teddyu, thanks for your reply but I need to clear up a few things before you jump to your conclusions. Yes it's the same unit we had all the original problems with when we first picked it up. No need to rehash all that as a anyone can go back and review what our situation was at the time. Unfortunately it took about 4 months but thankfully what needed to be corrected was done by Newmar.. I also never knocked Newmar's product but rather the way they had let the unit leave the factory with so many problems thereby leaving it up to me the purchaser to deal with. Major things like a bad rear end gear set should be fixed before giving a unit to a delaer to sell. Then to top it off several of the repairs had to be made more than once because they weren't done right the first time. We brought it to the factory because we assumed they would be best at making the repairs and overall it would be less down time for our coach. Possibly it's the norm for the RV industry but almost 4 months to make warranty repairs on a new coach seemed excessive to my wife and I.
Anyhow, the unit, layout, overall design and Newmar's reputation is why we purchased this unit and we do indeed like the coach. We wish we had more time to use it but for now our 2-3 times per year will have to do.
Let's get back to my actual objective here on the forum, i.e. hoping to get some valuable input about what if any options I have to increase the overall performance of the unit since it wasn't available in a more desirable diesel option.
Rearding weight, we certainly have never been by any means overloaded, not unless Newmar wasn't truthful about the approximate UVW. The GCWR of our unit is 30,000. The UVW is supposed to be around 20,500 per Newmar's specs. I haven't weighed the coach but our 4 passenger weight total was 510 lbs. We had no toys in the toy hauler area and only the average "stuff" a family would carry for a trip like we took. Summer clothes and the usual things to consider like water, fuel etc. The unit should have around a 5,500 lb NCC so no posssibility of being overloaded.
The Ford gas V10 in stock form unfortunately doesn't have sufficient torque or horsepower for a 40' Class A RV. Given the frontal area of the coach, overall weight, transmission and rear end gearing it simply is overtaxed. I'm not complaining or saying Ford or Newmar is to blame. I was fully aware of the type engine I they supplied with our coach. I knew it wasnt going to be a hot rod as you say by any means. I have cars that are indeed performance cars and know the extreem physical differences between and RV and any other vehicles. I'm simply gathering information to see if it's feasible to cost effectively increase the torque and horsepower of the Ford V10 for this application. The Ford F53 truck chassis might be a very capable in the various truck applications it's used in but it falls short in our particular RV application and I'd like to improve it.
Warranty isn't an issue because our 2010 Canyon Star was actually built on a 2008 Ford F53 chassis. Ford goes by their VIN number and date code and as the Ford dealer and Ford's warranty department pointed out would expire 3 years after the 2008 delivery date to Newmar and not our purchase date of the completed coach. It is already put of warranty. Besides, the Banks changes would not void a factory warranty as they were only external exhaust and intake modifications to let the engine breath better. A major change such as adding a supercharger or turbo charger would void a warranty but again that's not an issue with our 2008 chassis at this time. Just to clarify, the Banks items were added right before our recent trip.
Lastly, the power issue isn't mine and having owned other RV's, dozens of large SUV's with gas and diesel engines and having towed large enclosed trailers my whole life, I have realistice expectations of vehicle power and their capabilities. My objective with power enhancements would be to use the cruise control at 70 mph without our coach downshifting over just about every overpass. As it is now I don't use the cruise much or turn it off before any hill or overpass so I can work the throttle myself and keep it from downshifting as much saving wear and tear on the transmission as well as some fuel. I'd like to be able to still drive along at 70 mph into a headwind or sidewind while staying in 5th gear. As it is now we can't do that all the time depending on the winds. My expectations might not be realistic for a coach of our size but I'd like to improve on it if I can.
Hey everyone, thank you all for your relies and input. Most understood what I was asking and information I was looking for and I do appreciate the feedback. Still researching and will let you know what the final outcome is.
look into a vortec supercharger. turbochargers are harder to install and much harder to tune, supperchargers are relatively easy to install and your computer can compensate for a mild supercharger even with out a special tune
Don;t usually write social comments, but... Is this the same coach you wrote about in '"Problem Class A" or is this normal?' in this forum late last year? Seems like you really don't like this unit. With all the warranty problems you had, I'm suprised that you modified the engine and voided its warranty by the Banks installation. Or was this modication in place when the ring and pinion had to be replaced? Or the brake caliper? It was recommended in this thread to have the vehicle weighted to ensure it is not overload. I beleive the UVW is about 19500 lbs which leaves about 2500 lbs for Toys, passengers and camping provisions. Not much IMHO. Add a TOAD and your close to my unit. My unit preforms just fine for a GCVW of >24000 lbs. These things are not Hot Rods. You said your researched before purchase; not very well I suspect. Is this power issue Ford's, Newmar's, or DVREDC5's? If this was a vote, I'm sure you know how I would vote. JM2ยข...
Give your coach a break.. You can't compare a deisel to a gasser by any means. I'm suprised no one here has brought up the fact of elevation. This has a serious impact on gasoline engines, even in today's standards with computers and stuff. At elevations higher than 4,000 feet, you are going to see a decline in HP because of the thinner air. The computer in your coach can only do so much, but beyond that, it's up to science. You can't fool science.
We just did a trip in Northern Ca and we went from Tahoe to June Lake via Monitor Pass. I was pedal to the floor and doing 30. Not that it mattered, wouldn't want to do more than that on that road anyway, but up in the high elevations I could feel the difference. It's a give and take. For the most part, I actually can't beleive how much power my F53 has. BTW, we were towing a Jeep Cherokee with a lift and some aftermarket stuff suitable for a trail rig. One other question, do you have the 22,000 chassis or the 24,000? Ours is the 24,000.
Best answer trade for a Diesel 350 or better. The mountains are horsepower/torque robbers.Even a diesel will struggle to lumber up. Just enjoy the ride!! and take your time.
The 30K you listed is Gross Combined Weight Rating, which includes 4K of towing capacity. The unit has 26K of vehicle capacity according to both Ford and Newmar. That is the biggest chassis Ford makes at this time, if you truly have an 08 chassis you may only have 24K of vehicle capacity.
PerNewmarr specs; Chassis: Ford F-53 26,000 lbs.
Length: 39 ft.
Slides: 3
GVWR: 26,000*
UVW: 21,304*
CCC: 4,696*
The 20,500 will include fuel, doesn't include any water, or propane, or people or stuff, oh and it will not include any options that were added to the base unit or added by the dealer. So you can see you maybe much closer to overloaded than yocomparisony comparision my 06 Dolphin is 36' with a 22K GVWR and 26K GCWR and I run real close to the 22K when loaded up with 3 of us the dog and stuff for a 2 week trip. My performance isn't bad, no race car but not bad. I can't imagine though pushing around another 4K of weight plus the overall length. Oh and the only difference between my chassis and yours is wheelbase, no change in gearing or engine output.
I think Newmar messed up and put too much RV on the chassis trying to hit a price point. I have seen this before when the manufacturer pushes the limit of the chassis to hit a price point since the next chassis up will add a price premium that the coach can't absorb. The first year Bounders were horrible for being overloaded on the front axle. Put a 175 driver in and a 100 lb co-pilot and the axle was overloaded, and that was without any maps or even a cup of coffee up there with them.
Ray, Cheryl, Cory & of course Miss Molly the four-legged child
Fla Tom wrote: look into a vortec supercharger. turbochargers are harder to install and much harder to tune, supperchargers are relatively easy to install and your computer can compensate for a mild supercharger even with out a special tune
If I had a choice... you can hang remote turbos (ala Squires) on an F53 chassis without much fabrication cost. Now whether the engine/fuel system is up to task is another story.
Sizing wouldnt me much of a problem since the task is about increasing low end torque. My only concern would be extended climbs would the charge air become overheated. More R&D questions that most dont want to spend the $$$ to find out answers too.
DVREDC5 wrote: teddyu, thanks for your reply but I need to clear up a few things before you jump to your conclusions. Yes it's the same unit we had all the original problems with when we first picked it up. No need to rehash all that as a anyone can go back and review what our situation was at the time. Unfortunately it took about 4 months but thankfully what needed to be corrected was done by Newmar.. I also never knocked Newmar's product but rather the way they had let the unit leave the factory with so many problems thereby leaving it up to me the purchaser to deal with. Major things like a bad rear end gear set should be fixed before giving a unit to a delaer to sell. Then to top it off several of the repairs had to be made more than once because they weren't done right the first time. We brought it to the factory because we assumed they would be best at making the repairs and overall it would be less down time for our coach. Possibly it's the norm for the RV industry but almost 4 months to make warranty repairs on a new coach seemed excessive to my wife and I.
Anyhow, the unit, layout, overall design and Newmar's reputation is why we purchased this unit and we do indeed like the coach. We wish we had more time to use it but for now our 2-3 times per year will have to do.
Let's get back to my actual objective here on the forum, i.e. hoping to get some valuable input about what if any options I have to increase the overall performance of the unit since it wasn't available in a more desirable diesel option.
Rearding weight, we certainly have never been by any means overloaded, not unless Newmar wasn't truthful about the approximate UVW. The GCWR of our unit is 30,000. The UVW is supposed to be around 20,500 per Newmar's specs. I haven't weighed the coach but our 4 passenger weight total was 510 lbs. We had no toys in the toy hauler area and only the average "stuff" a family would carry for a trip like we took. Summer clothes and the usual things to consider like water, fuel etc. The unit should have around a 5,500 lb NCC so no posssibility of being overloaded.
The Ford gas V10 in stock form unfortunately doesn't have sufficient torque or horsepower for a 40' Class A RV. Given the frontal area of the coach, overall weight, transmission and rear end gearing it simply is overtaxed. I'm not complaining or saying Ford or Newmar is to blame. I was fully aware of the type engine I they supplied with our coach. I knew it wasnt going to be a hot rod as you say by any means. I have cars that are indeed performance cars and know the extreem physical differences between and RV and any other vehicles. I'm simply gathering information to see if it's feasible to cost effectively increase the torque and horsepower of the Ford V10 for this application. The Ford F53 truck chassis might be a very capable in the various truck applications it's used in but it falls short in our particular RV application and I'd like to improve it.
Warranty isn't an issue because our 2010 Canyon Star was actually built on a 2008 Ford F53 chassis. Ford goes by their VIN number and date code and as the Ford dealer and Ford's warranty department pointed out would expire 3 years after the 2008 delivery date to Newmar and not our purchase date of the completed coach. It is already put of warranty. Besides, the Banks changes would not void a factory warranty as they were only external exhaust and intake modifications to let the engine breath better. A major change such as adding a supercharger or turbo charger would void a warranty but again that's not an issue with our 2008 chassis at this time. Just to clarify, the Banks items were added right before our recent trip.
Lastly, the power issue isn't mine and having owned other RV's, dozens of large SUV's with gas and diesel engines and having towed large enclosed trailers my whole life, I have realistice expectations of vehicle power and their capabilities. My objective with power enhancements would be to use the cruise control at 70 mph without our coach downshifting over just about every overpass. As it is now I don't use the cruise much or turn it off before any hill or overpass so I can work the throttle myself and keep it from downshifting as much saving wear and tear on the transmission as well as some fuel. I'd like to be able to still drive along at 70 mph into a headwind or sidewind while staying in 5th gear. As it is now we can't do that all the time depending on the winds. My expectations might not be realistic for a coach of our size but I'd like to improve on it if I can.
The Ford warranty starts when you buy it. If purchased in 2010, the power train is 5 years or 50,000 miles. Call the Ford - Motorhome Customer Service Center at 800-444-3311 to get this issue squared away. YOu may have to fill out the warranty update information form FCS900 on line.
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