Francesca Knowles wrote: I would like ANYBODY to post a link explaining how Amish Workers build RV's without power tools, artificial light, or internal combustion engines.
Plus how they keep from getting fiberglass stuck in their beards.
Internal combustion engines are fine with them. Artificial light is OK as well. Many have solar panels and often have gas lamps. Power tools are OK as well as long as they are not electric. I sold a radial-arm saw to an Amish gentleman who converted it with a gasoline engine. Many have a telephone in what looks like an outhouse at the end of the driveway, some even have fax machines.
Many have the misconception that the RV factores are these gleaming modern marvels, very few are. Most RV are assembled with air guns and not much else.
Agree Unions have their place. However. A company that treats it's employees right, does not need a union. Plus, As a former card carrying Afl Cio member. I can tell you, unions benefit the company as much or more than they do the workers.
NC is a RTW state. Has been forever. And guess what. The good companies have all the benefits that the bad union companies do. And they stay here. Smart Companies provide good benefits to keep good help. It seems they have learned. You get what you pay for. Pay low wages, and no benefits. You get workers that will leave you in a heart beat. Pay well, Give them a stake (incentive) in the outcome. they will make sure they do their best to make the company succeed.. after all. the company is worthless with out good employees, and employees don't get paid without the company. It takes both working together.
That is why. WE are the best at what we do. they treat us OK, and we do good work. Simple
As I said. I was a union member. It will never happen again, after the way they acted.
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edited 02/03/12 12:43am by an administrator/moderator *
Doesn’t matter who builds them or how much they are paid, if they are not given the time and tools to build quality you won’t get quality…
People look at unions with tunnel vision from both sides…
It was corporate greed that created the need for unions in the first place…
It was the unions that made us the most progressive country in the world… gave us the high standard of living that we have learned to love…
By virtue of that high standard of living non union companies profited from the unions just as the union company did… Non union workers profited just as the union worker did…
It was the unions successes and greed that unraveled their worth…
Unions gained as much as they did quite frankly because they negotiated better than the management teams who took the easy way out when bargaining… passing the cost on for them and made their life easier and
settlement usually meant a raise for them as well… least we forget management always had the upper hand with a host of lawyers and bean counters at their disposal and always had the last word on accepting or rejecting any contract…
Love my mass produced, entry level, built by Lazy American Workers, Hornet
I'm very proud to say that my pension comes from the NYS Teamsters Conference. Pension & Retirement Fund and was paid for by transportation of products made from 100% North American crude oil refined in a US owned and operated refinery which employed union Pipe Fitters and union Operating Engineers. And it is not the BIG pension with BIG benefits that many of you would claim just because you think Teamsters get big pensions. Don't even get a retirement health plan.
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edited 02/02/12 10:16pm by wny_pat *
Francesca Knowles wrote: I would like ANYBODY to post a link explaining how Amish Workers build RV's without power tools, artificial light, or internal combustion engines.
Plus how they keep from getting fiberglass stuck in their beards.
Internal combustion engines are fine with them. Artificial light is OK as well. Many have solar panels and often have gas lamps. Power tools are OK as well as long as they are not electric. I sold a radial-arm saw to an Amish gentleman who converted it with a gasoline engine. Many have a telephone in what looks like an outhouse at the end of the driveway, some even have fax machines.
Many have the misconception that the RV factores are these gleaming modern marvels, very few are. Most RV are assembled with air guns and not much else.
That is all stuff that they did not use 10 or 15 years ago. I know several who own and use cell phones. And they use gas operated generators to power their electric tools. And when they work for someone else, they use the materials provided them, and if it is cheap materials, so be it. If the staples are of lessor quality, so be it. They work when their suppose to and take breaks when their suppose to. No different than the other guy one the line. And if you have them build you a house, it still has to pass inspection, just like any other builders work does. Nothing special about them. Good honest people, but some have their problems just like many of our worker who are not Amish.
Agree Unions have their place. However. A company that treats it's employees right, does not need a union. Plus, As a former card carrying Afl Cio member. I can tell you, unions benefit the company as much or more than they do the workers.
Companies that treat its employees right don’t need unions, and employees of those companies don’t need unions… I would hope the company did benefit as much as and usually more than the worker… the fact is they both do need the other… I am not sure what the card carrying member remark has to do with it… being a card carrying member doesn’t mean one is a good union man or a good employee…
NC is a RTW state. Has been forever. And guess what. The good companies have all the benefits that the bad union companies do. And they stay here. Smart Companies provide good benefits to keep good help. It seems they have learned. You get what you pay for. Pay low wages, and no benefits. You get workers that will leave you in a heart beat. Pay well, Give them a stake (incentive) in the outcome. they will make sure they do their best to make the company succeed.. after all. the company is worthless with out good employees, and employees don't get paid without the company. It takes both working together.
Exactly why stakeholder capitalism works all though we have turned away from stakeholder capitalism…
That is why. WE are the best at what we do. they treat us OK, and we do good work. Simple
I have worked both union and non-union jobs and had my own business and always took pride in what I did, the company or union (good or bad) had no effect on that…
As I said. I was a union member. It will never happen again, after the way they acted.
While I can’t comment on the way they acted, I wasn’t there, but I can say my brother and my brother in law both were involved with the cost accounting and the awarding of bids and hiring contract labor in the building trades, and even though they were anything but union people themselves they tell me that they preferred and used union companies and labor very often… in the trades they consistently got better trained labor, had fewer repairs and fewer litigation problems that way…
There is good and bad in anything…
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edited 02/03/12 12:49am by an administrator/moderator *
Star Gazer wrote: Can't imagine what an RV would cost if they had union shop wages??
Quality would likely improve...
HA! If only. Did you forget the pieces of junk coming out of Detroit for many years that were built by the overpaid UAW workers?
EXACTLY! I know I will be flamed for this but assembly line work is NOT skilled labor. Assembly line workers making more than the skilled labor out in the real world fixing/repairing??? Makes NO sense to me.
In this area the Amish build a lot of pole barns...They use power tools all day long in their construction of these barns. They drive engine powered vehicles to the job sites as well
Francesca Knowles wrote: I would like ANYBODY to post a link explaining how Amish Workers build RV's without power tools, artificial light, or internal combustion engines.
Plus how they keep from getting fiberglass stuck in their beards.
Once again, Ignorance is bliss.
The Amish who work at the plants Have no problem USING power tools, lights etc.......TO aid in raising their families/communities.
However.........in their own homes they believe in a "Simple , self sufficent life".I.E. they are not "Hooked up" to power lines, telophones in their homes, etc... They use horse and buggies to move their families, etc..
Not all "Amish"believe in Total NO power tools, lights etc.....BUT some (Who would not work at RV plants) still believe in NO Power , of any kind.
I have seen Amish farmers harvesting Corn, with a Horse drawn Gasoline powered...picker (last fall by Shipshawana )
If you ever get the chance, please stop by a Amish, Mennonite, community, and find out about their beliefs, way of life....it makes a lot of sense, in many ways.(I, am not ready to live that way, though)
Oh, "Beard nets" (just like hair nets, but for beards)answer of how they keep fiberglass out.
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I learned about the American Federation of Labor and the Chicago International Organization, Teamsters, International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers, Retail Clerks International A (forgot what the A was for), at an early age. Just as with most organizations, there are good apples and bad apples, and unions are no different. Many of us remember Dave Beck being sent to prison in the late fifties or early sixties. Unions have helped many in past years and also many union bosses have ridden on the backs of workers.
Times change, technology changes, and social issues and customs change which probably has much to do with the general demise of unions in the private sector. Considering current and projected economic adjustments in the public sector I'm not too sure of the future there either.
As both sides of the union issue have been somewhat explored it's probably best to move on to another subject.
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