sailor53 wrote: I believe your statement says more about you than anything else. In your posts you say you speed because it is your choice, but other's driving habits annoy you and should be changed.
Actually I didn't say I speed. You have no idea if I do, and even if I do you have no idea whether doing so uses more fuel. I did say that others annoy me and that this is human nature. I just don't whine on and on about it in public. I'm a live and let live kinda guy. It is better for my health.
The government has done several studies that showed that consistently, about 85% of drivers go the speed that is most comfortable for the road and conditions, regardless of what the posted speed limit is. Almost all the speed-related accidents are caused by the 15% who drive above or below the general traffic speed. The safest speed to drive is the speed the majority is driving at. Having said that, if one is more comfortable, due to lack of driving skills or due to vehicular factors, driving at a lower speed, they should move to the right lane and drive that speed. Or as close to that speed as traffic will allow. I prefer to drive around 65 in my MH on the freeway, but will modify that 5 MPH one way or the other if traffic requires it. On surface roads I try to move with traffic, or pull over often to allow faster traffic to pass. Speed limits are set at the point where the lowest common denominator driver is safe on average road conditions - about 10 MPH below the safe speed for an alert driver in a good vehicle on good road conditions.
Granted, driving between 45-55 MPH gives the best fuel mileage, but that is only one little factor in fuel usage. Look at a graph of MPG vs. speed and you will see that 20 and 75 MPH give about the same fuel efficiency. You get 0 MPG at a stop light and terrible mileage until you have gotten up to 40 or so. If the government wants to improve fuel usage, they need to force communities to time their lights better. There are towns that deliberately time the lights so you will hit every one on red, "for safety." All that does is cause some of the drivers to accelerate hard to try to make the next light before it turns red, blowing past RVers, truckers, and gentler acceleraters. Both groups of drivers end up wasting fuel. One day of light traffic, I tried driving 5-10 over the limit so I could hit the lights on green on my way to work. I not only knocked nearly 30% off my travel time, but I also got 3 MPG better mileage.
I agree that excess speed on a short trip across town is silly much of the time. However, on a long trip it can make a difference. On a trip to Florida many years ago we drove 5-10 over the limit the whole way and stopped every hour for a quick stretch break. Another vehicle got on the freeway at the same time as us in MI and drove speed limit the whole way, stopping only for fuel a few times. We both ended our day at the same time, but they were stiff and worn out while we were fresh. We had similar vehicles, didn't get much different mileage, and we found it well worth the few bucks of fuel to get the rest breaks. Often the few extra MPH will get you to your destination before dark as opposed to arriving after the office closes.
That last paragraph applies mainly to cars and smaller RVs. When we moved up to a MH, we began driving in the right lane at a much slower pace, and enjoying it. Let everyone else pass us and fly on by. As long as we aren't in the center lane and obstructing traffic or going so slow in the right lane that we hold up even the slow vehicles, I can't see that we are harming anyone. But then, I often find that I can go speed limit and end up passing more vehicles than pass me. That's what really bugs me.
I do not think RVing is a waste of fuel, I know it is. So does everyone on this forum. I chose to do so anyway. However, I find it rather comical that someone who drives a F-350 Extended Cab 4 x4, with an 18k hitch, pulling a 32' plus trailer "full time" would dare to lecture anyone on "them wasting our precise fuel."
There are very few things more wasteful than pulling a 32' plus trailer around the USA all year. Then for them to complain that people they meet are wasting fuel by speeding? Really!!!!!
tsetsaf wrote: So what is your rant? Does the act of speeding offend you? Personally I don't care about people speeding as much as I do people who make reckless driving moves; ie tail-gating, cutting vehicles off, texting while driving, or even driving too slow in a fast lane.
Personally I never drive faster than 65 and never faster than 55 while towing. I like my money and hate to waste it on fuel and premature vehicle wear.
First, I didn't use the word "rant" anywhere in my post. Speeding doesn't offend me though it does bother me for the reasons I mentioned.
Second, I was simply pointing out how we as a nation waste fuel by speeding. One thing I didn't mention is how speeding is also a direct contributor to accidents.I recall reading somewhere that when the speed limit went from 55 mph to 65 mph...accidents went down.
The other items you mentioned our worthy of examination, also. Perhaps someone else will address them in their own thread. You, maybe? I already have my own windmill to deal with.
I have difficulty with people who drive well over the speed limit and those who drive well under the speed limit...in other words extremists on both ends.
Too fast...say 15-20 mph can be too fast...15-20 mph under the limit...causes traffic tie ups. I also find from extensive travels in both the USA and Canada...that there is a shortage of good drivers. We have too many drivers distracted by all the toys in their vehicles, cell phones, etc. There are a lot of just poor drivers who don't have a clue how to pull out of a skid, drive to conditions, etc.
As a traffic enginer who sets speed limits and has done research in the area, I'll offer a little insite:
The most reconized and accepted method of setting the speed limit is based on the 85 percentile (the speed that 85% of traffic is traveling at or slower than). Many urban communities ignore the science and set arbitrarily low speed limits in the name of "safety" but the research proves them wrong time after time.
- Study after study shows that the number on the speed limit sign has no effect on the average speed. It can actually make it less safe if set too low. You get a percentage of the traffic that tries to follow the artificially low speed limit while the vast majority drives at a reasonable and prudent speed. This creates lots of passing and lane changes rather than consistent travel speeds. Interactions between vehicles lead to crashes.
- The 85% provides for a speed that drivers will naturally comply with. When set arbitrarily low, the vast majority of traffic is "speeding". If a freeway has 4000 vehilces/hr and 3500 vehicles/hr are speeding there is no way enforcement can solve the problem. At best it's a profit center that lowers the publics respect for our police officers and the traffic stops are safety problems in and of themselves.
- There is no need to worry about how the road is designed. The 85% is always within a couple mph of the speed the road was designed for. Turns out the average driver is very good at determining the safe speed.
- If you want to look at safety, the drivers least likely to be involved in a crash are traveling a few mph above the average speed. If you are substantially higher or lower than the average speed, your odds of getting into a crash increase substantially, so if you are going slow and backing up traffic, you are one of the most dangerous drivers on the road.
- Lower speeds will save fuel but the 55mph speed limit was a joke. The studies show the average freeway speed was 73mph before during and after.
If you have a line of vehicles behind you, you are the problem. Pick up the pace or at least stay in the right lane out of the way as much as possible.
Tammy Mike & the Bilge Rat (AKA: Diego)
Ford F250 7.3L
1997 Sunnybrook 27' 5er
1995 Gemini Sail Catamaran 34'
Full Time spliting time between boat and 5er
"If you have a line of vehicles behind you, you are the problem."
You are also violating the law in many areas. Some say 4 vehicles or more trapped behind you, and you must pull over and let them by "where it is safe for you to do so". Some say 5 vehicles or more.
No only is it courteous, it is required BY LAW!
CM1, USN (RET)
2002 Fleetwood Southwind 32V, Ford V10
Toad: 2006 Jeep Rubicon LJ
Other toad: '06 PT Cruiser, Kar Kaddy dolly
Toy: 1977 Dodge W100 CC SWB, 3/4 ton axles & springs
"When seconds count, help is only minutes away!"
Liriope wrote: I also find it funny for someone or anyone pulling or driving an RV to complain "about other people" wasting fuel."
I think you miss the point. No, I am sure you miss the point. The idea is for all of us to drive more efficiently, regardless of what we are driving and for whatever reason, to conserve a valuable resource.
If you feel RV'ing is a "waste of fuel", then maybe you should find another pastime.
Nope, you are missing the point. Complaining about speeding being a waste of fuel is ludicrous when you are driving an RV.
Your choice to use excessive fuel by using an RV is just as "dumb" as using excessive fuel by speeding. Doesn't matter if you do it economically or not. I could say that I economically 'speed' by riding a motorcycle.
If you don't understand or like people that speed is fine with me.
Accusing someone of excessive use of fuel when they get over 20mpg while you are getting less than 10mpg is just stupid.
2009 Dodge 2500 Double Cab Cummins
2003 Skyline Nomad 24ft Fiver
Me and Wife
Maggie the Old English Sheepdog
valhalla360 wrote: The most reconized and accepted method of setting the speed limit is based on the 85 percentile (the speed that 85% of traffic is traveling at or slower than). Many urban communities ignore the science and set arbitrarily low speed limits in the name of "safety" but the research proves them wrong time after time.
I can confirm that this is true. In CA, cities can set their own speed limits on their municipal streets. However, by CA law, if they want to use radar enforcement, they must comply with the engineering study result of speed on that street. Set it below the study result, and radar cannot be used in court. Our own city recently had to increase the speed limit on many of our streets, even though they really didn't want to, but the police department wanted to keep their radar.
Whenever you see a rubber hose tacked across the street and connected to a little box over on the curb, that is a speed study in progress.
"Whenever you see a rubber hose tacked across the street and connected to a little box over on the curb, that is a speed study in progress.
Actually, it has been my experience that a single hose across the street is a traffic count in progress. TWO hoses a short distance apart is a speed study.
One of the portable radar speed indicators may also have a recording device attached that records traffic speed.
It might even have a camera! SMILE as you go by!
mowermech wrote: "If you have a line of vehicles behind you, you are the problem."
You are also violating the law in many areas. Some say 4 vehicles or more trapped behind you, and you must pull over and let them by "where it is safe for you to do so". Some say 5 vehicles or more.
No only is it courteous, it is required BY LAW!
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