ClassAGeek wrote: Now I am confused. You can get a new Class A Gasser with a top-end interior for $150K new. The exact same interior from the same manufacturer in a DP can cost $250K - $300K and up.
Which is the high-end coach?
Is paying $100K+ more for a vehicle that will never go 100K miles in its lifetime really a sign of 'best value'?
NOPE, never happen.....you ,may get what you think is a high end interior in a gas coach, but dig under the glitz and glamor to see what you actually got.....paper wrapped press board for cabinets, inferior materials for coverings and a cheaper grade carpet or tiles. The attention to detail, the fitment, etc. Sorry, but you will NEVER get the quality in a less expensive gas coach that you will get in a "high end" DP, NEVER.
Bob & Betsy(FishNFanatic) - USN Aviation Ret'd '78 & LEO Ret'd '03 & "Oath Keeper Forever" '05 HR Endeavor 40PRQ, 400 Cummins-Pulling our '11 Silverado LT, Ex Cab 6.2L NHT 4x4, w/2010 Rzr or 01 V Star in back. Where the wheels are stopped today
I bought an '02 Tiffin Zephyr three years ago. I had a huge repair bill right out of the box. I've got a large stack of receipts for all the other repairs--none super large but they add up. I've also got a large list of things that still need repairing. And the coach that I bought was in very good shape.
I'm still happy with buying older and higher end. This is my first coach and I didn't know what to look for. I love the 450 HP Cummins. The side radiator. It's very large and doesn't have the cooling problems some of the lower end chassis' have. Allison 4000 transmission. Independent front suspension.
I wouldn't have spent enough to get these options new. For every shade or awning that has to be replaced, I realize that the foundation is so solid. I won't retire for quite awhile but I'm planning on this coach lasting for the rest of my interest in RVing.
So, go ahead and buy higher end and older. Just make sure you've got another $10K+ for repairs. You'll rest easier.
ClassAGeek wrote: Now I am confused. You can get a new Class A Gasser with a top-end interior for $150K new. The exact same interior from the same manufacturer in a DP can cost $250K - $300K and up.
Which is the high-end coach?
Is paying $100K+ more for a vehicle that will never go 100K miles in its lifetime really a sign of 'best value'?
You make a good point but can you share an example in...say a 40' gasser high end coach vs, the same build quality in a DP from the same manufacturer.
Dick
2000 40" DP Beaver Patriot Thunder Cat C-12 425 HP, 1550 Tq
1997 Jeep GC Limited ---toad
2008 Toyota Tundra Crew Max Limited TRD (Retired)
2009 Cougar 268 RLS ~8700 lbs road wt (Retrired)
2006 Jeep Liberty Turbo Diesel.....TV in Training
Unless you get an old MH with no slides I suspect you will have various mechanical problems as it ages.
I know of fires occurring in million dollar rigs so buying quality helps but it is no panacea IMO. Ageing and things failing is just life even if the engine is running strong.
New is ok IMO. You pay for it and you have to deal with break in issues but depreciation is some what over stated.
There is no perfect solution IMO. I would consider all options and buy what works for you. There are pros and cons to both. Any MH is better than sitting at the brick house.
Grant Lasson wrote: I bought an '02 Tiffin Zephyr three years ago. I had a huge repair bill right out of the box. I've got a large stack of receipts for all the other repairs--none super large but they add up. I've also got a large list of things that still need repairing. And the coach that I bought was in very good shape.
would you mind sharing what you missed seeing that cost you so much up front???????
Those people that chose the new hotel over the older luxury one have never sat sipping a glass of wine in the old luxury hotel while a hurricane took the new cheap hotel into the next state in pieces. But on the other hand I didn't mention the age of the hotels---only the class.
LoneCowboy wrote: would you mind sharing what you missed seeing that cost you so much up front???????
The Zephyr has a side radiator. The cooling fans are driven by a hydraulic pump. The hydraulics are provided by a "power takeoff" (PTO) from the transmission. My PTO had a dry spline. These dry splines apparently had a history of prematurely wearing out at about 30,000 miles. When they wear out, the hydraulic pump is usually ruined.
I bought my Zephyr at about 31,000 miles. I drove it to Utah from Arizona. I left on our first family trip a few weeks later. I didn't even get out of my home city. It overheated big time. Had it towed to the local Freightliner. They couldn't fix it. Had it towed to Smith Power Products. They fixed it. It took 30 days in the shop and my bill was over $6K.
Did I miss something? I don't think so. Who knows to study what kind of PTO your coach has? I didn't even know it had a PTO.
I've heard a lot of first trip stories since then and I'm convinced you should have some extra money on hand for unexpected problems.
The Zephyr has a side radiator. The cooling fans are driven by a hydraulic pump. The hydraulics are provided by a "power takeoff" (PTO) from the transmission. My PTO had a dry spline. These dry splines apparently had a history of prematurely wearing out at about 30,000 miles. When they wear out, the hydraulic pump is usually ruined.
I bought my Zephyr at about 31,000 miles. I drove it to Utah from Arizona. I left on our first family trip a few weeks later. I didn't even get out of my home city. It overheated big time. Had it towed to the local Freightliner. They couldn't fix it. Had it towed to Smith Power Products. They fixed it. It took 30 days in the shop and my bill was over $6K.
Did I miss something? I don't think so. Who knows to study what kind of PTO your coach has? I didn't even know it had a PTO.
Good luck,
Grant
This was also a common and well-published issue on some Country Coaches. Anyone on any of the RV forums with those coaches was aware of it and was made aware of the fix which was to install a "wet kit" for the PTO that ran the hydraulic pump.
Sorry for your troubles, but, yes you DO need to stay on top of mechanical issues affecting your coach. RV's are still pretty much a "cottage industry" so there are not 100,000's of thousands on the road to "proof" each chassis decision.
A good reason to belong to your chassis owners club, a diesel engine club and coach owners club. First, they are a lot of fun. Second, you will learn if there are issues and be able to address them before they become expensive.
Sorry for your troubles, but, yes you DO need to stay on top of mechanical issues affecting your coach. RV's are still pretty much a "cottage industry" so there are not 100,000's of thousands on the road to "proof" each chassis decision.
A good reason to belong to your chassis owners club, a diesel engine club and coach owners club. First, they are a lot of fun. Second, you will learn if there are issues and be able to address them before they become expensive.
No arguments here. I didn't get the problem solved until I joined a few forums and posted my problem. I was quickly directed to some of the research and solutions. The forums are invaluable. I have learned so much from their very helpful members. In this case, the mechanics were not even aware of the problem or the solution. I had to email the information to them! They would have reassembled it without the "wet" kit.
On the other hand, here is a potential problem with buying a coach that had low volume production. No one on the Tiffin RV Network was aware of the problem--I posted the first and only instance. If there was a problem with a Phaeton or an Allegro Bus, there would have been a much greater chance of the problem being known.
When I attended Camp Freightliner, I got a lot of attention because my coach was on a VCL chassis. That was the first version of the Powerliner and wasn't a common chassis--at least at Tiffin. Mike was constantly saying, "On your coach, it's different..."
So that is something to be aware of if you're going to buy an older, higher-end chassis. You won't find a lot of other people in the same boat and you won't participate in the cumulative experience of others as readily.
I say all this knowing that many wouldn't consider the Zephyr as "higher end."
It would help in the discussion for you to just say in what your budget is, to comment on your hands on DIY ability to fix common mechanical and electrical problems, and your tolerance for risk.
There is no right answer as you can tell from the previous posts. What works for me is totally wrong for someone else.
I chose the older high end. You can buy a mid nineties Newell, no slide coach for the low 100s these days. It'll have a Detroit Series 60 engine and really nice appliances, fit and finish. If you put money into redecorating, you are at least starting with really strong bones.
For 100 or so, I would seriously, seriously look at Foretravels, Newells, and Wanderlodges. I like those three because of their construction. God forbid you should ever roll it, but those three will stay together instead of exploding because of the construction design.
Of course, you can go the Prevost route, but I suspect for the money you are thinking that would only get you an two stroke DD engine and some pretty outdated interiors.
Just my .02, worth just that much.
Richard, Rhonda, Ty, and Alex
1995 Newell with 470HP Detroit Diesel
2005 Gulfstream MB G26
Subaru Outback toad
The blog wersquared.wordpress.com
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