing can carefully be removed. Then the hub slides off the spindle with the inner bearing and the seal remaining in the hub. Hear's the outer on the towel. And the back side of the hub still with the inner. http://i.imgur.com/8qxVIge.jpg Here's the other side inner along with the spindle end. http://i.imgur.com/xorGfK8.jpg Here you can see the stamping (numbers) on the seal. Some wear or imperfect stamping obscures the numbers. http://i.imgur.com/xHBTgkB.jpg Let's look at the other side. http://i.imgur.com/bA1Td6V.jpg That's better. National 6362 USA Pat. Come to find out that's a leather seal, no longer made? Apparently obsolete. The Internet says a modern replacement is a neoprene: National 440265, SKF 16811, or NAPA 16811. I didn't need new, because I didn't destroy the seals getting them out of the hub (or putting them in) and because the leather sealing surface still looks so good. But I've never run across a leather one, so I had to research. I found a site that "appeared" non-hoax-like that made some logical sense, so I used it. That's after cleaning. For now let's get it out. I use a bridge and a spot for the seal and bearing to fall safely (not to the ground). A wooden punch and a hammer making a sharp blow (not smashing blow, not hard blow - a sharp blow). And balanced sharp blows around it evenly. One hand holding the hub, one hand holding the hammer, one hand holding the wood, and one hand catching what comes out. So you can do it if you're "handy", but a friend can help too. http://i.imgur.com/4tOCDWf.jpg Once inside, I clean the grease out and inspect. No pits, heat spots, etc. Nice clean, smooth bearing surfaces. http://i.imgur.com/zXrA9TR.jpg So after cleaning then. All laid out. http://i.imgur.com/NkEa1d9.jpg And once dried with compressed air, I oil it up a little before grease. That keeps off immediate surface rusting and allows a smoother grease flow while packing. http://i.imgur.com/3eNLm2z.jpg And the seals. http://i.imgur.com/bbSlKBt.jpg This ring goes on first. I think it's called a sling, because it slings outside water (and other contaminants) away centrifugally from the leather seal surface. http://i.imgur.com/aPzTKbh.jpg And with the sling pushed back into position on the spindle shoulder... http://i.imgur.com/xM6qYOs.jpg grease it up. http://i.imgur.com/SeaJCmR.jpg Now some people think "re-packing" the wheel bearings means to stuff as much grease as possible into the hub cavity. I disagree. To me it means packing each bearing cone (the side with all the rollers) thoroughly. I've never liked the air-pressure or press-down packers. I learned in High School Mechanics class how to palm grease the bearings and it has always worked well for me. Two fingers in the bearing, the other hand full of grease, the bearing held in the direction that allows most air space between the rollers and the internals of the cage, and repeatedly force grease from the palm up into every internal crevice in the bearing - slowly turning it in your two fingered hand to press grease up inside each roller until you see it pushing out toward you. It's messy, but fun - and effective. Then in goes the inner bearing (grease the hub too first), and then the seal. I simply used a hammer on the seal. It's about finesse and technique, not force. Light taps and kept even. Don't let the seal slant and then wack it - you'll be buying a new seal. http://i.imgur.com/ATQrFSp.jpg Tap the outer seal surface flush to the hub. Done. Then prep the outer bearing and cup (in the hub). http://i.imgur.com/yViNAOX.jpg I assembled one side, prepped the other, then strung the axle up over the springs keeping my greasy spindle out of the dirt. Once in place, I could put on the other hub (that whole space available thing between the springs and the trailer frame). With both hubs on and bearing nuts "tight-enough" (a little more than finger tight), I dropped the axle over the spring pins in my newly drilled holes. Final bearing pre-set to come once I get the tires and wheels on, because I do it by feel, and I need the leverage weight and spin of the wheel and tire assembly to help me "feel it". http://i.imgur.com/CJT7zJ6.jpg Now I need to locate one or four new u-bolts, and check on the tires order.
Dave Pete 07/01/17 06:26am Travel Trailers
RE: Greasing bearings question

Thoroughly clean the bearings when inspecting your brakes. Hand pack the bearings with wheel bearing grease and install a new grease seal. Smack that grease fitting with a hammer so that it can never be used,
Lynnmor 06/26/17 05:26pm Travel Trailers
RE: Greasing bearings question

I just did mine not long ago... I jacked up one at a time, pumped the grease while turning the tires... I was surprised that it took about a tube per wheel That would surprise me too, usually it takes about a golf ball size gob for each bearing. The difference is that when you hand pack the bearings individually you don't have to fill the void around the axle between the inner and outer bearings like is required using the grease gun method using the zerk. You have to fill that void before the grease will be expelled out from around the outer bearing and all that grease in the void is doing nothing to provide any lubrication to either bearing. A tube might be a little too much, but around 2/3's of a tube would not surprise me at all and why I no longer recommend using the grease gun/zerk method when that is an option. Hand packing IMO is much better. Larry
LarryJM 06/26/17 05:21pm Travel Trailers
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