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RE: Purchase from NorthTrail RV Is this a title issue ?
Chuck.....In the future, there may be an easier way to solve a similar issue. If you connect the Cummins Insite computer program to the coach, the program will tell you exactly how many miles are on the coach, how many gallons of fuel it's burned and how many hours it has from the very first minute the engine was fired.
Most dealers will have this program. I have the SilverLeaf computer program on my coach. SilverLeaf is a free program for motor homes that you can either buy their system (box mounted displays) or their connector cable ($350.00) that connects to your own laptop.
Unless the computer can be cheated or the brain was replaced, I think you would have recived your exact mileage in about five minutes of work by the dealer.
The dealer ran all the cummins reports and gave me the printout The mileage was pretty close just a 70 mile differnce . So with that info I was happy and was signing on the dotted line. Only thing I asked was that they put on the contract I would receive a clean title and they refused.
Some here keep saying I am beating a dead horse but I am just answering statements as they come up.
Thanks again for everyones help. I have moved on but it really sticks in my craw the fact that they wont put in writing something they promised verbally. It was a little misleading and cost me $300 to boot
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Chuck_NJ
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04/01/13 03:08pm |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: Purchase from NorthTrail RV Is this a title issue ?
I know this is reopening this but GM promised via phone it would be clean of "TMU" but when asked to put it in writing he refuses. Am I suppose to buy this and hope the title is clean? When the only thing in writing I have from the dealer is this ?
"Chuck,
I went to management to get a read on what the title says regarding the "TMU" and he said regardless of what the current title may say, the new title will read "TMU" because we are of the knowledge that there may be a discrepancy in the mileage and we MUST disclose any knowledge of that issue so it will be a "TMU" title. Thanks...Doyle
On the contract state to me its clean or not, thats all I ask they will not do that !! When your spending over 60k on a vehicle when all is said and done is this asking a lot ?
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Chuck_NJ
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04/01/13 07:22am |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: Purchase from NorthTrail RV Is this a title issue ?
If you have "moved on" what is the purpose of further dicussion?
You have given all of us a "heads up." Thank you for that.
Next topic please.
Just sayin.....
Thanks for the advise I will let it go
thanks all for listening
Chuck
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Chuck_NJ
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04/01/13 06:52am |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: Purchase from NorthTrail RV Is this a title issue ?
I am going to take a diffent approach at this to hopefully get an understanding here
1. You sell me your coach I am the Dealer you know your coach you have owned it since day 1 your bring to me and sign the back of the title and claim by federal law that the mileage is actual.
2 I am the dealer and i will not buy anything with a bad title for full price so as a smart dealer I look at the titles of vehicles that I buy . I check for a signed actual odometer statement because if its not and it has a TMU i will offer you way below market value
3 we complete the deal me as the dealer i now have your title with sworn actual mileage statement or TMU title but I do have a title as now I am the owner. I am aware of its status
4 here were the carfax comes in you as the previous owner took great care of your rig and had it serviced at the dealer and inspected yearly by dmv problem is one of the dmv inspectors added a digit to your odometer reading in error and it unknown to you shows up in a carfax. Bottom line is you know your mileage is true and that is what you signed the odometer statement as.
5 so waht some are saying here is this that the dealer is obligated by law to change the title because he saw a bad carfax? I have never heard of that if the previous owner you signed a sworn statement then why would he change it even if carfax stated its a clerical error
Are you saying the dealer will now take the previous owners title thats clear and rettile as TMU based on carfax? and why did the dealer just not say to me this is what had to be done instead of promising a clear title . Could he be hiding something?
And will the dealer now reduce the asking price from the fair market value of 59k to the TMU value some 15-20k less. Would someone else inquiring on this coach including myself get this new lower damage goods price and will the dealer disclose the tainted title? or will the coach mysteriously disappear off the market? Either way there is a paper trail with dates that will ultimatly lead to the answer
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Chuck_NJ
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03/31/13 09:06pm |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: Purchase from NorthTrail RV Is this a title issue ?
Having spent my career in the auto repair industry at the dealership level I learned one thing about CarFax, a for profit corporation. You can drain pasta with one of their reports. They have more holes in them than most strainers. CarFax sold the public on their product and they depend on others to supply the information they then sell/force on or to the dealers. You, the purchaser, are much better served by having an independent inspection done on any vehicle you want to buy than to depend on CF. This is a prime example of CF getting in the way of issues that could easily have been sorted out by a major FL. dealer.
Randy
I have moved on long ago as I realize its a bad deal I am trying to stop this from happening to some other poor soul. many here just say move on and let the dealer go about his bad buissness practices I say someone needs to call them out on it. There is much more to this story then i can put on here
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Chuck_NJ
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03/31/13 08:37pm |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: Purchase from NorthTrail RV Is this a title issue ?
Having spent my career in the auto repair industry at the dealership level I learned one thing about CarFax, a for profit corporation. You can drain pasta with one of their reports. They have more holes in them than most strainers. CarFax sold the public on their product and they depend on others to supply the information they then sell/force on or to the dealers. You, the purchaser, are much better served by having an independent inspection done on any vehicle you want to buy than to depend on CF. This is a prime example of CF getting in the way of issues that could easily have been sorted out by a major FL. dealer.
Randy
What you dont get is this. I paid a private inspector after consulting the dealer on the carfax problem they said and promised a clear title. When it came to close they recanted on the promise and left me holding a $300 inspection bill. I have moved on and I realize this is a bad deal what I am getting at is this. I beleive the title was bad all along and they knew it. When you sell your car you have to sign the odometer statement you sign either actual or unknown and the new owner NORTHTRAILS takes ownership with you title they at that time are well aware of the Title status. They lead me to beleive the milage was actual so i proceeded with inspection when I was ready to close they would not back up there previous statement. They have the title and know what it says Botton Line. Cant you see this???
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Chuck_NJ
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03/31/13 08:30pm |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: Purchase from NorthTrail RV Is this a title issue ?
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Where was the vehicle titled to the previous owners ? Maybe the dealer did not physically have the title , as here in Florida many titles are electronic .
The fact is , the previous owner wants nothing to say about his paperwork , and the dealer will not alter their documents to match your request . RED FLAGS !
The FL AG will not take a position in this matter .
Sounds like you paid for a vehicle inspection that was inadequate , and now you are out $300.00 .
Take it as a lesson learned and move on . Just because something is a lower price , does not mean it is the right price .
.
The coach was not at a lower price and what I really dont beleive is nobody hears this.
The GM On the phone 5 times promised the title was clean and will be free of "TMU" he said the previous owners title was clean. So I asked him to back up his statement he made on the phone about the clean title in writing and they refuse what is so hard to see here??????
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Chuck_NJ
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03/31/13 07:40pm |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: Purchase from NorthTrail RV Is this a title issue ?
What lets car fax do that? I ask because I know nothing about car fax. Does TMU mean that the total miles on the vehicle is unvarified? I am asking because I don't know about these things. I do know though that you can't put false info on the odometer statement.
Ron
Its simple I dont know what you all are missing. The GM states on the phone the title is clear I had the vehicle inspected figuring it was a clear title. When it came time to close I asked them to put in writing its a clear title and they refuse. Is this hard to understad?
I sell you and apple you pay me I give you an orange its that simple !
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Chuck_NJ
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03/31/13 05:31pm |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: Purchase from NorthTrail RV Is this a title issue ?
If you are not comfortable with any aspect of the purchase, you won't ever be happy with it. Look for another unit, they come up for sale all the time. I personally don't trust CarFax, the news ran a story last year, seems sometimes they don't record accurate information, and would not fix it even when they were shown the truth. At this point you have 2 choices, fly down and look, or walk.
I agree about carfax I do NJ DMV inspections, and have put in an extra digit for mileage by accident within a few days a rep from motor vehicle comes in and writes me up for clerical error and they get angry because they cant sell record to carfax. That being said I was in agreement with salesman over cllerical error and moved on to coach inspection. When it came time to close they did a 360 and told me coach would have a TMU reguardless because of the Carfax info you tell me why????
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Chuck_NJ
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03/31/13 04:46pm |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: Purchase from NorthTrail RV Is this a title issue ?
They do not have my money as I never signed the no refund deposit as I never closed the deal due to them refusing to sell with clear title. I am writing here to make others aware of the BS that can happen to them and be careful what they sign on for. I know for fact because I sell Motor Vehicles this is a bad deal and most likely the dealer is in posession of a bad title and bought it that way at a reduced price and may try to pass on to someone unsusecting. This is only my opinion but I asked here for others. I see some understand what I am saying but others are totally missing my point
I am not buying this I am aware its a bad deal just i was $300 into an inspction by a fellow ASE tech because the GM of Northtrails promised only viaa phone it would be a clean title so I paid for inspection.When it came down to signing on the deal all I asked for what was promised by phone a clear title is that aasking much????
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Chuck_NJ
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03/31/13 04:43pm |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: Purchase from NorthTrail RV Is this a title issue ?
If there is any discrepancy in mileage information, in the historical documentation of a vehicle, Federal law requires the "mileage unknown" annotation. A title with this annotation is a valid title, but if that annotation is an issue for you, then that is not the motorhome for you.
I have never asked them to fix anything I just asked if the title currently has a TMU and was told that no matter what it has now it will have a tmu reguarless by there salesman.
Then I was told 5 times via phone by the GM it would not have or never had a TMU so I just asked to put it it writing like the salemans who put in writing saying it would have . The GM refused to put that in writing. What does that say???????????????????
There is not any way a motor vehicle dealer in the U.S. can "fix" this for you, without violating the law. That being said, there are likely many used car dealers who still falsify documentation for a buyer, or to deceive a buyer.
You want to complain to the Florida attorney general that you can't get this dealer to falsify the mileage certification for you?
Maybe you are not hearing what I am saying or understand. They claim the current title is clean but when asked to put it in writing they decline. They are in possesion of a clean title from the previous owner that is fact as they say. They have to flip title to there company to resell that is fact. so all i am asking is to tell me thhe title i receive from them will also be clear. when asked the first time i was told it would have a TMU reguardless of what it says now. So that means they are holding a clear title and they are turning it into a TMU title based on a carfax I ran not that they did. A vehicle with a TMU value is 30% less that book. So you are telling me now I should buy it for retail knowing that they are claiming I will only get a TMU title? Or is it that they already knew it was a TMU title and tried to pass it off and when called out on it they have tapped danced around the issue here again is the email i received about getting a clear title.
"Chuck,
I went to management to get a read on what the title says regarding the "TMU" and he said regardless of what the current title may say, the new title will read "TMU" because we are of the knowledge that there may be a discrepancy in the mileage and we MUST disclose any knowledge of that issue so it will be a "TMU" title. Thanks...Doyle"
My question is this What does the title say now ??????? Are they going to sign the odometer statement saying mileage unknow based on Carfax from Chuck and now turn into a "TMU" title and devalue coach ???
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Chuck_NJ
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03/31/13 04:29pm |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: Purchase from NorthTrail RV Is this a title issue ?
Looks like a FLA sinkhole to me, and trusting any dealer to straighten out along distance legal matter to your satisfaction is wishful thinking.
No but the fact of the matter is I was not born yesterday and if I can stop this from happening to some other poor unsuspecting person I will feeel much better. I will let the FLA attorney general sort it out and see what they think I do have a nice paper trail.
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Chuck_NJ
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03/31/13 02:43pm |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: Purchase from NorthTrail RV Is this a title issue ?
You probably won't like what I'm going to say. I think you are in far too much of a hurry to buy a coach you have not seen and has too many red flags surrounding it. I would take more time to ensure that, I have looked the coach over and I AM SATISFIED with the deal, not the inspector or anyone else. There are more hassle-free coaches available out there to be found, than to get stuck in any deal that smells bad from the beginning...my.02.
You can not find anything up here in the North East price wise that compares down in FLA.
I am an ASE master auto and Truck Tech and understand what makes these things tick. I have rebuilt my 94 bounder from the ground up. But yes I sold my bounder and need a replacement soon.
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Chuck_NJ
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03/31/13 01:59pm |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: Purchase from NorthTrail RV Is this a title issue ?
Thanks all for taking the time to read. The worst part here is I spent $300 to have this inspected and quite honestly feel I have been frauded. I am in contact with the FLA Attorney Generals office to look into this matter .If you could aLL read the emails back and forth and the tap dancing arond the issue it would make you sick. They tell you how they are a family run buissness and they would take care of me like family? I emailed everyone in the ERP family who own North Trails and have yet to have any response back except from the General manager stating he could not meet my "DEMANDS" My demand??? A clear title in writing?? "DEMANDS"? If i did not ask the last minute I would be out 2 flights to Fort Myers art $400 a pop and the $300 inspection charge because they are basiclly as far as i am cocerned usiing unethical buissness practices. I encourage them to prove otherwise !!!!
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Chuck_NJ
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03/31/13 01:04pm |
Class A Motorhomes
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Purchase from NorthTrail RV Is this a title issue ?
Hi All I am looking for an opinion here on a purchase I was in the process of completing.
I have been in the market for a 2004 Monoco Diplomat 40pdq for some time. I have done all my reseach scoured craigslist ,ebay , rvtrader , PPL in texas and have come to what I feel is a general idea of fair market value for a coach with a clean title.
With this in mind I found that North Trail Rv in fort Myers FLa had the exact coach I was looking for I made a call and spoke to a salemans who said that the coach had just arrived that day and the owner was trading in on a newer coach he said he would get me some pictures info and a price.He also stated that all items on the coach except the in motion sat would be in working order. Later that morning he contacted me via phone and informed me I could purchase at what was a fair market value price and send me some pictures. I agreed on the first price he gave me and asked how could i reserve the unit so I could have an inspection done. He asked for a $5000 refundable 72 hour deposit following my inspection we could close on the deal.
Later that day I received a buyers contract with pictures and the vehichles VIN. My first step was to run a CARFAX on the unit this is where the first red flag went up. The coach was on its second owner out of Ontario Canada. There was a bunch of flip flopping of the mileage between owners but the carfax stated this could just be a clerical error.
So with my newfound info I contacted the salesman who told me he would reach out to the saleman who took the trade and see if the previous ownetr would talk to me to clear up the carfax issue.Several hours later I was contacted by the salesman who took the trade and was informed that the previous owner had no intentions on talking to me because he did not drive all the way from canada to sell his coach to have to talk to someone about it. That statement bothered me a little as I had just sold my 94 Bounder and was very proud to pass on any and all info to new buyer. Anyway The saleman and I via phone went over the Carfax for a half hour and he said he looked at the odometer monting bolts pressed the buttons and the mileage appered correct and he insisted it was a slerical error. At this time being excited and wanting the coach I agreed with him and we continued our conversation he stated the windsheild was chipped and that it would be covered under the previous owners Insurance and I said great I would arrange my inspection tomorrow.
My inspector arrived on a staurday afternoon and spent several hours from what I was told by my saleman and had left and would call me in a few minutes. Well my inspector lost my number and it was late saturday so I could not close the deal so I called North Trails and spoke to the sales manager and he gave me till monday to complete the inspection. When I spoke to the inspector on modaay he informed me he was unable to road test the coach as the slides would not close. I asked if he would go back on monday and road test he agreed. I then called my saleman and asked why he did not tell me the coach was not road tested and got silence and then he said oh it had a dead battery and he would replace it. I said Ok the inspector came back and completed the roadtest and told me all was great .
At this point I was ready to close the deal so I reached out to my saleman and said lets close the deal but had he read the email I sent in the AM asking if the title was clear of any mileage errors or the dreaded "TMU" total mileage unkonw which basicly devalues the coach at least 30% well here it is this is the response I received via email not phone mind you as all our other dealing went and I am copying and pasting here
Chuck,
I went to management to get a read on what the title says regarding the "TMU" and he said regardless of what the current title may say, the new title will read "TMU" because we are of the knowledge that there may be a discrepancy in the mileage and we MUST disclose any knowledge of that issue so it will be a "TMU" title. Thanks...Doyle
My thoughts here instantly were how can this be are they already in posession of a bad tiltle?
So for the next few day I went Back and forth via email and phone with the GM at Nothtrail who on at least 5 occasions via phone insisted that the coach would be clear of any "TMU" but that it would have a EXEMpT from mileage because in FLA the DOT will inspect the coach and exempt it from mileage as its over 16000 pound. I said OK as long as it does not have "TMU" on the title he said on the phone once again it will not. So i contacted NJ Dmv and they do not accept EXEMPT on there title that it needs to be actual or it will be deemed "TMU". I also ran the carfax of my cousin who last year purchased an 07 american tradition from lazydays and its well over 16000 pounds and it shows actual mileage not "EXEMPT".
So once again I had the general manager send me his contract and a legal statement that they typed up after checking the mileage in the cummins computer stating there was only a few miles differnce between the odometer and the cummins computer . I said great all seems well but could you put in writing on my contract the title will be clear of any "TMU" he said and again this is a cut and paste
Chuck,
"If you feel better, write on the left side under where it states appliance will work: "Mileage will not be listed as TMU" then sign"
I responded
"what was really make me feel better is if you add it to the mileage disclaimer and the contract I would be glad to sign it"
Connected by DROID on Verizon Wireless
He Responded
Chuck,
I advised you incorrectly. we won't accept the contract if you write anything on it. I am not able to change the contract or the disclaimer.
Everything has to stay as it is. If you would like to continue, come on down and see if you want to purchase the unit. I have done all I can to this point to assist you. I will let you know when I hear about the windshield.
Thank You
Steve
All I am asking for in writing is this am i getting a clean title? All i have in writing fromm North Trails is that no matter what i would receive a title with a "TMU" on it. Am I missing something here?
Oh and BTW the contract they wanted me to sign asked for a $5000 NON REFUNDABLE DEPOSIT I have all the emails and docs backing this up What are your thoughts?
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Chuck_NJ
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03/31/13 11:45am |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: 1999 Fleetwood Pace Arrow Vision 36Z
If you would like more info call me at my shop tomorrow 973-772-9711. Most likely a bad coil on plug or cop as we call them in the trade.
Chuck Meunier
Meuniers Auto Service
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Chuck_NJ
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12/18/12 05:25pm |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: How do you inflate your Class A tires ?
ok i read a quick review on amazon said it was an auto inflate system MY BAD Sorry
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Chuck_NJ
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07/14/12 01:24pm |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: How do you inflate your Class A tires ?
Not to throw cold water on your post but I would never leave a tire inflating un attended. I own an auto repair shop and had a mechanic leave the air hose atached to a suv tire. He then leaned it against the inflate pedalof the tire machine to attend to a customer. Well the resulting explosion was devastating took out windows and damaged a few vehicles, thank god no one was standing near.
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Chuck_NJ
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07/14/12 12:25pm |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: Cost to Change Exhaust Gasket 8.1
i used remflex and have had no problems costly but good. just tried there website and its down. Also came accross some god and bad reviews. so far i have ove 5000 miles on mine with thoreley headers and knock wood all is well
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Chuck_NJ
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07/09/12 07:21pm |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: F53 no dash power, won't crank - Resolved!
re reading you post i am starting to think its the ignition switch on the column we could check it with a test light but is a tight squeeze under that dash
chuck
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Chuck_NJ
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07/08/12 09:09pm |
Class A Motorhomes
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