Quote: The very best thing I have done to keep the inside of the camper warm is to line the window openings with a layer of Refletix material.
That's the ticket! Killing the source(s) of ***advection*** throughout the camper is the ONLY WAY to sleep a comfortable night...especially as truck camper sleeping compartments place the body very "close to the walls and ceiling", and in some cases "sleeping compartment windows" not ***thermopane***
It wouldn't matter if you brought your interior temperature up to 80 or even 90F in the truck camper in winter conditions; just sitting (or, sleeping) within 12~25 inches of any window (non thermopane/non winter grade), wall/ceiling section not properly insulated (i.e. thermal bridging is a big problem with almost all RV designs), and especially roof vents (that are not designed as winter-use) will radiate that side of your body closest to said with "cold".
Many good suggestions that I will look into.
As far as not running the genset I was in YNP at Slough Creek no generators are allow as it is in several other campgrounds. I was just putting that out there to see if there were any other solutions.
Thanks everyone.
Tonight I'll put on the floor as I have never done that.
If you do not have carpet on the floor I would add some carpet as well. It is amazing how much warmer the camper will feel and when you are standing on the floor you will feel warmer as well. This winter I will be using a shag with underlay.
On Edit - forgot second part. Get large dog that lays on the bed, major heat source
* This post was
edited 09/28/09 10:52am by Photomike *
drhutch wrote: The very best thing I have done to keep the inside of the camper warm is to line the window openings with a layer of Refletix material. It is a thin foil coated bubble pack material that you can easily cut to size. It made a huge difference in heater run times.
It needs to be tucked in a bit at the corner but you can get the idea. A plus is it really makes the bed area dark which is a plus if you should happen to camp in the Hotel parking lots in Las Vegas.
I too use the Refletix material on the windows, and have the Wave3 mounted close to the floor, set the furnace at about 55 degrees for backup. It is rare that the furnace kicks on.
I usually store the Refletix material under the mattress. I usually leave the Refletix material in the cabover windows during the winter.
I have had many occasions that I had the Wave3 on high, and the TC was so hot I could not take the heat. That means the Wave6 would be too big for my TC, due to the fact its lowest setting is higher than the high setting on the Wave3. It would be great if the Wave6 had a thermostat, but it does not.
If you want the TC 90 degrees inside, and it is 30 degrees or less outside, you probably want to run your furnace and a Wave3 or just run a Wave6. If it is 50 degrees outside, and you want 90 degrees inside, I do not think a Wave6 will go that low. Keep in mind, there is no thermostat on the Wave heaters, at least I know on none.
The following is my opinion:
1 The Wave6 is too much heat for most TCs, except under exceptionally cold weather.
2 The Wave6 will work with mildly cold weather, but you will open most if not all windows and possibly the door.
3 Anytime you use the Wave6, you will use a lot of propane.
4 I do not think the Wave3 or Wave6 will do a good job, if you want to heat from outside temp of 50 degrees to 0 degrees.
5 I think the Wave3 with the furnace as a backup is the best choice, except for extreme cold. The furnace will probably cycle two or three times during the night. That will not be very demanding on the battery.
6 I think the Wave heaters should be mounted near the floor.
7 I think the colder it is, the greater the need for the Refletix material.
8 I think most cold air comes in from the windows, with the door seal as a second source of cold air on most TCs.
narcodog wrote: On the advise of Reddog I bought a Wave 3 heater.
I think it was good advice, and still would advise the same.
narcodog wrote: I have been in Wyo and now Mt. for about a month and have used the Wave almost every night, as it has been in the thirty's and twenty's. The heater works great and uses very little LP but when it is 40 degrees in the rig it is da&m chilly.
There is something really wrong here, if you can only warm the TC about 10 to 20 degrees more than the outside. I wonder if there is an issue with the Wave3.
During the first year I had mine, the pad went bad. I sent it to the factory, they replaced the pad and it has been doing great ever sense then. I was told at the local RV Parts Store that pads used when manufactured were not as efficient as the replacement pads. I should point out the pad was not covered under the warranty.
narcodog wrote: Now I can take it but my wife cannot. I will be picking her up in about nine days in Bozeman for the trip home. When I was researching the purchase of the Wave I was told that the Wave 6 would be over kill.
It is not because it will be overkill, so much as the fact its lowest setting will most likely be too high most of the time that you need heat.
narcodog wrote: Running the house furnace all of the time is not a viable option even with a genset. So I would like to hear from anyone that has a Wave 6 as to the amount of heat that the 6 puts out.
I do not think many use a Wave6 in the TCs. Some do, and hopefully they will post. Perhaps they will comment on the lowest setting. Maybe they use the furnace when just a little heat is needed.
narcodog wrote: I'm planning on one more option and that is to mount a piece of bar stock aluminum across the ceiling and mount the Wave there as it will be pointed directly into the cabover which might solve the problem.
I've been looking at the Wave 3 and Wave 6 for my next camper project, and will probably go with the Wave 6 only because of the btu's available.
The thing with heating any space is that you need to consider several factors. When doing quotes of commercial or residential heating systems. One thing I have found is most engineers underdesign the ammount of heat necessary, and when the temps drop it becomes uncomfortable because of the lack of heat available.
I looked at the furnace in my camper currently, it's a 16,000 BTU model, but the camper is only 11'6" OAL and 6'6" OAW with a 6'1" OAH. The 16,000 BTU is overkill as far as design goes, but is actually somewhat undersized in very cold weather. As for the Wave, I'm going to look at the Wave 6 as the smallest size I would put in, based on BTU output and my view of comfort.
As for comfort, Reddog 1 thinks that the heat from the Wave 6 is too much. Some may think that the heat from a Wave 6 is too little. Each person is different, heck I could only stay in my parent's house to visit for less than 2 hours without going outside because the house had to be heated to 80+ degrees 24/7 due to my mother's failing health conditions. Since she has passed, my father keeps the house at 70 degrees, comfortable for him, but still too warm for me, as I prefer 50-55 degrees as comfortable.
To each their own, and remember you can always shut the heater off if it's too hot, but you can't get more heat out of it if it's putting out the maximum heat possible.
Good luck
Life is short, Play harder.
2002 GMC Sierra 1500 Regular Cab Long Bed 4.3L V6 Automatic 2WD
In a TC there are several things one needs to consider when camping in cold and even sub-freezing temps.
The first is the insulation of the TC. As others have said it is far easier and cheaper to work on the insulation envelope than to ignore it and add devices to overcome the heat losses through the floors, walls, ceiling and vents/skylights.
I posted a couple of years ago while in -9*F temps in Idaho I found the TC to be cold and drafty and uncomfortable. The water lines froze to the rear dry bath and the insulation was non existing in several areas. In -9*F you can find the cold areas in a heart beat as the cold air drops and can be felt with your hand/arm very easily.
To recap here are some areas to look at. The TC vents need the foam pads stuffed into them in all that will not be used. Yes it will be darker but it will be far warmer and this is needed more than light. Use the bubble reflective insulation on the windows and vents that you may want to open or in the case of the Wave use you will be opening a vent and air will flow between the gaps in the insulation and the vent frame it is attached too. Don't open the vent more than a 1/4-1/2 inch as the opening will be too large and cause the TC to cool too much.
In nearly all TC's the wing area, that is the part that extends over the pickup bed side and goes horizontally out to form with the wall outside of the PU bed, is made of 3/4" plywood and has ZERO insulation. If you have a slide or cabinets here you should be able to reach inside the cabinets or under the slide and add some insulation here. If you have openings for the power cord and the outside shower the inside of these boxes need to be insulated too. I found that the small box that holds my power cord, about 10"x10"x4", allowed so much cold to come through, but no real leaks, that in -9*F it felt like a large open window. Wrap this box, if you can, on the inside and it will go a long way to reducing heat loss.
Every area must be addressed as the smallest area ignored will leak heat and since the interior volume of a TC is so small it will cool the TC down quickly.
Bathroom skylights or other skylights are huge heat robbers. You will need to have a custom foam block made to insulate these. Once foam plugs are wedged into these skylights there will be a huge warm gain noticed.
Look at your refer cut out and the side walls which are just some paneling on the inside with no insulation. Insulate here also. The refer cabinet floor too if you can. Don't forget your propane bottle cabinet and the battery box. In the case of the battery box try to insulate the outside door as it would help them to be warmed from the inside warmth. Here is where AGM batteries, not needing to be vented, come into play. Look for any gaps where pipes or wires route through walls or floors as these also add up and could easily be as large as an open vent in volume.
I think you get the idea.
TC's are build like so much junk by folks who may be well meaning or not. Since we see how shoddy the work they did was, it falls to us to fix it. Cold weather insulating and repair is vital to attain comfortable cold weather camping. It will be hard to do well as some areas are not easily reached and may not be reachable at all. All one can do is the best one can and hope it is enough. Once ALL the reachable areas are insulated and it is still too cold then the next step is to add a heat source to over power the heat loss of the TC.
Sadly you are now entering uncharted territory. Each TC brand and model is different. How well you did in insulating will require less heat to be added to reach a comfortable level and this is also unique to each users needs. One mans comfort is another woman's cold.
I would think that a WAVE 3 on high should be fine for a tightly insulated TC down to about 20*F but as yet I have not tested this. If your TC is large like mine and has a slide this may not be large enough. I have the Wave 3 and will find out if I made a wrong choice. If it is really cold and you have a slide-out try leaving the slide-out in over night. It should be warmer for two reasons.
1) there is less surface area exposed to the weather and the seals will be better sealed and doubled up.
2) there is less interior volume to heat and to radiate heat to the outside.
If you cannot function inside the TC with the slide in you could hang a thick blanket up as a wall cutting off the slide out area and thus reduce the interior volume a bit and reduce potential drafts.
I know this is a lot of work. In a perfect world the builder would have done this for us. But since this is not the case look at it as a challenge and remember it is only something you have to do once. It will also make your TC a bit quieter and cooler in the summer as well.
Having the TC well insulated may also be far cheaper than buying more batteries to run the furnace more and getting a bigger AC unit too. Using less energy is good for the environment and your wallet. But the biggest return is it will allow you to boondock longer without having to break camp for more propane or gas for the genny.
Better insulation is passive it requires you to do nothing but enjoy it's warming or cooling effects.
Allen
2005 Ford F-350 CC Dually 6.0L Diesel 4x4 King Ranch loaded, Supersprings, Coolant filter, Oilguard bypass filter.
Go to the local hardware store and purchase a Mr. Heater "Buddy" heater. Also buy a hose that connects to one of your propane tanks(uses unregulated propane) and connect the other end to Mr. Heater. Feed hose thru back window or compartment hatch on side of camper. Note: Commercial hoses have a shrader valve(tire valve) at heater end and you must make sure hose has air bled from it before connecting to heater. Mr. Heater will drive you out of the camper and it is SAFE with low oxygen sensor incorperated into unit. Whole unit is around $100.00 If one heater is not enough fire up both, or use bigger when colder outside. Remember, when wife is happy, everyone is happy.
I have the equivalent of the Olympian wave 6 (same btu output but older Olympian model). I also installed an in-line shut-off valve. So, when I have the heater on low and it's still too hot, I simply start closing the shutoff valve and wait a little bit to see if more or less heat is needed. Works like a charm and saves a ton of propane.
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