We have downsized from a Pleasure-way Excel to a low-top Explorer van conversion that I want to modify somewhat for camping. The first need I will have is placing a house battery in the unit and having it charged by the engine alternator. The placement I can figure out, other than that I don't know where to begin. I'll have many more questions as time goes on but this is step number one. Any suggestions or help would be appreciated, hopefully in layman's terms.
Do you have a 12 volt fuse panel for the things in the coach? If not, you will need one. You can buy a 6 fuse holder, that will hold automotive fuses, and that is normally enough to run one light circuit, and a couple of circuits for 12 volt things, like a small inverter, cigarette lighter to plug in a portable TV, 12 volt fan, ect.
If you install a AGM sealed battery, I think they can be in a compartment that is not vented outside, and if so, this would be the best way to avoid cutting a hole to vent the hydrogen from the battery.
You can get high quality deep cycle AGM batteries from this place. TrojanBattery.com
Look for one that you can lift, and will fit into a compartment where it will be safe from something metal getting on top of the battery terminals.
I would recommend installing a 30 amp circuit breaker next to the battery, and next to the battery in the engine compartment. Then install a relay (probably under the hood) that will be energized only when the key is on. (this way the battery will charge when the engine is on, but will not discharge the engine starting battery when the engine is off). The radio has a 12 volt line going to it, that is only on when the key is on. You can run a small wire from that area to under the hood, to the new relay, and that will energize it when the engine is on.
Then install a #8 wire from the +12 volt of the coach battery (the new one) and to the fuse panel. Use 12 gauge wire to whatever you are hooking up, and fuse it with a maximum 20 amp fuse. Or #10 wire for a 30 amp fuse, or #14 wire for a 15 amp fuse, but I would recommend #12 wire because it will have less voltage loss, and is still a reasonable price.
I recommend a separate light circuit, so if you plug in a motor or something and the fuse blows, you can still have lights. Every modern house has 2 light circuit breakers, so you never are left completely in the dark.
It is all like a dot to dot drawing. Really easy once you are done, and look back at the project. Just don't cross the dots!
You should use white wire for the grounds in the 12 volt system. I like to use a bussbar to combine all of the grounds together in one location, where the wires can be kept tight. Then run a #8 wire back to the battery, and to the chassis, and for the lowest voltage loss, to the engine battery as well.
Your stock alternator is probably over 100 amps capacity, and that is plenty to recharge the second battery.
If you have space for a larger battery, Trojan makes some with 150 amp hours. Look for a Group 31 or 5SP - if they make them in a AGM. Absorbed Glass Matt batteries are sealed, and do not use water, do not need ventilation (I think) and can be mounted almost anywhere. Lead acid batteries you would need to add water once in a while, and they give off hydrogen gas when they are recharged, or you are using power from it. That hydrogen would need to be vented outside.
Thanks Fred, This is the kind of information I was hoping for, and I understand most of it. One concern I have is based on a post on the CVC forum a couple months ago regarding the engine and/or body control modules being fried by improper wiring by a Class B manufacturer (Roger, I'm not mentioning brands). I don't want to have a warranty issue with GM so I would like to be 100% certain that I won't harm the modules. I once had an after market remote starter installed on a new Chevy truck, after the installation I had problems with the transmission shifting and it was all blamed on the remote starter installation, that was an expensive nightmare.
Think of the 12 volt second battery as a accessory for the van, and everything run from that 12 volt panel is not connected to the chassis except through the relay that is turned on only when the engine is running.
One thing I did not mention above is that you need a way to recharge the battery if you are in a RV park, and have shore power, or are using a generator.
If you have a 220 amp hour battery (about 130 pounds, more than adaquate for a van set-up), then the best charge rate for a long battery life is 22 amps for 10 hours. A longer battery life might use a C/20 rate, or 11 amps per hour.
So a charger rated at 30 - 45 amps will work fine with your battery pack, less than 220 amp hours. It will also power the lights inside at the same time.
I suggest a Olympic Catalytic heater, and hook it up to a chassis mounted 8 - 15 gallon propane tank. Mount the tank under the chassis, and use a regulator with a auto-shut off if there is a propane leak. The heater only requires 4,000 Btu's and can be removed if you have a feet kit, and quick disconnect, to detach it from the van. You will also require a roof vent to let out the fumes, and I use a Maxx air cover, so no air gets in. I also have a Fantastic fan, with a 250 CFM fan inside, to provide ventilation in the summer or while cooking.
I guess you are also thinking about a bathroom facility?
What about fresh water? The very basic is a portable blue plastic 7.5 gallon tank from Wal Mart, rated to carry drinking water. The flexible ones that are 5 or 2.5 gallons make the water taste bad.
For a gray tank, in one of my campers, I used a tank I bought at a garage sale, that had been a fresh water tank in a old trailer. It fit right between my frame extensions that mounted my rear bumper, and when extended 12" to hold my camper, the tank fit right into that space. I put a garden hose valve on the bottom fitting, and then drain when required.
Never drain into a storm drain anything that you would not drink. Drain into a sanitary sewer, septic tank or other location that will accept sewage.
charles wrote: We have downsized from a Pleasure-way Excel to a low-top Explorer van conversion that I want to modify somewhat for camping. The first need I will have is placing a house battery in the unit and having it charged by the engine alternator. The placement I can figure out, other than that I don't know where to begin. I'll have many more questions as time goes on but this is step number one. Any suggestions or help would be appreciated, hopefully in layman's terms.
The DIY crowd here can make better suggestions if we know what capabilities you want.
If you plug in to shore power all the time then you can get by with minimal requirements.
Advice on battery bank sizing, iso/combiner switch, inverter/charger, proper fusing, wire sizes, auto transfer switch, breaker panel, gen or solar tradeoffs all available.
I chose a design heavy on efficient electrical devices with a big bank and inverter. This allowed me to skip the plumbing and gas fittings for our year round boondocking style. I was surprised by the lack of need to carry my gen set for most of our camping.
Right now I'm only concerned about having 12 volt rechargable power for occasional needs while traveling. Possibly to keep a small fridge/cooler cold while we're on the road, extra lighting when needed, using a small inverter for small electrical devices, etc. When we do stay at a campground, it's simple enought to bring electricity and heat into the unit so I wouldn't be concerned about the battery at that point. We will mostly use it for travel but want the extra comfort and conveniences that a 12 volt system would allow. Plumbing, which I would get into later would be minimal, limited to a porta-pot, and a small self contained sink. Space is also a concern as this is a low top 1500 Class van, not extended or raised. The interior is complete top to bottom, I'm only adding a few things that are camping related.
If you go to the Roadtrek site and download their PDF Chevrolet Owner's manual you can get a pretty thorough electrical diagram in how they set up their Bs.
Davydd
2005 Pleasure-Way Plateau Sprinter B Camper Van
Davydd is the Welsh spelling for David with an English twist using a v instead of an f. See Our Pleasure-Way and my pork tenderloin sandwiches
Visited states in an RV
charles wrote: Right now I'm only concerned about having 12 volt rechargable power for occasional needs while traveling. Possibly to keep a small fridge/cooler cold while we're on the road, extra lighting when needed, using a small inverter for small electrical devices, etc. When we do stay at a campground, it's simple enought to bring electricity and heat into the unit so I wouldn't be concerned about the battery at that point. We will mostly use it for travel but want the extra comfort and conveniences that a 12 volt system would allow. Plumbing, which I would get into later would be minimal, limited to a porta-pot, and a small self contained sink. Space is also a concern as this is a low top 1500 Class van, not extended or raised. The interior is complete top to bottom, I'm only adding a few things that are camping related.
Nick
Most small electronics convert to dc internally and can function fine off cheapo small inverters. Just be careful you don't get one that makes audible or electronic noise. You might have to hardwire one or install a power point if you need to draw more than 5 dc amps.
A high efficiency compressor chest fridge like an ac/dc Engel consumes on the order of half a battery a day. Wonderful performance, big enough for your only fridge but expensive. Our 65 qt model does extra duty in the stick house as a second freezer or a party fridge. Portability adds plenty of value. I've been pleasantly surprised how cold a beverage in it has been a day after I turned it off. Expensive, but it really, really works.
The cheap thermo-electric fridges work poorly in hot weather. I'd go with an ice chest instead.
A small ac "dorm" fridge would probably withstand highway miles and might be useable on the road with a better hard wired inverter but that's asking for battery trouble. If room is tight, it'd probably be better to find one that you could fit an Igloo Cube inside or perhaps enough frozen ice containers between plug-ins.
It may be my 6'4" height (in a 6'1" inside height van) but I don't understand why so many people want to build a sink in. Dishpans are cheap, portable, and stack. Great for conserving water. Really easy to dispose of the dishwater. And I'd so much rather make a mess outside the van than inside.
Thanks everyone. I picked up the van on Saturday and am mostly spending time measuring and thinking where to put what. There is a lot of storage space under the electric sofa bed and that is where I think I'll start with the battery itself. The second row seats come out and they each leave only a small bracket that is about 1/2" above the carpet. I've decided to have a thick carpet remnant padded and edged to cover the open area after removing the seats. This will give me about 56" in width and about 65" in length when the sofa is in the seat position, more than enough space to add what I'll need. When the sofa is down, everthing we carry will be under it and we'll have about 42" of floor space left between the front seats and the end of the bed, should work out great. Best of all, it does fit in the garage.
I'm now curious about the kind of battery trouble a hard wired inverter would cause as that is one of the options I was considering.
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