Hi. Seems the original thread has been...uh-hummm...'Led Astray'...
Getting back to the mans question... I have just completed installing one on my 01 Ford 4R100. I suggest getting onto 'Summitt' auto parts website. They have an amazing selection of gauges. U'll find one to match u'r OEM gauges and price range. E-mail em with any questions of u'r year and model. They really know Trannys.
I'm a 'CLUTZ' and usually break everything I touch so I elected to just screw the 'Sender' into my Tranny's 'Test Port' rather than cut into the metal fluid line and install a 'TEE' fitting. Summitt knew the tranny casing wall was not very deep and the sender supplied with the meter I chose would screw in too far and tighten against the opposite case channel wall. They told me which 'Shorter' sender unit needed for my Tranny.
I do agree that the most accurate place to locate the Sender is in the 'HOT' line leaving the tranny before it gets to the cooler which requires the TEE install in line, but "I'm a 'CLUTZ' on 1st name basis with 'Murphy's Law'.
Joe&Charlotte, Nat'l SurfSide DE34D Ford 362HP 5speed
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I bought an Autometer gauge from The Parts Bin. It was $53 and shipping was free. I bought a gauge pod to go with it to mount it on the 'A' pillar. Total was less than $75. I took the TV down to the local tranny shop for a flush, fluid, & filter change and he installed the sensor for me in the test port. I haven't seen any temps over 180°F yet. You'll get different opinions on sensor location, just go with what you feel is best for you.
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As for how har to do it...U'll only need buy a meter, a 'Sender' unit and some wire. The 'Sender' is just a little brass fitting, round and about an inch long. U will simply attach a wire onto the end which will go up to the dash mounted meter and attached there. The meter will need to be connected to a sorse of 'Switched 12VDC and Ground. If U want u'r meter lighted at night, u'll also have to run a wire to u'r dash lights switch. If U have-and elect-to install the sender unit into the 'Tranny's Test port, the Sender is standard thread and simply screws into the Test Port. If u install it into the Tranny's HOT Output line, u'll have to cut this metal Tranny fluid line in half, buy and install a brass TEE fitting into this line. The SENDer unit than screws into the TEE fitting. To figure which line is the HOT line...there are two metal fluid lines coming out the side of u'r tranny and go to the Tranny cooler which usually mounted in front of the radiator. With the engine and tranny cold, start it up. let idle and feel the two metal lines where they enter the cooler. The one that get warm 1st is the HOT Output line from the Tranny. Its not as hard as it sounds. The Sender unit MUST make Ground connection with the metal it screws into.
jolooote wrote: As for how har to do it...U'll only need buy a meter, a 'Sender' unit and some wire. The 'Sender' is just a little brass fitting, round and about an inch long.
The sender unit is a thermister that changes it's resistance as measured temperature. But not all senders have the same resistance range and they should be matched to the characteristics of the
meter. So it is best to purchase the meter and the sender as a matched unit.
On my own installation, I used the hot side output line for the high temp side measurement because the test port does not accurately measure either the hot side or the return side. Personally, I think
cutting the transmission line should be avoided. This can be done by using barbed connectors on both sides of the T and using a short hose section to mate the T barb with the tranmission line. This, of course, isolates the T from ground and, as you point out, you will have to run a ground lead from the T to any chasis point. It can either be braised or soldered to the T (assuming a copper T) or alternatively you can fasten it to the T using a small hose clamp. The sender uses a 1/8 MPT fitting so the most compact arrangement is to use a ordinary 3/8 inch copper plumbing T, a couple of 3/8" MPT to 3/8" barb fittings and a 3/8 to 1/8 inch adapter for inserting the sender into the T. Important: Do NOT use soft set on the threads of the sender because you want good continuity between the sender thread and ground.
IMO, there should be some law requiring OEMs to equip every RV with a transmission temp gauge. It's even more vital than a water temp gauge because radiator overheating will produce a lot of visible symptoms before meltdown. Overloaded and overheated transmissions can go into melt down long before the symptoms raise their ugly heads and by that time, it's way too late.
Good ideas from 'Cruising'. Just one other thing to consider. Gauges can be had with very different Temp ranges. Measuring anywhere from 140-300 to some that are 0-400 degree range. This depends on where U locate the 'Sender' unit. Most posts on here consider that typical fluid temps are from 160 for normal easy cruising to an extreme of around 240. Many state that if a tranny runs above 220 degrees for an extended time, damage can occur. SOooo...I selected a gauge that measures from 100-250 degrees. I figure that it'll let me notice a somewhat smaller change in temp than would a meter that is say...
0-400. The scale on a large range meter needs a very big temp change to allow U to notice it.
jolooote wrote: Good ideas from 'Cruising'. Just one other thing to consider. Gauges can be had with very different Temp ranges. Measuring anywhere from 140-300 to some that are 0-400 degree range. This depends on where U locate the 'Sender' unit. Most posts on here consider that typical fluid temps are from 160 for normal easy cruising to an extreme of around 240. Many state that if a tranny runs above 220 degrees for an extended time, damage can occur. SOooo...I selected a gauge that measures from 100-250 degrees. I figure that it'll let me notice a somewhat smaller change in temp than would a meter that is say...
0-400. The scale on a large range meter needs a very big temp change to allow U to notice it.
You're right on about expanding the meter range so that you can get more subtle measurement changes but if you really want to see refined
measurements, use a digital gauge made by either Nordskog or Cyberdyne which will give you one degree increments in an LED
readout. They're not really much more expensive than their analog
counterparts. Cyberdyne is sold by JC Whitney and Summit Racing sells both Cyberdyne, Nordskog and their own house brand. I've got about 6 digital gauges on the dashboard - water temp, oil temp, oil pressure, tranny output, tranny return and alternator output. Along with two link 10 meters, a Prosine 2.0 remote display and a dual digital battery disconnect the driver space looks like the cockpit of a jumbo jet!
Actually, sustained operation at 220+ degrees doesn't, per se, damage the transmission because the clutch and seal material will stand up to fluid temps of 275 degrees, mas o menos. What does happen at 220+ is that the fluid eventually starts to degrades and can cause mechanical damage unless the fluid is regularly changed. I wonder if the newer synthetic fluids are more resistant to high temperature degradation?
Seems like talking about transmission temp is like talking about politics or religion, everyone has their own opinion and it is not going to be changed by anyone (-:
The problem as I see it is that we are not all doing the monitoring of the trans the same way. There are four or possibly more ways to monitor the temp.
1-Test Port
2-Cooler line out
3-Cooler line in
4-Pan
I am using #4. I am sure that if I installed separate gauges in all four places I would get four distinctly different readings. Which one would show the temps that are quoted in charts we see? Obviously I believe my choice is the correct one but I am not sure I could find credable evidence to back up my opinion. I just "think" I'm right. I also think the hottest reading would come from the cooler line coming out of the trans. I don't think the readings taken there would be the ones to use when reading the above mentioned charts JMHO.
jauguston wrote: Seems like talking about transmission temp is like talking about politics or religion, everyone has their own opinion and it is not going to be changed by anyone (-:
The problem as I see it is that we are not all doing the monitoring of the trans the same way. There are four or possibly more ways to monitor the temp.
1-Test Port
2-Cooler line out
3-Cooler line in
4-Pan
I am using #4. I am sure that if I installed separate gauges in all four places I would get four distinctly different readings. Which one would show the temps that are quoted in charts we see? Obviously I believe my choice is the correct one but I am not sure I could find credable evidence to back up my opinion. I just "think" I'm right. I also think the hottest reading would come from the cooler line coming out of the trans. I don't think the readings taken there would be the ones to use when reading the above mentioned charts JMHO.
Jim
IMO, the pan is the worst choice for a single measurement. There are two temps you want to quantify:
1. How hot the fluid is coming out of the transmission.
This measurement determines the maximum temp to which the fluid is subjected and indeed is precisely the temp point to which the longevity tables should be applied.
2. How hot is the fluid when it returns to the transmission. The differential between this temp and the output temp determines the
efficiency of the cooling portion of the circuit.
To really appreciate what is happening in the complete system, you should be able to toggle a gauge between these two points as you drive under varying load conditions. Trust me, it's a real eye opener.
If I was limited to one test point, I'd choose the output line because at least I would know the highest temperature to which the fluid was being subjected.
azrider61 wrote: The pan temp is about the coolest place for the tranny fluid. If you have a very efficient cooler you'll never know how hot your tranny is really running with the sender in the test port at the pan. Hope this helps.
I wonder why Mag-Hytec puts sender ports in their pans if this is the wrong place to locate it?
* This post was
edited 06/20/06 11:04pm by 96Bounder30E *
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