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Open Roads Forum  >  Class C Motorhomes

 > LP on or off?

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Bubby's RV

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Posted: 02/01/06 11:56am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Love Boat II wrote:

Bubby's RV wrote:

We leave our propane on while driving to keep the refrigerator cold. ....

Does not your refrigerator run on 12v also ?
Only the control panel. It's a 110 VAC/LPG unit like most are these days. The one in my 1991 Chinook also "ran" on 12 VDC, but it didn't work that well.


John, Winnebago Minnie 24V


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Posted: 02/01/06 12:06pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

On when traveling, but off when fueling or stored.

Ken


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2013 HitchHiker 38RLRSB Champagne, toted with a 2012, F350, 6.7L PSD, Crewcab, dually. 3.73 axle, Full Time RVer.
Travel with a standard schnauzer and a Timneh African Gray parrot

B-Plus

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Posted: 02/01/06 02:39pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

ANNH,
I am assuming that you are talking about the actual valve itself and not anything running on?
I keep my valve shut all of the time except when I am using it to run something. Because ,after I have not used the propane for a few weeks I noticed that I would have to purge the line every time I wanted to start something up. That is telling me that the propane after a few weeks is escaping at one of the joints or at the point of use somewhere. Its not a whole lot so I don't worry about it but I would think that over time if the valve is not closed that you could lose quite a bit. Test it out next time , shut off your valve and see if you have to purge the line to start something up . By purging the line I mean turning on the stove and waiting until it lights , I find that a lot of air comes out before propane get to the burner. I don't think that I am alone with this situation I think its quite common.
Dario


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Friday's

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Posted: 02/01/06 04:44pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Ann,

We have a Winnebago View, same as your Navion. It has a sticker in it that says to turn the LP off when traveling. Probabely says somewhere in the manual too.

We had left gas and refrigerator on while traveling (occasionally) in a previous motorhome but changed our procedure for safety reasons.

Michael


Michael & Susan

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rockhillmanor

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Posted: 02/01/06 05:10pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

AnnH wrote:

When I picked up my Navion on Saturday, the guy doing the walk through said I never have to turn the LP off unless I'm going to store the RV......Can anyone help?


I'd say a phone call to the owner of this RV dealership about this salesman should be your 'first' action. He should NEVER be giving out instructions such as that. This is a serious safety issue, and you should have been given the 'correct' info on safety regarding your RV. For you, your family and others around you at a gas station or other flammable areas.

Irregardless of many opinions of what people do or not do, you should have been instructed what the correct and many times required by law actions should be taken regarding the propane tank.

There also should be a sticker 'right on the RV' by the propane tank about shutting it off when fueling. I actually think this sticker is mandatory.

Sorry for venting but it just burns my butt with rv salespeople and rv service depts that give wrong information to people who buy RV's.
There should be a law that the salespeople have to have owned an RV for 10 years traveled 80,000 miles in it...before they are hired. [emoticon]

BTW, Welcome, AnnH, to the forum and the world of RV'ing,
Happy Camping! [emoticon]


We must be willing to get rid of the life we've planned,
so as to have the life that is waiting for us.


HiTech

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Posted: 02/01/06 06:14pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

The instructions vary by brand. Sometimes people turn off the propane to fuel up, but leave the exectric ignition appliances on. Not good or effective, since the appliances will spark, trying to ignite the propane which is no longer available.

This topic gets extensive discussion in many forums, and is in the Class C FAQ.

klhutch

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Posted: 02/02/06 12:52pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

AnnH wrote:

When I picked up my Navion on Saturday, the guy doing the walk through said I never have to turn the LP off unless I'm going to store the RV. The only other time it needs to be turned off is when it is filled or services.


As you can see there are a variety of opinions about this. On many MH's you can avoid the issue by running the generator but the View and Navion have propane powered generators so that won't help in your case.

Since propane is a fuel you would obviously be safer if your MH had no propane on board at all. Since highway travel is dangerous you would also be safer if you never drove your Navion at all. The question then becomes is the one significantly more dangerous than the other?

Data is hard to come by. The National Fire Prevention (Protection?) Association has some data on fires, naturally. The NFPA charges for this data so unless someone here is an NFPA member or works for a member company we aren't going to be able to see their data. The charge for many of their publications is nominal, even for non- members, but you can't see whether any particular publication has relevant data or not until you have paid for it. This does not encourage non-members to fish in their pond.

The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration also has some data that is available online, for free. The latest available report is the booklet Traffic Safety Facts 2004. Unfortunately for this discussion motorhomes are not a large enough segment of the vehicle population to warrant a separate class in their report. In some cases MH's are listed only as part of the "Other" class, the rest of the time the Other class itself is lumped in with the "Unknown" class. In 2004 there were 635 fatal accidents involving the other class. Only 73 of these involved MH's and over half of the total were All Terrain Vehicles. The Unknown class was responsible for 698 fatal accidents. I assume that the Unknown class is mostly comprised of accident reports where the writer failed to fill in the vehicle type.

To further muddy the waters, in the section that reports on vehicle fires Other and Unknown are grouped together with no way to tell how many, if any, involved MH's. We can see that out of the 1333 fatal crashes in the Other/Unknown classes that includes MH's there were 14 fires. That is a fire rate of 1.1%. This report only indicates that there was a fire involved in the crash. It does not indicate whether the fire contributed directly to the deaths or injuries. In fact, since the accidents would in some cases have been collisions, the fires may not have taken place in the MH's but in the other vehicles. Furthermore, MH accidents represent only 5.5% of the total and 5.5% of 14 is 0.8 so it is possible that there were no fires involving fatal MH crashes during 2004. In any event the fire rate in passenger car crashes is 2.7%. That suggests. but does not prove, that propane is unlikely to be risk enhancer.

When it comes to injuries the conclusion is not so clear. The fire rate in Other/Unknown Vehicle crashes that cause injuries is a bit lower at 0.6% of 9000 crashes for 54 total. This rate is 2 to 6 times higher than for any other class of vehicle. Passenger cars have fires in only 0.1% of crashes that involve only injuries. There is no breakdown of injury crashes that I can find that would allow us to determine how many of these are due to MH's. Injury crashes are usually less severe than fatal crashes though so it seems to me that propane tank/valve/pipe ruptures would be less common in injury crashes. I see no obvious reason why other types of vehicles would see a much larger drop in fire rates from fatal to injury crashes.

This data doesn't prove anything, unfortunately. It just does not provide the details we would need to draw firm conclusions. It does suggest that propane is unlikely to kill you in a crash. It does allow room for propane to be a source of injury but there certainly is plenty of room for those injury crash fires to be due to other sources too. In fact we can't say for certain that any of the deaths or injuries from fires in crashes involved MH's.

The more real data I read the less concern I have about traveling with the propane on. Do turn it off when refueling though and be sure to turn the fridge and other gas appliance controls off too.

Ken

nscrnt8

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Posted: 02/02/06 09:13pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

hello all.i am a rv tech and i bounce around this site preety often just to see what ya-all are up to and everynow and then i will voice an opinon or put out a piece of helpfull advice. this post is were i will do both cause somepeople just have way to loud of an opinion.

" There also should be a sticker 'right on the RV' by the propane tank about shutting it off when fueling. I actually think this sticker is mandatory.

Sorry for venting but it just burns my butt with rv salespeople and rv service depts that give wrong information to people who buy RV's.
There should be a law that the salespeople have to have owned an RV for 10 years traveled 80,000 miles in it...before they are hired."

this statement not only makes me laugh but also erks me a bit. yea okay we will make shur that sticker is at the location you want it to be .... but dont you think it would make alot more sense to have it located at the gas/deisel fuel filler location ????? cause i dont really know any of you that have filled your own propane tank lately!!! and as for your quip on the sales and service departments.... dont ever put them in the same sentence. its like stating republicans and democrates agreed on something!!!! im sure you didnt meen to berate the service dept as you did, because i dont own one and havent driven one for 80,000 miles, but after 15 years in the industry i consider myself well diverced.

now after all that, about traveling with your propane on. most people do though i have no stats to back it up i would say a good strong 90% do. refers were designed and redesigned to do so , with the implements of wind proofing the burner. and if yo own one and have drive it for 80,000 mile you relize its an open flame and you should stop and turn it off before entering a fueling station. ok some of you arent in that realm ... but the just of it is on most modern day coaches the refers, w/h, furnaces are of the dsi type . and this meens what ... dsi short for direct spark ignition.... there is no pilot light, when such an appliance is called on to run there is an high voltage spark emitted to light the gas. this is controlled by a printed circut board, wich by todays standerds is either a 3 or 4 try board at intervals of 30 seconds to one minute. my point being shutting off the "tank" is irrelavant becuase you could stop a block away from the fuelling station and if you didnt shut the appliance off, still have a really bad situation, because you have a high voltage spark cycling for 30 seconds. the long and short of it is stop and turn off all pronane fired appliances before getting to the fuelling station.

the other was what if you are in a accindent and the tank is on. true its another fuel source for a fire, but just think of what has to occure for that to happen. remember you are driving a gas/deisel powererd motor, that is has its supply lines run in the same manner as the propane lines. plus propane has to mixed with just the right amount of air to be able to burn unless you have a huge huge ignition source, and that would be under pressure.

and to the guy that sugessted to shut of the tanks for whatever amount of time and see if you have air in the lines to see if you have a leak !!!! dont camp next to him!!!! if you want to to check for leaks by a monometer and learn how to use it. its really not that hard. winneabagos used to come with them though most people didnt know what they were . they were located in the outside refer comp.and most people thought they were just a cool thing to look at.

propane is a very safe fuel ... aslong as you understand it and respect it as you would any other fuel. if any of you think i have just babbled out of my bu!! you can go and ask the 80,000 mile guy for what to do next.

oh and as far as tunnels and some bridges are concernerd ...plan your trip and read up on your travel route. as with anything laws differ. all tunnels that i know of will stop and make sure your "tank" is off . and ive heard of a few bridges .... that do the same .

well happy travels to you all, and hope i dont need to see you soon ....lol

propane leaks in themselves are rare but should be looked out for. sugested to do a "drop down" test atleast once a year( if you had a monometer you would now what that is) wonder if the 80,000 mile guy owns one and knows how to use it ??? if he does good for him he is one of the safer ones out there.

rockhillmanor

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Posted: 02/05/06 04:11am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

nscrnt8 wrote:

hello all.i am a rv tech..... im sure you didnt meen to berate the service dept as you did, because i dont own one and havent driven one for 80,000 miles, but after 15 years in the industry i consider myself well diverced.


rockhillmanor wrote:

Sorry for venting but it just burns my butt with rv salespeople and rv service depts that give wrong information to people who buy RV's.
There should be a law that the SALESPEOPLE have to have owned an RV for 10 years traveled 80,000 miles in it...before they are hired."


Thanks for the info on propane usage, it was very informative.[emoticon]

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