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Open Roads Forum  >  Tech Issues

 > Connecting a voltmeter

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BurbMan

Louisville, KY

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Posted: 06/24/11 09:23am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Just ordered this digital voltage display and had a couple of questions....

If the 12v distribution panel and the batteriers (2-6v) are about 25' apart and connected by #2 wire, how accurate will this meter be if connected at the panel instead of the batteries? The goal is to monitor battery voltage when using the inverter, and charging voltage when plugged to shore power. I am thinking of wiring in a switch so I can turn off the display completely at night.

PapPappy

Wilmington, NC

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Posted: 06/24/11 09:29am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Why not find out??
Take the meter and check voltage at the batteries.....then check when you hook up at the panel. You will see if there is a difference, and can figure that in to any calculations you might make regarding the batteries.

My guess, you won't see but maybe 0.1 volt difference, which isn't really much to worry about.

Good Luck


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wolfe10

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Posted: 06/24/11 09:32am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

The answer is "it depends".

With no electrical draw, the voltage will be the same at both locations.

The higher the electrical draw/more 12 VDC things you are running, the more voltage loss there will be in the wire.


Brett Wolfe
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big dave

Soldotna, Alaska, USA

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Posted: 06/24/11 09:41am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I agree with Brett, but even at full load, the difference will be small.


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wa8yxm

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Posted: 06/24/11 11:25am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

If the goal is to monitor battery voltage then you get an inline fuse holder, put a 1 amp (or smaller) fuse in it (down to around a quarter amp I'd guess) and hook it to the POSITIVE battery post, extend it out to the POSITIVE terminal on the volt meter) Negative wire runs from the volt meter back to the batteries, NOT the chassis, NOTE: put the fuse in last.

If you wish a switch in the line,, Well, ok, no problem.. Just put the fuse in last.

If you connect anywhere else you will get false readings (either high or low depending on what's happening just now)

Both leads back the the battery, FUSE in the positive as close to battery as possible, The meter should not need more than a quarter amp but blade fuses are the easiest and finding fractional amp is hard so use a 1 amp.


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Dave-Sparky

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Posted: 06/24/11 01:54pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I did a little research and math to get the following

#2 copper wire has a resistance of 0.000194 ohms per foot (NEC Chapter 9 table 4)

With a 25 foot separation (50 feet of wire) that results in a total resistance of .0097 ohms.

Assuming 40 amps of current (I) the voltage drop would be 0.388 volts. (V = I x R)

For comparison, the specifications for the meter's accuracy from the listing is given a worst case of 0.15 volt.

Thus, the error with a 40 amp load or charging current will be not much more than twice the potential error of the meter itself.

As noted above, any current less than 40 will have proportionately less error.

Dave


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wolfe10

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Posted: 06/24/11 02:17pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Dave,

Thanks for the leg work on the resistance/math.

To put that in perspective:

Fully charged 12 VDC battery at rest: 12.7 VDC.
50% discharged 12 VDC battery at rest: 12.2 VDC.

So there is only a half a volt of "working room" in the battery.

An accuracy "loss" of close to .4 of a volt would render the meter virtually worthless (.388 V is just too high a percent of the .5 V range).

As suggested earlier, connect it the the battery with a fuse and run wires to your meter. That way you will have more accurate information, even when drawing higher loads.

Dave-Sparky

Woodinville, Washington

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Posted: 06/24/11 05:25pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

For the most accurate measurement at a remote location you are absolutely correct.

In the trades this is called "four terminal monitoring" from the special shunts used for monitoring high currents without long runs of big wire. This is an example of four terminal current shunts.



The heavy, current carrying conductors are fastened to the studs, and the sensing conductors are fastened to the small sampling screws.

This prevents the resistance of the high current connections from causing errors in the monitoring circuits.

Similar techniques are used for remote voltage monitoring with the sensing connections not directly connected to the high current terminals to avoid the effect on the measurement by voltage drop across the connections.

For the direct monitoring of the battery, the sensing wires should be connected directly to the battery lugs, independently from the current carrying conductors. I have seen this done by drilling and tapping a sensing screw into the battery post. I have looked but I did not find a photo that showed this type of connection. I hope the description is adequate.


Dave

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