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Open Roads Forum  >  Tow Vehicles

 > Is the diesel engine's reign as king of torque soon over?

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mtlogger

Montana

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Posted: 07/29/08 04:50am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Westport is owned in part by Cummins and yes I have a Uni and my son has a gasser Uni which is in the conversion process. They just can't be beat for heavy backwoods hauling. I had mine up in Glacier the other night, bear watching - everyone else needs to look up to us!


Matt J - 1956 416 Unimog w/32ft Jamco and two mules; Unimog 1750L camper in Guatemala
Bert - '08 Dakota 4.7, 19ft Airstream
My best friend Wolf died this morning, 16 Nov

pronstar

The LBC

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Posted: 07/29/08 01:40pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

lesmore49 wrote:

I'm no mechanical or electrical engineer, but I've often wondered about making the railway system, diesel electric engine technology 'streetable' .


That's called a series hybrid, and the Chevy Volt uses this technology.


Turtle n Peeps wrote:

I've never seen so many half truths and lie's in a long time!!!

Alky that is mixed with gasloline for 150 octane? What the????
I wish!!!! When I was racing with the stuff it was around 113 to 115 or so. Is this magic alky of some sort??? Maybe they ment 150 proof?? LOL


Pure ethanol has a RON of 129...mixing it with gasoline lowers the octane rating, but used alone as a fuel it has very high octane.


2007 Dodge Ram 2500 CTD 4x4/QC/LB
2008 Stellar 23' Toy Hauler

jmramiller

Dallas

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Posted: 07/29/08 02:36pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

When the big rigs have run this combo for a few years then I might become a believer. Until then...


2006 2500HD CC SB 4X4 Duramax/Allison
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Hannibal

Gas Station

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Posted: 07/29/08 05:02pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

jmramiller wrote:

When the big rigs have run this combo for a few years then I might become a believer. Until then...


Then what? You got an ISX 600 in that Chevy?


'05 2500HD Dodge 5.7L Hemi 5spd auto/3.73 SLT. 95k miles
ex '95 Cummins,'98 12v Cummins,'01.5 Cummins,'03 Cummins
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pronstar

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Posted: 07/29/08 05:46pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Ethanol still has a lower energy density than gasoline, and significantly less than diesel. So while you can make great power with it, you have to burn a LOT of it to do so...so you have to weigh the per-gallon cost advantage (if there is one) against the fact that you will burn so much more of it.

dirtbag3

Hesperia Ca.

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Posted: 07/29/08 07:52pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I sure hope those MIT guys read this forum.
Sure would'nt want them wasting their time after consulting with you boys.


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jmramiller

Dallas

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Posted: 07/29/08 08:29pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Hannibal wrote:

jmramiller wrote:

When the big rigs have run this combo for a few years then I might become a believer. Until then...


Then what? You got an ISX 600 in that Chevy?


Don't I wish.

What I meant is that the diesel engine has been very successful in a very demanding role, powering the big rigs. If a 7L gas engine can successfully fill the role of a 11L diesel engine over time (and many millions of miles) then I might be willing to take a look at a 1 ton truck powered by the same technology. Until then I will stick with my diesel.

wilber1

Abbotsford B.C. Canada

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Posted: 07/29/08 08:33pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

dirtbag3 wrote:

I sure hope those MIT guys read this forum.
Sure would'nt want them wasting their time after consulting with you boys.


I don't think they are waisting their time, the idea of being able to give an engine a large increase in power and torque on demand is a good one, akin in some respects to nitrous but as far as making a 5 liter gasser put out that kind of power and torque over a long period of time for a serious tow vehicle, I'm skeptical. It will have to be designed as one tough engine from the crankcase up, like a diesel.


"Never trust a man who has not a single redeeming vice" WSC

JPhelps

SE of Monkeys Eyebrow & Possum Trot

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Posted: 07/29/08 08:58pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Quote:

When asked what the power potential of a 5.0-liter turbo V-8 with ethanol boost would be, Cohn suggested 500 horsepower with peak torque of 700 pounds-feet. Actual figures, of course, may change following durability and emissions testing.


The most significant part of that paragraph is: "Actual figures, of course, may change following durability and emissions testing".

Quote:

high compression (12:1 or 13:1) and turbocharged, with boost pressures around 35psi


They talk like this thing will be cheaper than a diesel to produce. Cylinder pressure (BMEP) is what makes power and the smaller the displacement the more pressure and/or rpm you need to make the power, and both of those are expensive to make reliable over lots of miles. And if you want it to go 200,000/300,000 miles towing 10,000/15,000 pounds it will be really expensive.
I don't see a savings here either in initial cost or fuel mileage, that is is if you really want to tow something.
But it is definitely worth researching, as long as I don't have to pay for it.

JPhelps

SE of Monkeys Eyebrow & Possum Trot

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Posted: 07/30/08 01:43pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Cummins has a 472HP/942TQ QSB-5.9 available right now if you need one. Of course it is a diesel, for a boat.
http://marine.cummins.com/attachments/pu........s/Recreational%20Inboard/QSB/fr92132.pdf

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