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Open Roads Forum  >  General RVing Issues

 > $100 for a estimate for body damage

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4x4van

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Posted: 02/26/12 06:55pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

JayWalker2009 wrote:


Walking through a store and not buying anything is certainly not an apples to apples comparison as someone spending time and effort working up a written estimate for you.

Which is exactly why I said the following:
4x4van wrote:

True, lots of apples and oranges being compared here...as well as peaches, nectarines, and bananas. I acknowledge that giving a body damage estimate for an RV is a whole different animal than an auto, which can be done in 15-20 minutes, so perhaps a fee for RV body work estimate is justified.

It is, however, another cost of doing business, of which there are many. Some are billed directly, and others indirectly, and every business owner decides where the line between those two shall be drawn. But every potential customer that walks through the door still costs that business money if they end up not purchasing something. So while we may indeed be comparing apples to oranges, it's all still fruit!

Again, we all expect, and receive, certain things for free from businesses every single day. Anyone who disputes that is lying to themselves.


We don't stop playing because we grow old...We grow old because we stop playing!

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JayWalker2009

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Posted: 02/26/12 07:00pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

4x4van wrote:

JayWalker2009 wrote:


Walking through a store and not buying anything is certainly not an apples to apples comparison as someone spending time and effort working up a written estimate for you.

Which is exactly why I said the following:
4x4van wrote:

True, lots of apples and oranges being compared here...as well as peaches, nectarines, and bananas. I acknowledge that giving a body damage estimate for an RV is a whole different animal than an auto, which can be done in 15-20 minutes, so perhaps a fee for RV body work estimate is justified.

It is, however, another cost of doing business, of which there are many. Some are billed directly, and others indirectly, and every business owner decides where the line between those two shall be drawn. But every potential customer that walks through the door costs that business money if they end up not purchasing something. So while we may indeed be comparing apples to oranges, it's all still fruit!


Yes, you said that, but was still making the comparison anyway even when it wasn't apples to apples, hence your comment about does anyone expect to walk through a store for free. If it isn't apples to apples, why bring it up as a comparison statement?

And to this
4x4van wrote:

My point is that we all expect, and receive, certain things for free from businesses every single day. So for anyone to claim that they don't, well I suggest you open your eyes a bit wider.


No, I don't expect anything free. But when I get it, I am always pleasantly surprised, I don't feel entitled. There is a HUGE difference in the consumer who EXPECTS some things to be free and the consumer who doesn't expect it, but grateful when it happens.

Don & Linda

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Posted: 02/26/12 09:20pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

4x4van wrote:

Ooooh, nice "dig", ...."full text above"...
But I'm curious, since you're so noble, how much did you pay the RV dealer's salesman for the time spent negotiating when you purchased your RV? And I'm going to go out on a limb here and assume that you didn't buy the very first one you looked at, which means you probably wasted more than one dealership's time without buying. As has been said, time is money...and those salesman spend all day long talking to people who, like you, didn't buy the product.

The last time you bought tires for your TV, did you call more than one tire place and get price quotes? I'm sure you paid those tire shops for that, right? After all, it took them time to look up the tires, figure out the mounting & balancing, valve stems, disposal fees, etc. No? Hmmm, I guess that there are at least some things that you want and expect for free as well, aren't there? So which of your 2 categories do you fall into?


"(Ooooh, nice "dig)" Please believe, I had no intent to serve a "dig". I was just stating my observations, of your and other's posts.

Some are for, paying the cost of a complex estimate and some expect them for free.

The OP should perhaps keep a tally of those "pay vs. free" and edit the count into the primary post.


As for wasting "salesman's time", I never have. I mostly deal with the owner of the items that I purchase. New car, used, RV,...same deal. DW does the "shopping" - I do the "buying" The items DW shops for, never have a salesman attached... I hope.

On home ground, I buy my tires from wholesalers and install them myself. The tires I've needed while away? I choose a good looking tire dealer and get what I need. (Once needed a rear inner on a MH while on the road. Stopped at Flynn's Tire (OH/PA) and bought all 6. Flynn's was fair.)

I guess you can decide which category I fall into.


Sorry if this post seems long, I lacked the time to make it shorter.
almost quote from S.L. Clemens

Don & Linda

1st RV UL EMS 4s Dome
2nd RV 21' AMF Scamper TT PV D300 Dodge
3rd RV National Seabreeze 133LX w/Demco Dolly
4th RV Jayco 2450 5TH PV Ford F-250 SD


4x4van

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Posted: 02/27/12 08:31am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

JayWalker2009 wrote:

If it isn't apples to apples, why bring it up as a comparison statement?

Because of the general mindset being expressed about not “expecting anything for free”.

JayWalker2009 wrote:

No, I don't expect anything free. But when I get it, I am always pleasantly surprised,

When you walk into a (insert store of choice here) to browse through their products, I do not believe that you are “pleasantly surprised” that the store is open for that convenience…I believe that you ”expect” it. That is just one example of the things that you, and I, and all others do in fact “expect” for free, every day. It may not be something that you consciously think about, and it obviously is not at the same level as an individualized written work, but it does happen, it is a cost of doing business, and it is in fact subsidized by those who do end up purchasing something. To claim that you never expect or receive any of that is disingenuous at best.
Don & Linda wrote:


Some are for, paying the cost of a complex estimate and some expect them for free.

Guys, you’ve convinced me that I was wrong with my initial reaction to charging a fee for an estimate. Having dealt only with autobody repairs and not RV body damage, I was a bit unfamiliar with the issue. At least in my area, autobody repair estimates are generally not charged for. However, I have acknowledged that an estimate for RV body damage is likely much more complex and as such likely justifies a fee.

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Posted: 02/27/12 09:58am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

4x4van wrote:

When you walk into a (insert store of choice here) to browse through their products, I do not believe that you are “pleasantly surprised” that the store is open for that convenience…I believe that you ”expect” it. That is just one example of the things that you, and I, and all others do in fact “expect” for free, every day.


As I said prior, walking through a store browsing products is NOT the same as getting something for free where some type of work is being performed. A store has to be open - whether zero customers are browsing or 100, it creates no extra work for the store if they are simply browsing. They are not expending any extra energy by opening their doors and people coming in and out. If you are going to use an example, find something congruent to the situation being discussed. If those same customers coming into the store were bringing an item in for repair, at that point a service is being performed and they might be charged an estimate fee depending on the type of work and complexity of obtaining that estimate. Simply walking thru a store whose doors are open is not like getting services rendered and as such would not involve a fee. To better prove my point, even your paid discount warehouse stores like costco that charges fees to shop will let you walk through their store and browse free of charge because browsing is not rendering a service.

If you go into that store and ask for an estimate, depending on the complexity you may or may not get charged a fee. Being charged for estimates in many types of businesses is NOT uncommon. For those who are flabbergasted with this, simply find another repair shop. And auto repair shops have been known to do this as well. Depends on type of estimate, etc.

* This post was edited 02/27/12 10:31am by JayWalker2009 *

Grub

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Posted: 02/27/12 10:30am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

NONE of the body shops in my area charge for estimates.


Any day enjoying the great outdoors beats any day enjoying your 8x8 office cube!

JayWalker2009

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Posted: 02/27/12 10:31am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Grub wrote:

NONE of the body shops in my area charge for estimates.


That doesn't mean it is not a common practice in many areas, and if they did charge you are free to find another shop.

4x4van

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Posted: 02/27/12 01:47pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

JayWalker2009 wrote:

As I said prior, walking through a store browsing products is NOT the same as getting something for free where some type of work is being performed. A store has to be open - whether zero customers are browsing or 100, it creates no extra work for the store if they are simply browsing. They are not expending any extra energy by opening their doors and people coming in and out.
But it still costs the business owner money to keep that store open. And it is not costing you a dime. So you ARE getting something for free. Whether or not your presence there affects that is irrelevant; the business owner is still expending money that allows you to browse without paying. And that cost that allows you to browse IS subsidized by those customers who DO buy something.
JayWalker2009 wrote:

If you are going to use an example, find something congruent to the situation being discussed.
Fine. The minute you ask a store employee a question of any sort (Don't try to tell me you have never spoken to a store employee), that employee is now giving you personal attention that you are not paying for.
JayWalker2009 wrote:

Simply walking thru a store whose doors are open is not like getting services rendered and as such would not involve a fee.
We're arguing semantics here now, as I have already acknowledged (3-4 times) that a fee is justified for a written estimate requiring significant time.
JayWalker2009 wrote:

Being charged for estimates in many types of businesses is NOT uncommon.

And I don't dispute that, although in many other types of businesses, it IS uncommon. What I am trying to point out is that the claim of "never expecting anything for free" is untrue at the most basic level. Even you receive things for free from businesses every single day, and you do expect those things. The fact that they may be minor or inconsequential to you or others doesn't change the underlying truth of that statement.

Obviously, I am not able to get my point across, and we are now just beating a dead horse and accomplishing nothing new or productive. You will continue to believe that you get nothing without paying in life, and I will continue to believe that we all get alot out of life for free.

* This post was edited 02/27/12 04:08pm by 4x4van *

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Posted: 02/27/12 05:09pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

The cost of doing business keeps going up. Rent, salary, elec. gas, etc. I give free est on repairs but don't know how much longer I can do it. My time is NOT free and depending on the est, it could take 1/2 hour or move to determine the extent of the repair, parts, paint etc. Everytime I stop doing a repair to do a free est., it is lost money if the customer is only looking for the second or third est for insurance purposes. Give the small business owner a break ... free est. are going to be a thing of the past or there won't be small business owners or businesses.

JayWalker2009

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Posted: 02/27/12 05:17pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

4x4van wrote:

JayWalker2009 wrote:

As I said prior, walking through a store browsing products is NOT the same as getting something for free where some type of work is being performed. A store has to be open - whether zero customers are browsing or 100, it creates no extra work for the store if they are simply browsing. They are not expending any extra energy by opening their doors and people coming in and out.
But it still costs the business owner money to keep that store open. And it is not costing you a dime. So you ARE getting something for free. Whether or not your presence there affects that is irrelevant; the business owner is still expending money that allows you to browse without paying. And that cost that allows you to browse IS subsidized by those customers who DO buy something.
JayWalker2009 wrote:

If you are going to use an example, find something congruent to the situation being discussed.
Fine. The minute you ask a store employee a question of any sort (Don't try to tell me you have never spoken to a store employee), that employee is now giving you personal attention that you are not paying for.
JayWalker2009 wrote:

Simply walking thru a store whose doors are open is not like getting services rendered and as such would not involve a fee.
We're arguing semantics here now, as I have already acknowledged (3-4 times) that a fee is justified for a written estimate requiring significant time.
JayWalker2009 wrote:

Being charged for estimates in many types of businesses is NOT uncommon.

And I don't dispute that, although in many other types of businesses, it IS uncommon. What I am trying to point out is that the claim of "never expecting anything for free" is untrue at the most basic level. Even you receive things for free from businesses every single day, and you do expect those things. The fact that they may be minor or inconsequential to you or others doesn't change the underlying truth of that statement.

Obviously, I am not able to get my point across, and we are now just beating a dead horse and accomplishing nothing new or productive. You will continue to believe that you get nothing without paying in life, and I will continue to believe that we all get alot out of life for free.


You just don't get it, and I'm not explaining it any further. You expect things for free, I don't. Case closed.

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