NinerBikes,thanks again for the inputs. You have given me other information on my other post "am I shortening my battery life". On that subject you indicated a Top Charge of 14.5 for my two Crown CR235's in series. For additional information I will be using four Crown CR235 (470 Ah total, Series/Parallel). If I were to place the Iota as a stand alone I would no longer have the use of the WFCO 8955 Power Center as a 12v fuse center, is that correct? I hope this helps clarify my situation.
If you use the Iota, and you have a lot of battery there... and that they are Crowns... look at this:
Trojan VS Crown.
And to further muddy the waters... please, please, please, print this out, and engrave it on your forehead before you decide to buy an amperage rating for your charge controller and/or top charger/equalize charger.
Crown battery charging requirements.... THE BIBLE
I'd like you to reread and post up here the last 2 sentences in that PDF, and then post up here what those voltages NEED to be for your Crown batteries, to Top CHarge, and to Equalize, something you need to do with your batteries isolated from the rest of your 5th wheel when doing so. Once you understand those NEEDS, then think about how you are going to get there. ;-)
There is a lot for you to learn before you start spending your hard earned money on charge controllers and power supply units... ie understanding how to top charge, how to equalize and how to maintain your batteries... refer to that engraved print out on your forehead and make sure you understand it 100% before spending a penny.
Myself, I'd let that WFCO sit right where it is, if you dry camp a lot, and use whatever charge controller you go with as a stand alone. I don't subscribe any more to the WFCO family of charge controllers unless I happen to spend one night in a RV park with full hook ups so I can dump tanks, use the laundry room, top off with another 30 gallons of water, dump by grey and black tanks, and clean up/flush them.
If you are running 470 Amp hours... you are going to need a lot of generator and a lot of charger to get those topped off. Myself... I'd be more inclined to buy two of those Mega Watt 40 amp Jobs for $65 shipped, and run one on each set of batteries, if you need to charge all four batteries up at once. And I'd do the Mexico Wanderer timer thing in conjunction with it. I'd also then run 14.8V out to the batteries. Timed. With those Mega Watt switched power supply units.
But that's me, I like manual all the way, I'm a control freak. Automated never does as well as a well functioning mind with the ability to reason.
Sheesh, screw the Keurig, buy a $20 glass french press coffee maker. Measure it full with water, dump into a kettle, and heat the kettle up on the cook top stove with propane. Add favorite grounds, pour boiling hot water when it whistles, and if you want it quick, run the press portion up and down a couple of times to homogenize all the coffee. Using electricity to heat on such a small scale is only practical if you are getting tons of solar free to make your electricity recharge your batteries. It's a huge waste burning gasoline to make electricity via a generator to heat up water to make coffee.
Trust this group to dig to the bottom and find reality! :)
I need to bookmark what where when and why that place in (Corona? Norco?) for panels. Looks like I will be going up by automobile around the first of the year, for medical.
It's a 240 mile drive from San Diego but such is life. Shipping costs have gotten stupid because of the cost of transportation.
So Bookmarked Ninerbikes!
You have been annointed as Mex"EE"cowanderer, for your prowess in all things electrical on RV's and boats. I also think SCVj"EE"ff is qualified. Apologies in advance if I left anyone else so talented out.
Thank you gentlemen for the advice! As it has reached a balmy 106' outside I have not made any additional measurements yet. If I get DW PT done early I will get on further measurements. Regarding the IOTA Ninerbikes, will that give me a full charge? I assume I will still need to do the Mex's "Top Charge", correct? Also should I "main line" directly to the batteries from my eu3000 to the Iota, or can I just plug the "shore line" into the eu3000?
The Iota should get you to 14.8V... I don't recall what you have for AH for batteries on your 5th wheel. Tell us more about your batteries amp hour rating, and I can advise further. An Iota will get you, in boost mode, to 14.8V before shutting down to maintenance mode. 14.8V is pretty good. An Iota may shut down at temps over 104F. That means you being in Tucson might need to plan your time of day for when you charge and run the generator. Another factor is how far your run is from the charge controller to your batteries, and what gauge cable is in use. All of these things figure into the calculations.
Tell us brand and model of battery and amp hour rating... from there, some may be able to better advise you on the proper top charge voltage, while possibly disconnected/isolated from the rest of your electrical system, as some electrical circuit boards can't handle over 15.4V.
Ideally, I'd install the Iota as a stand alone, in the bay next to your batteries, to keep away from battery fumes. Run what you need for wire to your battery terminals, short and fat. You might run some Romex 120V off an end run of an existing 120V electrical outlet to the Iota.
The Mex"EE"cowanderer top charger is a project unto itself. It's not a set it and forget it unit. Do a Search under "Mega Watt" and find the thread started by Mexicowanderer to see if you want to go down that path. I assure you, once you do some reading, and studying here, you'll understand more whether it's the right decision for you.
A fine quality 10 turn pot for five dollars is not exactly highway robbery. BTW that is a real close up shot of that pot - the shaft is 1/4"http://www.circuitspecialists.com/content/image/7825/300/XSN%20VERNIER height=300 width=300 O look...a knob
Hmmm...A Knobby Source
Get an IOTA or Progressive Dynamics replacement converter. Boondocker will short charge the battery to 70/75% and drop voltage for absorption vs the others that hold voltage up for a few more hours. Since you boondock a lot you will wish you had just replaced the WFCO long before it failed.
This, and if you boon dock a lot, I'd opt for the 14.8 volt Iota version over the 14.4V PD version. Hope you have a Honda EU2000i generator or larger for the 45 amp version. In either case, get the pendant that comes with it, and use the boost feature religiously to keep your battery charge up.
I got mine.
obtw BFL, those are Anderson Power Poles on each side of the meter.
I've been working over my batteries. Interstate GC2-XHD-UTL.
Bought these in December 2010 while dry camping in Key West. Never happy with them. I know now that dry camping without solar that I could never get them "fully" charged, sulfating, progressive loss of capacity, ...
Suffered through 2010, 2011, 2012. In 2013 I picked the worse two of the lot and moved them to the shop and suffered through last winter with the other two, planning to buy four new Sam's Club golf cart batteries this summer. I charged them occasionally with the VEC1093.
Decided to do a BFL treatment:
In the beginning: 24 hours after FUL:
8/22/14 1230, 1260, 1260, 1260, 1260, 1225
watered, recond, eq:
8/23/14 1265, 1260, 1260, 1260, 1270, 1225
Round 1: 10 AMP load 6 hours. Dropped to 12.3 volts at start, 11.93 at end.
Part of my unhappiness was low voltage under load. Maybe this is normal.
Sat for two days because the VEC1093 was busy the other pair.
Wouldn't charge. Recond, charge, eq, charge:
8/27/14 1275, 1275, 1275, 1275, 1275, 1250
Round 2: 10 amp load 6 3/4 hours, ending voltage 11.88
charge, recond, eq, eq
8/29/14: 1275, 1275, 1275, 1280, 1280, 1250
Round 3: 10 amp load, 6 1/4 hours, end 12.0 volts.
charge with VEC1093. "Finishing Charge" with MW S-350-12
8/31/14 1280, 1280, 1280, 1280, 1280, 1260
obtw, that last cell was over watered sometime before this exercise. There is ~3/8" of water above the bottom of the slot. All the others were watered as needed.
The other pair out in the trailer, after one cycle of load, charge, recond and eq
8/25/14 1260, 1260, 1250, 1260, 1270, 1255
so they need to meet MW.
But after that I think I'm good for anther winter at least without new batteries.
Again, thanks all for the advise, counsel, guidance and entertainment.
Your observation of the batteries need multiple treatments of minor deep heated massage matches my experience with my Trojan T-1275s. It took 3 trips over a matter of about 12 to 14 days to really get the specific gravity back up there. You just can't rush a good equalization, it needs some down time for the chemical solution to redistribute itself inside the battery.
I'd hit them with the Meanwell set at 15.05 V first, then my very old 1980's manual Sears 6 amp charger that does go to 16.0V, usually for an hour or two, until the amp meter on the charger showed 3.0 amps for about an hour. That 2 hours usually would let me see 1.275 to 1.280 on all but one cell, again, a cell slightly overfilled.
I thank Mexicowander for educating all of us on how to do the most on fully recharging our batteries, so that we get the most out of our batteries while dry camping.
I would also like to call out and thank landyacht318 for keeping copious notes on his screwy 31 battery. I consider that a "must read" or a Battery 101 course on proper observation, taking notes, and confirming that you need to be a little bit bold in the voltage settings on your charge controller, that the charge controller industry has been lying to all of us on 14.4V, when, in his case, with his batteries, he needs 15.3V daily and 16.0V every 14 days to keep his battery healthy, while using it daily, regularly, and hard, with true deep cycles.
And lastly, I'd like to thank BFL, for going out there and getting a pair of used T-1275s and making them work again... because without his posts, I wouldn't have done the same, and come back smiling... I love everything about the T-1275 except lifting those mofo's out of the battery tray for an EQ session back home... they are HEAVY.
My solar controller allows the adjustments my battery requires.
I often think of just using the MeanWell power supply as if it were a solar panel feeding my charge controller, and let this controller run through my Algorithm which I have found makes my battery happiest
Limited to 25 amps though.
My 198 watts of solar is usually more than enough though, but when it is not, i do not trust my available charging sources and think the meanwell as a solar panel might be the way to go, for me.
Mine is limited to 30 amps.... Hmmm my Solar 30 and my Mega Watt are both 30 amps. What say ye?
I actually SAW a TV repair shop outside of Dallas yesterday!
That pot is adjusting the regulator and not carrying any load whatsoever. If you really want a fine adjust 10T pot, there are much smaller ones around with 1/8 or 1/4" shafts on them.
Randy: You might check ALL Electronics in Van Nuys, or APEX in Sun Valley if you wanna shop locally. Just make sure you get the same value as the PC mount. A DVM can do the rest when installed.
Been to Apex on San Fernando Rd a time or two before, for surplus. For a pot/rheostat, of all things! 5 ohm jobber.
Review of the Mega Wwtt S-350-12V Power Supply Unit.
Now that I think about it, I could probably run this through my Solar 30 Charge Controller too, with a quick connect electrical RC plug, on the input side, out of 10 gauge wire.
Good Pix! You have separate RUN Capacitors for Fan and Compressor. The 7.5@370-VAC is Fan and the 45@370 is Compressor (sometimes called HERM for the hermetically sealed part which is the compressor and coils). If you replace either of those, you can use xx@440-VAC as well. You can go UP on capacitor rated voltage just not down.
Picture your photo of the yellow wiring diagram turned 90* to the Left so it's right-side-up. The dotted-line box on the Left side of the diagram shows an optional Start Assist with a PTCR device. THAT IS WHAT YOU HAVE INSTALLED. A SUPCO SPP6 would be equivalent. The dotted box in the middle shows a Start Assist also, but with Potential Relay. That is the better system. That device called "5-2-1 Compressor Saver" is an aftermarket Potential Relay system. The SUPCO SPP6e "E-Class" approximates what a Potential Relay does, just not quite as well.
OK, starting... If you don't have too low a voltage or insufficient amperage (including too light a power/extension cord), it is of course possible your compressor is failing. More likely:
1. RUN Capacitor is Bad
2. PTCR or Start Capacitor is Bad
I'd say, IF you're at a good power source,
1. Disconnect Power
2. Short across Start Capacitor (the plastic one)
3. Short across Compressor Run Capacitor (the 45 one)
4. Remove the Red and Yellow Wires from the Compressor Run Capacitor that lead back to the Start Assist (black Capacitor with that little PTCR cube. Be sure they don't get against any other terminals.
5. Restore Power
6. Start A/C
7. Starts Better? Discard Start Assist Capacitor and PTCR. Replace with 5-2-1 or SPP6e starting at Step 1
8. Still Starts Poorly? Start at Step 1 and Replace 45@370 with a new 45@370 or 45@440 capacitor
9. Repeat A/C test starting Step 5
10. Better? GOOD. At this point you can re-connect Start Assist and try again. You may or may not notice a quicker start, probably won't unless you get to a generator or lower voltage/amperage shore tie. OR, you can upgrade to 5-2-1 or SPP6e. I would not settle for another PTCR Start Assist like SPP6 if I was replacing a bad one.
11. Report Back!
12. Happy Weekend!
This should be made a sticky, moderators.
FWIW I didn't think the screw adjustment was problematic. Surprisingly loose, yes, but not worth the bother of replacing it for that reason alone, IMO.
Umm, Mex, I guess you've been a la playa for the last 30 or 40 years so you haven't heard: There's no such thing as a TV repair shop anymore. Most TVs last far longer than the owner's patience and get thrown out in favor of a newer model.
Maybe take the new pot to the computer repair desk at Fry's?
Your Meanwell is a different pot with a much bigger screw pot and a different 10 amp model from the 30 amp version that most of us are running, the 30 amp or 40 amp Mega Watt version sold in Santa Clarita, CA. Comparing apples and oranges.
How does one wire this in? On the circuit board or in line with the output? Putting up a part without a little "how to" assemble for us none EE types is a recipe for things to go kaboom.
Keep in mind, Mex, not all of us have installed electrical low voltage systems in complex boats, like you.I have all that stuff.. Gimme a ring if you need swapping the PC 10T and wiring of the new pot
I might take you up on that offer, El Jeffe! I'd need to order a pot first. Would prefer to have a known value of the existing micro pot before ordering a replacement larger ease of adjustment pot.
lol, I thought BFL would be horrified at the 1.25 specific gravity. Salvo's needs are small and I expect he may win the "bet" on three more years of use.
He's more into wind power and wave power than chemical/electrical power.