pritch272 wrote: Nice writeup with pics for the homemade GFCI- question- would you feel comfortable running it 24x7 with AC, etc? What is the worst case scenario if it can't handle the current?
I see the commercial is $74 for club members, but it doesn't look waterproof.
The commercial unit is weather proof but not water proof. I usually cover my 30 amp unit when it is exposed. My homebrew 50 amp unit is in a portable plastic box with a lid.
For the homemade GFCI unit 24x7 would be fine as long as your continuous current draw is in the 20 amp range. Intermittent current draw up to 30 amps would be OK but not for 24x7 use. I doubt seriously that you will have a continuous 24x7 29.9 amp current draw even with a standard RV air conditioner.
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Wayne Dohnal wrote: About earth grounding the Yamaha generator...
Yamaha has taken a conservative approach in the manuals for the inverter generators and says in no uncertain terms to earth ground them. For the purposes of this discussion, the Honda inverter generators are identical units, and Honda does not say to earth ground them. Honda instead says "Before using the ground terminal consult a qualified electrician, electrical inspector or local agency having jurisdiction for local codes that apply to the intended use of the generator". Hardly any users will ever follow either of these directions, and they are both there IMO for the sole purpose of the generator companies trying to duck any responsibility for grounding and bonding. The conflicting, complicated, and ambiguous rules from the NEC and other organizations make it more difficult to know what the right thing to do is. Here's what I consider 'for sure' information: (1) When plugging your RV into a small portable generator, an earth ground is not required, (2) A built-in RV generator is not required to be earth grounded, and (3) When properly hooking either to a house, it will be earth grounded via the house wiring and must not have a separate earth ground.
Just happened to see this thread is active again . . . .and the Yam question (and answer/s) are the reason for this:
I have a Yam 2400is. Nice Gen. It also has the grounding lug and the same owner's info.
No problem with what Wayne states in #1,2,3 above.
(I use the gen in/from the back of the pick-up)
But here's the glitch.
I have a Progressive Industries EMS. (EMS-PT50C)
When in use, one of the "items" it detects is "Open Ground".
Sooooo when in-line with my Yam gen, it "detects" an open ground,
and says "no-go". (Portable models don't have an over-ride).
Haven't tried the PI with the Champ - but guess it would do the same.
For the little bit I use the gen - I just omit the PI from the hook-up, but it would be nice to include it.
Suggestions?
~
JC
* This post was
edited 10/23/09 07:15pm by ol Bombero-JC *
Your Progressive Industries EMS does not really detect an "Open Ground"; it looks for the bond between ground & neutral. If it doesn't detect the bond, it assumes the ground is open. Even if you grounded the generator, without bonding it would still show the problem.
As to bonding, as far as I know, OSHA requires all 120v/240v generators to bond the neutral, but 120v only generators do not need to be bonded, and the link I listed when I started this thread explains why there are good reasons not to. Some generators come with a bonding switch so the user can make a choice.
Obviously, you are probably not subjected to OSHA's regs, but in your case, if you want the EMS to work properly, the bond is necessary. Whether on not bonding will damage your generator is something you need to determine, although I believe that the Canadian versions of the Honda inverter generators are bonded.
Quote: Whether on not bonding will damage your generator is something you need to determine
I think there is a simple logic answer to this, although I must admit it's still an assumption until proven for each individual model of generator. If bonding damaged the generator, then properly using it for backup power in a building would damage it, and I think such a problem would become known quickly. I can personally verify than bonding an eu2000i causes no damage, but can't do the same for the Yamaha 2400. But I would think that a lot of the ef2400is generators have been bonded via their use for backup power.
I will chime in here, I recently purchased the Generac 2000 watt inverter/generator (their version of the Honda) at Lowes. I decided I would try it cause it was a little cheaper. When I plugged it into my 5er, I of course got the open ground code on my EMS. I flipped it to bypass, and got an awful noise from the transfer switch area, sounded like power surges, etc and the generator never changed idle (loaded up). I even hooked the ground/neutral up on it to create the "bond" needed for it to pass thru my EMS, still, would not let any power in. I returned it this morning because something must be wrong with it. It would power up a drill, light, fan, etc, just not my 5er. I buddy of mine had a big Honda 6500 generator sitting on the ground at the race this past weekend. I plugged up to his and it worked just fine, in bypass mode. Not sure what the problem was here but want to know because I am getting ready to pull the trigger on a Yamaha 2400is generator. Is it gonna do the same thing the Generac did due to its small output?
loydt wrote: I will chime in here, I recently purchased the Generac 2000 watt inverter/generator (their version of the Honda) at Lowes. I decided I would try it cause it was a little cheaper. When I plugged it into my 5er, I of course got the open ground code on my EMS. I flipped it to bypass, and got an awful noise from the transfer switch area, sounded like power surges, etc and the generator never changed idle (loaded up). I even hooked the ground/neutral up on it to create the "bond" needed for it to pass thru my EMS, still, would not let any power in. I returned it this morning because something must be wrong with it. It would power up a drill, light, fan, etc, just not my 5er. I buddy of mine had a big Honda 6500 generator sitting on the ground at the race this past weekend. I plugged up to his and it worked just fine, in bypass mode. Not sure what the problem was here but want to know because I am getting ready to pull the trigger on a Yamaha 2400is generator. Is it gonna do the same thing the Generac did due to its small output?
The genset sitting on Terra Firma had nothing to do with it.
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Quote: But I would think that a lot of the ef2400is generators have been bonded via their use for backup power.
I have to agree with you, although most of the small generators, particularly the 120v only versions are probably not designed to drive a home through a transfer switch. I suspect the manufacturers expect the end users to plug individual loads into the generator rather than the entire house...
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