Charlie D. wrote: Good move but they don't have the load carrying capacity that I need.
Took my Denman spare back to Tire Kingdom yesterday and told them I did not like the 7+ ounces of weight. They assured me that they lug centered balanced the tire. I had them check again. It was not lug centered balanced. Tire was rebalanced again and weight is now 2 ounce. Same as when the Marathon was on it.
There are several posters on here that say to have them lug centered balanced and I have in the past but did not request it this time.
trailer wheels are lug centered BUT the lugs are not concentric with the wheels mounting flange. Thats why tire shops that have been around the trailer industry awhile simple don't recommend balancing a trailer tire unless the customer insists. Balance a steel trailer wheel/tire assembly and then rotate 45/90 or 180 degrees and mount it back on the trailer hub and it will more than likely still be unbalanced. Well made aluminum trailer wheel tire mounting flange may be concentric to the lugs. Automotive wheels are center hole located to a machined flange on a axle and can be balanced for any position on the hub.
Jim
So you are saying not to balance steel wheels-which is my spare?
I have always felt that you make knowledgeable, sensible and experienced posts and have learned a lot from you. I suspect that we will now see a lot of opposing views? My reply is not intended to be a negative comment on your post and will shortly P.M. you on recommendations on replacement tires for my 2006 D/A crew cab..
Even if trailer wheels are lug-centric, it still makes sense to balance the tire-wheel assembly, IMO. Otherwise if you have a grossly out of balance assembly, it's still going to bounce around, and cause wear and tear to other parts.
I wonder why trailer wheels are not hub centric?? maybe there is just no need..
So you are saying not to balance steel wheels-which is my spare?
I have always felt that you make knowledgeable, sensible and experienced posts and have learned a lot from you. I suspect that we will now see a lot of opposing views? My reply is not intended to be a negative comment on your post and will shortly P.M. you on recommendations on replacement tires for my 2006 D/A crew cab..
I didn't say not to balance your trailer wheels but only brought that concentric point up as to why the tire shop used two different weight and still may not be a good balanced trailer wheel. I didn't want to start another balance the trailer tire and opinions. A tire dealer showed me how out of round the wheel flange is to the lugs were to each other and were (not concentric) the reasons he didn't recommend balancing trailer tires.
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the blur
hub centered requires a hub with a machined protrusion/flange that the wheels center fits on. Most trailer hubs don't have that protrusion or flange so the trailer wheel has a large cutout in the center.
Jim
'03 2500 Dodge/Cummins HO 3.73 6 speed manual Jacobs
'97 Park Avanue 28' with two slides
When I had my Goodyear shop upgrade my Marathon ST205 tires to WranglerHT LT215 tires...the shop owner said there is an adapter or something that he uses to "balance trailer tires" cuz of the concentric hub issue. You are right...if the tire shop does not know what he's doing--you might be better off doing nothing.
But then again...don't most of us replace our rubber cuz it's old--not cuz it's worn?
Tim & Sue
Gerry (GSD) & Jammer (Sheltie)
2005 F150 4x4 Lariat 5.4L 3.73 Please buy a Hybrid...I need your gas for my 37 gallon tank!
2000 Nash 19B...comfortably pimped with a real Queen Size Bed Red Wine anyone?
Never had any Marathon issues on previous race, hybrid and boat trailers so when we did have a flat on the TT last year, we upgraded our OE 4 year old "C" Marathon's to "D" Marathon's and no issues yet.
Old tires were Canadian Eh, but the new ones are made in China - so only time will tell.
IIRC, the rims were OK for the extra tire pressure (65 PSI new VS 50 psi old) and yes - we had them balanced.
I have sold tires for 20 years and never seen a trailer wheel that was not centered on it's hub hole. There are old VW and Porsche rims without centers and some pre 70's trailer wheels without round hub holes,(star center) but that's way into antique today. This lug centric talk is something we joke about in the trade. All wheels except 60's era Peugeots have a hole at their center, it's normal practice. If a wheel isn't hub centric to it's vehicle hub it's center hole must be oversized. It won't find true center and it will generally vibrate due to up and down movement of the mis-centered wheel even if it is balanced. We sometimes see this on multifit aftermarket steel and alloy wheels that some folks buy for trucks, trailers and SUV's. The better ones are hub centric or have centering rings to make the wheel fit the hub correctly. The reason we think lug centric is a wrong term is because when the wheel is located only by the lugs, it does not center correctly unless the installer is really careful and a little lucky. A better description would be non hub-centric. Most big tire shops have the lug plates you describe, they are out back in a box because they are cumbersome, slow to use and in this case unnecessary. The real use for lug plates is for wheels that cannot be centered on the balancer due to odd shape centers where you can't clamp evenly on the center bore, which IS at the wheel center. Any one who can be convinced to use them should charge you extra for the time it takes to setup and use them. They are unnecessary. This is not normal tire service. It is very unusual and requires non-standard operations. If I center cone a current day trailer (or vehicle) wheel on the center hole it will not hop up and down. That wheel can be balanced by normal methods. I think you are spreading a lot of alarm about a situation that is no more. If you have wheels that have an off center hole they are not acceptable according to industry practices. But if you are certain that you have wheels with non-centered holes I defer.
If you are certain of your information please explain, but in my experience something doesn't add up.
05 F150 FX4 Supercrew, 5.4, 3.73 LS, Jordan Ultima 2020 Brake Controller,
04 TrailCruiser 30QBSS, Battery Disconnect,
Dual Cam HP, Ultra Fab Power Tongue Jack, Bal Lockarm Stabilizers
NHguy, I have also read Jims statement. Both of you make since but I am still having trouble understanding how to balance a stell wheel-my spare. When I had the tire mounted on the steel rim the first time, I asked to have it lug centered and ended up with less than 2 oz. of weights. When I had a new tire mounted on this same rim, I had almost 8 oz. of weights and was not lug centered.. It would seem to me that 8 oz. is excessive on a new tire. When I took this tire back, they lug centered the rim and installed 2 0z. of weights.
How do I tell what the best way to balance and if it was balanced properly? They won't let you in the back of the tire store and I don't know if my tire is balanced properly.
(snip)
If I center cone a current day trailer (or vehicle) wheel on the center hole it will not hop up and down. That wheel can be balanced by normal methods.
(snip)
my front end shop does tire balancing as a well balanced tire along with proper wheel aliegnment goes a long way for a better ride and long term tire reliability. Using a cone in the center hole is a poor way to balance a tire/wheel assembly. My 2500 chev for example can't be balanced with a cone as my front end mechanic showed me. The center holes have a chamfer. The chamfer may or may not be concentric with the holes center. My truck wheels are not. He uses a none cone adapter that picks up the center of the hole which a cone adapter cannot as it only picks up the chamfer on the edge of the hole. Lug holes in steel wheels are stamped out. Center holes on trucks/cars may or may not be machined but are usually concentric to the wheels tire mounting flange. Center holes in trailer wheels are larger for any clearence problems with different wheel. The hole may or may not be centered to anything.
As far as spreading any alarm goes I don't see it. Lug centered for trailer tires is still used as the center hole of a trailer tire is for clearence only as its larger than any hub flange on even our trucks. A unbalanced loaded trailer tire won't bounce up and down anyway on those short leaf springs. I don't balanec any of my implement trailer tires or my RVs. Zero issues with irregular tire wear. Thats one reason a tire dealer that has lots of trailer wheel/tire experience from commercial trailer customers doesn't recommend balancing a trailer wheel/tire combo. Any egg shapped tire can be balaced till it rolls on the road.
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charlieD
about the only way to get a good balance on a trailer wheel/tire assembly is the old way of spin balancing. BUT take the wheel off and get the wheel back on as much as a lug off from where it was balanced then it may not be balanced.
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