On Friday, the local Goodyear did an oil change for my Chevy Express 3500 van. Today, the check engine oil level light was blinking, so I checked the dipstick. Nothing showed. Fearing the worst, I decided to drain the oil pan to see how much oil was in there, and to look for any metal chunks or shavings. When I removed the drain plug, RED ATF came out instead of oil!
I am going to have it towed to a chevy dealer for evaluation on Tuesday, but I am wondering if anyone has any thoughts on what I should do and how I should protect my van and my interests? How serious is the potential damage, and what should I be looking at or concerned about? It was driven about 25 miles, started a few times, and run for about 1 hour total.
I called the Goodyear manager at home (found his name in the phone book) and he assured me they would stand behind the error.
How was the oil pressure?
Was it ever filled up fully?
You will have a very clean engine due to this. You might be able to send out a sample of atf for inspection. Probally be a good idea to put oil in, run it for a couple hundred miles on it, and change the oil. have that sample tested.
What is in the tranny, if there is tranny fluid in the engine?
You could have the oil pan pulled ($$$) and the bearrings inspected, and cylinder walls inspected. But at only 25 miles of drive, probally not a lot of dammage was done. keep a close watch on your oil usage, and oil pressure, that would be your first items to go.
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First and foremost, get a sample as evidence in case they change their minds. If only driven 25 miles, I don't think any harm was done. Good to have the oil pressure checked after good oil is put back in though. The detergant in ATF will actually "clean" the inside of your engine.
You probably have ERS, have it towed to Goodyear or better yet let them arrange the tow and have them make everything right. It probably did not hurt anything. If the pan must be pulled they can do the job. Since they have offered to make it right let them. Try to get everything in writing. Good luck.
Let us know the outcome.
* This post was
edited 09/03/07 08:17am by bldrbuck *
Back in the days of column-shift manual transmissions, my brother brought his F150 in for an oil change & lube. After he noticed people who came in after he did had left already, and everyone in the shop was under his truck, he walked out to see what the problem was. A new employee had removed a bolt instead of the drain plug to check the transmission lube level, and a shifter fork had fallen down into the transmission case. It was a major inconvenience, but he had no trouble getting them to have his truck towed to the Ford dealership and have it repaired at their expense.
In your case, I would document everything extensively. Chances are the truck isn't hurt, but if it is, it may be awhile before the damage makes itself known (increased oil consumption, valvetrain noises, etc.) Try to get things in writing that they will take care of this if it develops within a reasonable period of time. If the dealer mechanics should somehow find proof that something like this occurred, the factory warranty wouldn't cover it.
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An oil change place left the oil cap off my brothers car after an oil change. He headed out for a highway trip immediately after. Drove until the "OIL" light came on. Opened the hood and found the mistake. Refilled with oil and drove back to oil change place. They changed oil again, and cleaned the whole under hood area. He allowed them to call it done at that point.
After a few weeks of driving, he discovered the car now consumes oil when it didn't before. But, how can he possibly prove it.
He has since sold the car (to my other brother who was aware of what happened). The car still uses oil.
I guess what I am trying to say is - don't be quick to "settle". It may take a month or two to see if any damage was done. As a side note, I don't think ATF has "detergent" in it, since the transmission isn't exposed to combusion gasses, ATF doesn't need detergents. I know many back-yarders use it like that (as an oil additive), but it cause more harm then good in these cases. My dad used to dump ATF down the carb to clean out carbon. Don't know if it actually helped, but it sure made a lot of smoke.
It would be much worse if they put engine oil in the transmission. Most ATF is about a 30 weight oil with detergents and anti-foaming additives. ATF is still a lubricating oil and most engines can do just fine on straight 30 weight and 25 miles isn't even enough to get a good cleaning going on in there. Longer use would probably do a better cleaning and if there are a lot of miles on the engine it would probably open up leaks that are covered by internal dirt at the gaskets and seals. Prolonged use would be detrimental to engine life. [Prolonged use being more than 1,000 miles].
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if no oil showed on the dipstick, the crankcase wasn't full which would allow engine damage in a few miles. Engine can operate on ATF as many have used it in past years tring to get better mpgs.
I picked up a stranded 70 year old lady traveler on the pike near me that had her oil changed at a quick lube place about 60 miles away and apparenty they forgot to fill the crankcase. It would run for 10 or so miles and get hot and shutdown. She let it cool and then make another few miles till finally the engine wouldn't turn over. When I stopped to help I pulled the dip stick and there was nothing.
Check the oil if someone else has changed it for you. Goodyear shop will probably fix their screwup.
JIM
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I would think if you didn't drive hard or tow you'll be just fine.
ATF is roughly 10w oil, I'll bet the inside of your engine is spotless.
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I had the van towed to a local Chevy dealer. The Goodyear guys went to the dealership and confirmed that they had put transmission fluid in the crankcase by accident and explained that they tapped in to the wrong line to do the fluid change. Instead of tapping into the trans line, they tapped into an oil line. They offered to do an oil change in the parking lot of the dealer and then take the van to their shop to do the trans fluid. I politely declined their offer, telling them that I had lost confidence in their work. They said they understood and would stand by my decision. I told them in addition to covering the towing and the work at the dealership, I espected them to refund me my money for the original oil change and trans fluid change. I also told them that I was very concerned about future problems and it was my expectation that they purchase me an extended warranty through the dealership to cover any potential future problems. I told them I thought I was being very reasonable with these requests. The Goodyear manager told me he appreciated that I was being reasonable and not reacting in an abusive manner and that he would check with his managers and let me know.
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