Crazy_2 wrote: Saw a set up last week while on vacation in Maine.
A late 90's Chev sedan pulled in towing a single axle 70's or 80's vintage TT.
No Weight distribution, No Sway control, No brakes, No lights,
back end almost dragging on the ground, electric hook up from the Trailer was dragging on the ground so that is what tipped me off to the no brakes and lights.
I assume this was a local with not a lot of cash getting out with friends/family for a weekend,
Did I say anything? No was not my place to comment and the individual probably already aware of how unsafe the rig was anyhow.
In his defence he did show up with the trailer by himself unhook set up then left and picked up his passengers which included a 3 or 4 year old child with out the trailer, good for him on that point.
Point I'd make on that topic is a bad setup is a bad setup no matter what vehicle is in front. He could have had your Nissan in front, and with everything else wrong he still would have been unsafe. The fact he was using a car is almost not important in light of everything else that was wrong.
Agreed, just pointing out an observation.
I would be a fool to think people question my set up.
That said I would never venture out with out basic saftey in mind, something this individual apparently didn't consider.
03 Nissan Xterra
Travel Star Sport XLT 24 FQB by Starcraft 3570 LBS Dry
Prodogy EBC, Reece Dual Cam WDH
SteveRankin wrote: Wow! 26 MPG on the highway and 17 towing into a headwind with your Freestar. 19-20 MPG in normal towing. Consumer Reports got 11 MPG in town, 25 MPG on the highway, but only 20 MPG on a 150 trip. They also only averaged 17 MPG overall.
Sorry that it bothers you Steve, but my fuel economy is almost identical to what Jimmy has reported.
* This post was
edited 08/20/08 01:37pm by Fast Mopar *
2004 Ford Freestar 4.2 liter
2003 Jayco Qwest 12A
preserve the Second Amendment
Caddy.....we seemed to have a gentlemanly debate between us on here.......(Me and You)
But i went back to look at some of your posts....
8/15 "I see full-size trucks like Panzer tanks flying down the freeway at 70+ mph" was before Steve said anything to you....
8/12 "We research every aspect to the nth degree and make decisions based on knowledge that we have gleaned ourselves. From my perspective, the guys who blindly follow the published tow ratings are the ones who are ignorant"
8/15"WOW, lot's of long winded replies here - some good, some bad and some plain old junk."
and i can easily see how some people feel you started the bad mouthing.....
This thread has gone on for 18 pages and is now becoming personal. I have edited quite a few posts to try to keep it alive but have had enough.
Any more personal attacks and the thread will be closed.
Barney
clarkely wrote: Caddy.....we seemed to have a gentlemanly debate between us on here.......(Me and You)
But i went back to look at some of your posts....
8/15 "I see full-size trucks like Panzer tanks flying down the freeway at 70+ mph" was before Steve said anything to you....
8/12 "We research every aspect to the nth degree and make decisions based on knowledge that we have gleaned ourselves. From my perspective, the guys who blindly follow the published tow ratings are the ones who are ignorant"
8/15"WOW, lot's of long winded replies here - some good, some bad and some plain old junk."
and i can easily see how some people feel you started the bad mouthing.....
OK, I apologize. I did not realize that was how those phrases were interpreted. But you are taking them out of context.
The first comment was meant to counter the comments implying that towing with a minivan made the roads unsafe for everyone. In truth, the larger and heavier the vehicle you drive, the more danger you are to those around you. For those of us driving normal cars and sedans, an Excursion in the rear view mirror IS like a Panzer tank bearing down on you. From my perspective, it's far more unnerving to experience this than to see a slightly overloaded tow vehicle occasionally.
Second, being ignorant is not something to be ashamed of. It simply means "uninformed". It is not an insult. Clearly, there were/are many people on this thread ignorant to some of the specifics regarding minivans and towing.
Third, that was not my quote, that was someone else's reply to me. I did reply to that one with a comment that was probably inflammatory, but I wanted to make the point that discounting someone else's opinion because it doesn't match yours only prevents you from learning anything about your original assumptions. Hey, I could be wrong. But if you don't consider what I'm saying, you can't ever know can you?
The last point is best illustrated by a story I read once. From memory; Many years ago in my youth, I remember helping my mother in the kitchen. On Sundays we would always make a nice ham after church. My mother would carefully prepare the ham with love, humming and smiling the whole time. First she would season it with cloves and cinnamon. Then she would cut a piece off both ends of the ham, lay them on their side and season them as well. Placing the ham in the roasting pan, she would take the pieces she cut off and lay them flat on top of the ham holding them in place with toothpicks before sliding the roasting pan into the oven.
Many years later my parents were old and I was married with a family of my own. I decided to make a traditional Sunday ham and invite them over. I wanted to show my mother I could make a ham just like she taught me so I invited her to help me in the kitchen. When I took out a knife and began slicing one of the ends off the ham, she exclaimed "My dear, what are you doing?" I told her I was preparing the ham exactly as she had taught me. She began laughing and told me "Sweetie, I always cut the ends off because I didn't have a roasting pan big enough for a whole ham!"
The moral of the story is just because something has always been done a certain way, doesn't mean there is good reason to continue the same practice without ever revisiting the original. Sometimes it's good to question "Why". Keep an open mind.
'04 Ford Freestar (Primary tow vehicle) '05 Subaru Forester (Backup tow vehicle) '65 Bethany popup (best popups ever made!) Looking for a tow vehicle Minivan towing
I felt we had a gentlemanly debate....and i still do....I was merely pointing out what you had said......
After all....."Second, being ignorant is not something to be ashamed of. It simply means "uninformed". It is not an insult."
And i agree with you whole heartedly....just remember statistics can be made to say what you want them to....they can be interpreted many different ways..... You can see what you want through them.
I'm reminded of saying that is applicable to the whole thread........Just agree to disagree
You aren't going to persuade people to jump ship to your opinion......and the others aren't going to persuade you..
clarkely wrote: I felt we had a gentlemanly debate....and i still do....I was merely pointing out what you had said.....
To be honest, there wasn't a post of yours that bothered me.
I enjoy intelligent debate, providing both sides have an open mind and are willing to stick to facts. Some of the other posts (and I think you know which) were all-out calling me a liar, and that doesn't sit well with someone who values the truth as much as I. I shouldn't have taken the bait, but sometimes hindsight is 20:20 isn't it?
The OP of this thread made assumptions about the type of person who would tow with a minivan, and many of the replies indicated guys like us needed to be "taught" right from wrong. Hopefully, at minimum I showed that some of us don't need any more wisdom on this topic. I upgraded to my current minivan, and haven't looked back.
Someone who has tried it both ways and chose the unpopular solution should be considered a little more seriously than some want to admit.
SteveRankin wrote: Wow! 26 MPG on the highway and 17 towing into a headwind with your Freestar. 19-20 MPG in normal towing. Consumer Reports got 11 MPG in town, 25 MPG on the highway, but only 20 MPG on a 150 trip. They also only averaged 17 MPG overall.
Sorry that it bothers you, Steve, by my fuel economy is almost identical to what Jimmy has reported.
I can agree with that....look at what you are towing!! I pulled a U-Haul car dolly with a motorcycle attached to it years agobehind a Subaru GL wagon and got over 20 MPG too!! But when I got to the smallest grade I was in the truck lane with big rigs bearing down on me while I crawled up the hill!!
To each his own...this thread is so long winded it is silly. I can't tow my trailer with a Freestar if I wanted to...besides...I like the Honda van better anyway!!
SteveRankin wrote: Wow! 26 MPG on the highway and 17 towing into a headwind with your Freestar. 19-20 MPG in normal towing.
Consumer Reports got 11 MPG in town, 25 MPG on the highway, but only 20 MPG on a 150 trip. They also only averaged 17 MPG overall.
Here is a link to an interesting, unbiased and privately run website where you can get actual, real-world mileage estimates based on other people's submissions. The website is called True Delta.
I get 24ish daily highway driving
17+ towing -IF- I do 55 MPH
14-16 at 60+ MPH
Just rolled over 73K and no mountain east of the Missisip has ever given me an issue. Still waiting on my tranny to blow like most people said it would.
27 foot TrailManor 2720 pulled by a Nissan Quest (3.5L 240HP/242T) - Dual EU2000i Honda Generators
Now with over 52k miles - Pictures of the rig and trip snapshots
If it tows like "it is not back there" you have too much tow vehicle
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