Thanks Bob, that was my intent with this thread, check your frames.
We're heading out on a 2 week fishing/camping trip this weekend, really looking forward to it.
* This post was
edited 06/05/12 09:47am by Fisherguy *
06 Dodge Ram 3500 Cummins 6 spd std with a few goodies.
Guess you missed my point as well. My above post didn't even mention gussets. I was stating that if your user "patch job" (or some might say "hack job") cracks and/or doesn't work, simply build a new frame under your trailer box. And, set your trailer chassis box ontop of the new frame (leaving its crappy factory frame "as is"). That was my point of my 2nd post (3 threads above). Sorry you missed it - and got your head stuck on gussets tunnel vision...
Guess you missed my point as well. My above post didn't even mention gussets. I was stating that if your user "patch job" (or some might say "hack job") cracks and/or doesn't work, simply build a new frame under your trailer box. And, set your trailer chassis box ontop of the new frame (leaving its crappy factory frame "as is"). That was my point of my 2nd post (3 threads above). Sorry you missed it - and got your head stuck on gussets tunnel vision...
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That would be a heck of a job. Just curious would the new frame be the same size or would it be a shorter version?
Guess you missed my point as well. My above post didn't even mention gussets. I was stating that if your user "patch job" (or some might say "hack job") cracks and/or doesn't work, simply build a new frame under your trailer box. And, set your trailer chassis box ontop of the new frame (leaving its crappy factory frame "as is"). That was my point of my 2nd post (3 threads above). Sorry you missed it - and got your head stuck on gussets tunnel vision...
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I think it's you that's confused, here, let me make this simple for you.
Have a look at my FIRST post, see the 4th picture? The 8" long piece of 2" flat bar welded at an anlgle between the bottom of the i-beam and the web creating a gusset?
I'm saying Lippert does that from the factory now and those new frames ARE NOT cracking!!
So everything else I've done is over and above that, get it? Way stronger than the new ones that aren't cracking.
Yesterday you tell me "looks great", "great job", now you're calling it a "patch job" or "hack job". I don't know what I've done to change your mind, but you know where you can shove the latter comment buddy!
BTW, I think your Jayco is built on a Lippert frame, be sure to post your frame on a frame mod when it's done, okay?!
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edited 06/05/12 11:37am by Fisherguy *
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I couldn’t begin to say why yours cracked, but I have seen almost identical cracks before, several times at a friends weld shop that does repairs for several RV dealers…
What we have to remember before making any mods or changes, that we are starting with a product that in most cases is minimally, or under engineered, and at best just marginally engineered for it intended purpose…
This picture I messed up the sizing and haven’t been able to correct it but though small you can see the crack forming in the same location as yours…
Another… had a gusset been placed from the bottom to the cross members to the lower flange this might not be as much of a issue to begin with…
I may have a half dozen pictures of similar damage on other trailers I seen over the years…
This centre hanger is a high stress area on all trailers, and is where a lot of lateral stress is applied and cracking occurs… problem being these beams aren’t well adapted to lateral stress as built…
I understand your concerns about tires… those concerns created a OCD for me in researching the issue, but I am cured now…
While my own research for switching to LT tires for my heavy TT I found out that the Tire change would farther stress the chassis through a much harsher ride caused by the tires straighter sidewall shape, and higher air pressures… lateral stress would also be increased by the tire change, that bring caused by deeper and more aggressive treads not side scrubbing as easily… rear loading compounds the stress at this location…
For these reasons I went with the only tire choice I thought I had left and that was the Maxxis ST tire…
This frame crack is caused by something entirely different… overloading the frame behind the bumper with a welded on receiver… you notice all the lines of rust, they are more cracks that just haven’t broke though yet…
My friend has repaired many like this… the people were told by the welder that he guaranteed to the owner the hitch was good for 500+ pounds…
TRUE, but he didn’t mention to the owner that the guarantee didn’t expend to what it was welded to or that the frame it was welded to might not be fit to carry the hitch weight…
This is why I always say to contact the trailer or the chassis mfg first…
Love my mass produced, entry level, built by Lazy American Workers, Hornet
I have had 3 TTs now. The first one had horrible looking welds, but all the steel was heavy and I never had any issues with it (1975 Prowler)
The second one was a 2001 Fleetwood Wilderness. The welds were what I would call average. Steel had some meat to but after some years things were needing some welding work every now and then. (I can weld so it's not the end of the world.) No idea who made the frame.
This latest one is a Lippert frame, axles etc. And it appears to be first class. All the welds look first rate, and the steel although not as beefy as the first TT, appears to be super strong and well thought out.
It has the gussets that the OP added. Even though it is only a couple of years old now, it has been down quite a few rugged roads and probably over 10,000 miles. I am pretty confident that it won't have any issues.
It came with a frame mounted rear rack rated for 450#!! I have probably put 300-350 on it so far without incident.
I also went from 15" 28" tall LRD ST tires to 16" 32" tall LRE LT tires.
Not sure what years or plants were the problem frames. Mine is a 2010 and it was made in the Goshen plant.
* This post was
edited 06/05/12 04:32pm by Huntindog *
Huntindog
2010 Palomino Sabre 30BHDS TWO bathrooms...No waiting!
MICHELIN XPS RIBS LRE
2011 Silverado Big Dually 3500 4x4 CC D/A
EQUALIZER Hitch 100% BOONDOCKING
Check out Rusty and her pups at www.bluecollarbrittanys.com
One thing that bothers me is that some manufacturers don't design in a reasonable load carrying capacity in their RVs, perhaps that part of the reason we see structural failures?
SkipJ
1992 Airstream B-190 van
1989 Airstream 25' Excella Trailer
Outfitter Apex 9.5 Truck Camper Ford F-350 Diesel 4x4
SkipJ wrote: One thing that bothers me is that some manufacturers don't design in a reasonable load carrying capacity in their RVs, perhaps that part of the reason we see structural failures?
SkipJ
I've been seeing that a lot. One rig I looked at had a CCC of 300 pounds once the propane tanks and FW tanks were full. Three hundred pounds. That means without adding bedding, toilet paper, clothes, towels, or personal items, the rig would be overloaded with just two people and a cat.
I wonder sometimes if we sometimes see frame failures because the frame is shipped as specced... but the RV maker way under-specced the frame. So, when something breaks, the frame maker gets the blame, not the RV maker who failed to take into account real-life weight expectations, or just took the cheap route.
This latest one is a Lippert frame, axles etc. And it appears to be first class. All the welds look first rate, and the steel although not as beefy as the first TT, appears to be super strong and well thought out.
Looking closely at my Lippert frame, the welds in the suspension area look really well done. That guy ( or gal ) knew what they were doing.
However, his buddy who welded up at the nose end of the a-frame must have been a first year middle school shop student. Pretty sorry looking, but so far it is holding up okay, even with the stresses of a WD hitch.
As for the margin between the weight of the camper as it sits, and the GVWR....sheesh, this thing has something 2700 pounds of capacity for "stuff". In my config as it sits right now, ready to pull out of the driveway ( all water tanks dry ) I have only added just over 400 pounds of cargo. I can't imagine what else I would take, but then I tend to be pretty much a lightweight packer, having come from decades of motorcycle touring.
SkipJ wrote: One thing that bothers me is that some manufacturers don't design in a reasonable load carrying capacity in their RVs, perhaps that part of the reason we see structural failures?
SkipJ
I've been seeing that a lot. One rig I looked at had a CCC of 300 pounds once the propane tanks and FW tanks were full. Three hundred pounds. That means without adding bedding, toilet paper, clothes, towels, or personal items, the rig would be overloaded with just two people and a cat.
I wonder sometimes if we sometimes see frame failures because the frame is shipped as specced... but the RV maker way under-specced the frame. So, when something breaks, the frame maker gets the blame, not the RV maker who failed to take into account real-life weight expectations, or just took the cheap route.
Wow, 300 pounds? Was that one of the "lightweight" models by chance? That's crazy.
The factory welds on my frame look fine but that's not much good if the frame is built too light.
I've heard that story before too, Lippert saying they built the frame to the trailer manufacturer's specs, so who do you believe? the fact that Lippert frames are having problems on numerous makes of trailers tells me the problem is with Lippert, but who knows?
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