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Open Roads Forum  >  Fifth-Wheels

 > Need an opinion from the "weight police"

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oldbiker7

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Posted: 03/04/12 12:47pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

CLHEJ wrote:

Hey all. It looks like I am getting one step closer to a complete new rig. I am negotiating on a 2012 Chevy 2500HD Crew Cab 4wd with a standard box. After researching the tow ratings, it looks like my max tow rating is 15,800 pounds and I would assume that is for gooseneck/fifth wheel towing.

I'm currently looking at 5ers with a dry weight of 9000-11000 pounds.

What do you all think?

Thanks in advance!
Craig


My 2011 version of the truck you are looking at weighs 7,840# with driver, full tank and hitch leaving 2,160# of cargo capacity. My dry trailer was 9,900# and loaded (including water) was 11,220# with 8,900# on the axles and 2,320# pin weight transferred to the truck. That puts me 160# over but I am still well under the truck axle and tire ratings and since I don't usually carry water I believe I am fine. That said I think you will be fine if you stay under 12,000# GVW for the trailer and pick one that does not have excessive pin weight.


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JTrac

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Posted: 03/04/12 02:15pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

All I know is what I did and what I learned in ordering a GMC 3500HD diesel yesterday so I will try not to come accross as an expert, which I ain't. I posted this on a thread I started about empty ride quality of a 2500 vs 3500 so sorry for the repeat. After spending a lot of time with the salesman and owner of the dealership last week the best we could find in the differences in the two trucks is there are 2 leaf springs in the 2500 and 3 in the 3500. Look on page 29 of the 2012 Sierra brochure. Everything else, including tires, as far as we could determine was the same. On page 38 it shows the max payload and max trailering weights for the diferent configurations.

I priced a 2 wheel drive 2500 SRW, standard box Denali with options for in bed trailer connections, sliding rear window and camper style mirrors. Then I priced the same thing in a 3500 and the difference in my cost was $411 more. Not much to consider there so the order for the 3500 went in Saturday. I gained over 900 lbs in payload capacity over the 2500 but only 600 lbs in max trailering fifth wheel weight. Not sure how that works.

Also, I assume you know there is a $2K rebate good thru 4-30 plus another $2750 if you trade in a 99 or later truck for a 2500 or 3500 with a diesel.


JimT
2013 Excel Winslow 34RKM, 2015 GMC Denali 3500 Duramax, 4X4 dually


Lantley

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Posted: 03/04/12 02:59pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

JTrac wrote:

All I know is what I did and what I learned in ordering a GMC 3500HD diesel yesterday so I will try not to come accross as an expert, which I ain't. I posted this on a thread I started about empty ride quality of a 2500 vs 3500 so sorry for the repeat. After spending a lot of time with the salesman and owner of the dealership last week the best we could find in the differences in the two trucks is there are 2 leaf springs in the 2500 and 3 in the 3500. Look on page 29 of the 2012 Sierra brochure. Everything else, including tires, as far as we could determine was the same. On page 38 it shows the max payload and max trailering weights for the diferent configurations.

I priced a 2 wheel drive 2500 SRW, standard box Denali with options for in bed trailer connections, sliding rear window and camper style mirrors. Then I priced the same thing in a 3500 and the difference in my cost was $411 more. Not much to consider there so the order for the 3500 went in Saturday. I gained over 900 lbs in payload capacity over the 2500 but only 600 lbs in max trailering fifth wheel weight. Not sure how that works.

Also, I assume you know there is a $2K rebate good thru 4-30 plus another $2750 if you trade in a 99 or later truck for a 2500 or 3500 with a diesel.

That's just it the price between a 3/4 ton and one tone trucks is negligible. Your deal points out some hard numbers However the price difference between the two trucks has always been negligible.
For the added payload it is a no brainer to get the bigger truck.
Furthermore the dually is not that much more either vs. a 1 ton particularly in the used market.

The reason so many people are overloaded is not the cost of the vehicle but more a case of the owners not doing their homework and educating themselves on the towing parameters.
They purchase a 3/4 ton truck believing it can handle the load. By the time they figure out they are exceeding their limits it's too late.

Eventually they play the upgrade game which is when the real financial hardship comes into play. Good Job JTrac for getting it right the first time. Experience has taught me that getting right the 2nd time always cost a bit more


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greende

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Posted: 03/04/12 05:54pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I just went through this same issue last fall. Had an '08 2500HD Dmax and loaded it up with DW, kids & a full 23 gals of diesel. After weighing it at the CAT scale I had 1400 pounds of payload left. The DRY pin weight of our new 5er was 1500 pounds. Unloaded I was 100 over. I thought about it for a day or so and got a 3500 DRW. Now we can upgrade to a heavier 5er without worry in the future. While the new 2500HDs have a greater capacity than my old one, I vote for the SRW 3500.


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JIMNLIN

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Posted: 03/04/12 08:49pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I see in another post your getting a 13750 GVWR 5th wheel trailer that has a 3000 lb CCC and a 10700 shipping weight and a 1750 dry pin weight.

Now we all know you won't load 3000 lbs in your trailer and pull at its max GVWR, so realisticaly it may be closer to approx 12500 lbs. Less if loaded lighter. The 2500 has a 15xxx lb tow rating so the truck will have no problems pulling the trailer in any terrain.

Now how much load can the 2500 in question carry. GM gives the truck a 6200 lb RAWR. GM says the 2500 LTZ Dmax crew cab std bed truck has a rear unladin axle weight of 2855 lbs which leaves the truck with a 3344 lbs for a max payload per GM weight calculator. Sure the 2500 truck will be close to max axle loaded but over its GVWR if your into figuring axles loads by using the trucks GVWR.
Your call there.


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imjustdave

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Posted: 03/05/12 05:29am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

[quote=JTrac]I posted this on a thread I started about empty ride quality of a 2500 vs 3500 so sorry for the repeat. ......

I priced a 2 wheel drive 2500 SRW, standard box Denali with options for in bed trailer connections, sliding rear window and camper style mirrors. Then I priced the same thing in a 3500 and the difference in my cost was $411 more. ..... I gained over 900 lbs in payload capacity over the 2500 but only 600 lbs in max trailering fifth wheel weight. Not sure how that works.
Quote:



I think this post sums it up well... 2500 VS 3500 SRW... $411 more for 900 lbs capasity. and 600 towing capasity.

900 lbs is well 900 lbs, as you did ask the weight police, think about a worst case scenaro and you end up in court over a death and they bring up that your irrisposible for not having enough truck.... that 900 might mean something. Also lets face it how much do air bags cost? + installation?

Seeing as you pay for your tounage used not what the truck can haul... I have yet to see anyone provide a real negative - to a 1 ton?
Cost is well nill
lic cost is well nill
Same drive package
most use a hellper spring setup so.. confort should be fairly close.
replacment Parts in a SRW are basically the same - nill

With 250 and 350 costing basically the same, I think most people should be debating if they want training wheels or not....

Also before you make any decisions, go and actually weigh the truck, 5vr and get some real numbers...


Dave
06 Dodge 3500 DRW


David

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OldGreaser

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Posted: 03/05/12 06:40am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

If you can put your hands on the exact trailer you plan to buy, you should find a yellow sticker on the entrance door frame that lists the trailer VIN and the actual dry weight from a weigh scale, plus the GVWR, and a calculated CCC. My unit's actual dry weight was 1200# heavier than the brochure weight due to options. Of course an actual loaded weight would be even better, but that's not easy to do before a sale. The more accurate dry weight might help for cipherin'.

Lantley

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Posted: 03/05/12 06:50am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

OldGreaser wrote:

If you can put your hands on the exact trailer you plan to buy, you should find a yellow sticker on the entrance door frame that lists the trailer VIN and the actual dry weight from a weigh scale, plus the GVWR, and a calculated CCC. My unit's actual dry weight was 1200# heavier than the brochure weight due to options. Of course an actual loaded weight would be even better, but that's not easy to do before a sale. The more accurate dry weight might help for cipherin'.

This is very good advice. I experienced the same scenario. This is why using dry weights is not advisable

BWS1105

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Posted: 03/05/12 10:44am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Hello,

New here and to RVing trying to determine what all of these capacity numbers mean. My initial thought was getting a 2500 Ram Larime, but after reading this thread I guess I am a little concerned. It is listed as having a max tow of 10,550 and a max payload of 2499.

Is this is telling me that the entire weight cannot exceed 10,550 lbs? Like I said I a new to all of this but that seems to be less that the GVWR of most of the RV's I am looking at.

Any help would be appreciated.

Ric Flair

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Posted: 03/05/12 12:15pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

oldbiker7 wrote:

CLHEJ wrote:

Hey all. It looks like I am getting one step closer to a complete new rig. I am negotiating on a 2012 Chevy 2500HD Crew Cab 4wd with a standard box. After researching the tow ratings, it looks like my max tow rating is 15,800 pounds and I would assume that is for gooseneck/fifth wheel towing.

I'm currently looking at 5ers with a dry weight of 9000-11000 pounds.

What do you all think?

Thanks in advance!
Craig


My 2011 version of the truck you are looking at weighs 7,840# with driver, full tank and hitch leaving 2,160# of cargo capacity. My dry trailer was 9,900# and loaded (including water) was 11,220# with 8,900# on the axles and 2,320# pin weight transferred to the truck. That puts me 160# over but I am still well under the truck axle and tire ratings and since I don't usually carry water I believe I am fine. That said I think you will be fine if you stay under 12,000# GVW for the trailer and pick one that does not have excessive pin weight.


Oldbiker, You need to immediately turn yourself in to the nearest weight police sub station for re-education.

Seriously though, I was struck by how similar our rigs are. However, my GVWR is ~1,000 less than yours so I'm safe(for now) from "Doolie Do Right".


2013 GMC 3500 DRW 4x4 SLT Duramax
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