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Open Roads Forum  >  Tow Vehicles

 > 6.0 PSD- reliability after the mods

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Wills250psd

walnutcove NC

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Posted: 02/18/12 08:32pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

bmanning wrote:

Wills250psd wrote:

I think you can find a 6.4 for 20k get a h@s tunner not for power but so you can delete the DPF and turn off the egr without setting off check engine light and set it to (no power) which is stock power and and it is awesome. I did it last wednesday and have been towing 8.5k since then the difference is unbelievable.the sound aint bad either.


Intriguing thought...what kind of mpg are you seeing in around town driving with your tuned 6.4L? I am a fan of the styling of 08+ Super Duties but the 6.4's documented lust for dead dinosaurs had put them a bit down on my list...
I have towed over 1200 miles so far, all at once no mixed driving and am getting 14.4 towing(hand calculated) but I have been one of the lucky ones I was getting 15 not towing before tunning etc, until the last ford flash when it droped to 11mpg not towing and was regen cycling constantly. It was the best thing I have done to this truck and from my research it will increase engine life by 2-3X. now if you run the high tunes I doubt the engine would last as long.I could not be happier.the 6.4 is a heavyer duty engine than the 6.0. you can find a video on youtube that showes the engines and parts side by side and there is no comparison.

Bird Freak

Calhoun, Ga.

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Posted: 02/18/12 08:34pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Has anyone else on this forum ever noticed when there is a post about a problem with a Dodge are a Cummins comes along no one jumps in to bash them. Let a simple question come up about a Ford and it won't be long before the same Ford bashers jump in with their same old crap. You guys need to grow up sometime. I have owned them all and am not loyal to any of them and never will be. I have never seen anything man made that is bullit proof. You guys can fool yourself all you want.


Eddie
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JPhelps

SE of Monkeys Eyebrow & Possum Trot

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Posted: 02/18/12 10:01pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

O4FX4 said:
Quote:

You will have a bullet proof diesel if you do those mods..


Alpenliter said:
Quote:

Get it? Jeesh!


I had it all along. How about you? NO?
Reading is paramount.

* This post was edited 02/18/12 10:09pm by JPhelps *

Jarlaxle

New England

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Posted: 02/18/12 10:16pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Bird Freak wrote:

Has anyone else on this forum ever noticed when there is a post about a problem with a Dodge are a Cummins comes along no one jumps in to bash them. Let a simple question come up about a Ford and it won't be long before the same Ford bashers jump in with their same old crap. You guys need to grow up sometime. I have owned them all and am not loyal to any of them and never will be. I have never seen anything man made that is bullit proof. You guys can fool yourself all you want.


A Cummins or a Duramax isn't a hand grenade waiting to pop...a 6.doh is. The 6.0 PSD deserves every bit of bashing it gets and ten thousand times more.

But yeah, I hate Ford trucks so much I have an F-350, which replaced...an F-350.


John and Elizabeth (Liz), with 3 nutty cats
My beloved St. Bernard, Marm, lost him 1/2/12
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NewsW

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Posted: 02/18/12 08:45pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Alpenliter wrote:


Bulletproof is the name of the company that did the upgrades. Get it? Jeesh!



You mean 6.0 doesn't refer to the number of rounds in a Colt 45?



NewsW

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Posted: 02/18/12 08:49pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Bird Freak wrote:

I have owned them all and am not loyal to any of them and never will be. I have never seen anything man made that is bullit proof. You guys can fool yourself all you want.



Basically it is a choice of which set of problems you want to have and who you go for service and parts.

But problems you will have, more or less.

If there is such a thing as a problem / trouble free piece of machinery, there would be no service and parts departments at every dealer.

Having said that, some problems are easier to fix than others.

All diesels circa 2000 - 2010 have to adjust to drastically changing rules and regulations, from fuel changes to emission regs.

Gassers just didn't have that much change since the mid 1970s and the mid 1980s.

MackinawMan

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Posted: 02/19/12 08:08am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

JPhelps wrote:

Quote:

I'm just curious but does it REALLY bother you that this guy is "ripping" on a truck?

It's a truck...it's not a Mom, or a Dad, or your homeland...or religion.

Its.....A......Truck........

A ford is also just...... a...... truck.......
I don't buy the superlatives used in this thread "bulletproof", "reliable 500 hp" referring to the 6.oooh.
And yes, 500 hp 12 Cummins with 500,000 miles on them do exist. 500hp 6.oooh's with 500,000 miles on them don't exist and never will.


A Ford sure is...which is why I don't respond to anybody ripping them. I've been around here a while..and I still laugh at the guys on here ripping on brands of trucks while thumping their chest because they drive a "Ford/Chevy/Dodge".

Who cares...it's...a....truck...


2000 Ford F350 XLT 7.3L PowerStroke Diesel CC 4x4 OffRoad SRW Long Bed
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smknf250

San Diego

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Posted: 02/19/12 10:02am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

JPhelps wrote:

Quote:

I'm just curious but does it REALLY bother you that this guy is "ripping" on a truck?

It's a truck...it's not a Mom, or a Dad, or your homeland...or religion.

Its.....A......Truck........

A ford is also just...... a...... truck.......
I don't buy the superlatives used in this thread "bulletproof", "reliable 500 hp" referring to the 6.oooh.
And yes, 500 hp 12 Cummins with 500,000 miles on them do exist. 500hp 6.oooh's with 500,000 miles on them don't exist and never will.


Let's see dodge Stopped using the 12 Valve Cummins in 1997 and ford Started using the 6.0 in 2003 do you really expect to see a bunch of 500,000 mile trucks running around in 8-9 years? I can tell you I have only seen a handful of Dodges with 500,000 miles on them...I have seen a bunch with 200-300,000 miles and none of those are trucks I would EVER want to own, they look like they have been lived in for the last 15 years and probably have been. I am also curious if the OP is looking to put 500,000 miles on the truck he is purchasing. If he is I would suggest buying something new.

To answer the original question, I have owned 3 6.0s and I am sorry to tell you I never put 500,000 miles on any of them however, I was able to make them all reliable in my eyes. My 2004 I did the most mods to because I had it tuned and was about 450 RWHP. I had the common oil cooler failure which led to the EGR cooler and headgaskets failure at about 40,000 miles. I did ARP studs, Black Onyx gaskets, EGR Delete, new oil cooler (oem) and changed to ELC coolant instead of the Ford Gold. The truck ran tuned, and towed 11,000 pounds often to 100,000 miles without any other problems other than a ICP sensor. It did not puke, run hot, leak oil. It performed perfectly and unlike my 97 Dodge 12 Valve (I only put 80,000 miles on it) I didn't have to replace the transmission and the brake pads and rotors lasted three times as long as my dodge.

I will give the OP one last piece of advice. If you are going to mod your 6.0 or if you ever have the heads off, have them checked by a machine shop and magnafluxed for cracks. Maybe people that have repeat problems with puking at putting in studs, but putting warped or cracked heads back on. There is no point in doing all that work and then putting a bad head back on.

NewsW

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Posted: 02/19/12 10:20am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

smknf250 wrote:

If you are going to mod your 6.0 or if you ever have the heads off, have them checked by a machine shop and magnafluxed for cracks. Maybe people that have repeat problems with puking at putting in studs, but putting warped or cracked heads back on. There is no point in doing all that work and then putting a bad head back on.



Just a minor technical note.

A lot of people who had the heads off were machining them flat and in the process, introducing to them a warp when the heads were tightened down again.

The heads do not need to be completely flat longitudinally.

By doing so, the so called flat heads after machining had a high probability of leaking.

The head flatness checking procedure for the 6.0 deviated from what machinists commonly understood and knew --- and many shops were basically introducing a major flaw / fault into the heads by their "fix".



This issue was addressed in a little known and ill understood TSB by Ford:

Quote:


TSB 06-21-10
6.0L - REVISED CYLINDER HEAD FLATNESS CHECK
PROCEDURE AND SPECIFICATION
FORD:
2003-2005 Excursion
2003-2007 F-Super Duty
2004-2006 E-350, E-450, F-650, F-750
ISSUE
Some vehicles equipped with a 6.0L engine may require the cylinder head to be removed and a
new cylinder head flatness check has been developed. This check is to ensure the component part
is not out of factory specification prior to installation. The surface quality (finish) of the cylinder
head gasket surface is machined to close tolerances which enable an effective sealing joint for
the multi-layered steel (MLS) gasket.
ACTION
Follow the Service Procedure steps to verify cylinder head flatness meets new specification.
SERVICE PROCEDURE
Preparation
^ Ensure all head gasket surfaces are clear of any gasket debris, RTV, oil, and coolant using
Motorcraft(R) Silicone Gasket Remover (ZC-30) and Motorcraft(R) Metal Surface Prep (ZC31).


NOTE

DO NOT MEASURE FLATNESS IN THE LENGTHWISE (LONGITUDINAL) DIRECTION!
THE OVERALL END-TO-END FLATNESS OF THE CYLINDER HEAD IS NOT AS
CRITICAL AS THE LOCALIZED FLATNESS CHECKS. LONGITUDINAL
MEASUREMENTS ARE NOT AN ACCURATE INDICATION OF FLATNESS WHEN
INSTALLED DUE TO THE CLAMP LOAD OF THE HEAD TO BLOCK BOLTED
ASSEMBLY. THE BOLTED CONDITION CAUSES AN OVERALL FLATNESS
CONDITION THAT DIFFERS FROM THE FREE STATE CONDITION OF THE HEAD.






If you don't want to factor in the cost of replacing the heads and redoing a botched job that involved removing the heads and machining them in error, do not buy a 6.0 that have ever had the heads off or have "improved" ARPs installed.

Chances are that the job was botched.


This is probably the reason for many 6.0s having repeated incidents of HG failures --- or cracked heads --- or other issues that is caused by warped heads.

ARPs, by applying more clamping force, can remedy this if it is not too extreme.

But that is not true in many cases.


In many cases I know, the "fix" is much worse than the "disease".


I have seen cases where engines with no evidence of Head Gasket / Heads failure were taken apart, heads improperly machined flat, then repaired with ARPs, only to spring a big HG leak that wasn't there before.

The solution was to replace the now too thin and warped (or machined flat when installed) heads with brand new ones.

Nice, huh?

* This post was edited 02/19/12 10:30am by NewsW *

NewsW

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Posted: 02/19/12 08:27am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Hey, can someone tell me who I rip if I have a Ford with a Cummins engine in it?

Or what if I have an old GMC / Isuzu?

Got to get my loyalties right here.

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