plumgrubby
Florida
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Joined: 06/02/2012
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I joined this group in hopes of helping other Alfa owners that might have or possibly will have the problem that I just finally found after 5 days of being underneath my 2003 40 ft. SeeYa with a mechanic with 47 years experience on diesels.
It started when I was going on vacation to Panama City Beach to meet my son and his wife. Upon leaving home I immediately noticed that the air gauges ( front and rear ) on the dashboard were both fluctuating from 120 lbs to around 95 lbs. Both were doing it at the exact same time and equally. Not to worry the wife or miss vacation, I kept a sharp eye on the gauges and it continued for the entire 10 hour drive. It didn't seem to have any effect on my braking so I just kept on truckin'.
Nine days later we were headed back home but this time when we left the air pressure in the Rear tank went to 120 lbs and dropped to 100 lbs. and stayed there BUT the front would NOT go above 100 Lbs. and fluctuated crazily from about 90 lbs to 70 lbs. Kept my mouth shut so the wife wouldn't get worried and it still didn't seem to affect braking in any way although I used the Retarder as often as I could. So much for the symptoms...... you will not believe the "Rest of the Story". LOL
Neighbor came over and said that we'd fix it. OK... crawled under the Coach and started..... replaced Air Governor.. NO FIX.
Replaced Unloader Kit ....... NO FIX.
Improvised and put air directly into both Rear and Front tanks...... would not go above 100 Lbs in rear and about 74 In front. Air dropped immediately to 65 lbs. NO FIX there.
Suspected bad PPV valve.... called Freightliner about 25 times...... wonderful, wonderful crew manning the phones..... but NO FIX. All had the same ideas that we already had tried. Everyone stumped totally.
So today was day 5 under the coach. Freightliner 24/7 help line
( 1-800-FTL-HELP ) bent over backwards to help us in any way they could and they sent us the complete air schematic for the coach. My mechanic had spent 2 nights not sleeping and going over the schematic making a multitude of notes. Check this, check that, test this and that. We never heard an air leak...... until we heard a very slight hiss. Tried to duplicate it over and over. Hard to tell where it was coming from WHEN we could faintly hear it and it only lasted a few seconds. Now remember we've spent 5 hot Florida days under this coach.
Finally he said to me..."What's behind that door? I see a line that's NOT on the schematic". I said that it was my Inverter compartment. We literally ripped open the door...... there was the MAJOR leak that we could not hear or find.
It was a 3 to 4 inch split in of all things.... my Air Horn line. It seems that Alfa......... NOT Freightliner, was responsible for installing the air horns and they DID NOT USE DOT APPROVED AIR HOSE!!!
It was just the cheap clear plastic air line hose that you can even use on your fish tank or refrigerator water line. I immediately called Freightliner and informed them of the find. They were stunned...... totally. The line comes DIRECTLY off the secondary tank and routed through the Inverter compartment, under the front hood to the air horns. WE clamped off the bad line and BINGO.... All the pressures went right up to where they're supposed to be. FIVE DAYS.....For a cheap, illegal piece of air hose. My mechanic told me that ALL air hoses on this or any large vehicle are required to be DOT approved.
So all my Brother Alfa owners and possibly other brands...... lift up your left front Inverter doors and check for cheap plastic hose running to your air horns....and CHANGE IT IMMEDIATELY so that you don't have to spend five days on your backs under the coach looking as we did.
Sorry if this is so long but I want to help prevent some problems that others may incur. Love my Alfa. Want it to last a long time. Contact me if you need any more info.
Paul ( PlumGrubby )
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past-MIdirector
Michigan
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Joined: 03/03/2007
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A lot of people thing that working on RVs is like a car. Learned years ago there is almost no comparison. I've heard of tech tracing wires that disappear on the other side of a wall only to fine someone at the factory spliced and changed wire colors before the wall was put in. Hydraulic, air, and water lines run to close to heat sources. Duct work not properly installed or sealed. Engine compartments not built for proper air flow to the engine. You can go on and on with things they have done wrong during construction.
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slickest1
canada
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Joined: 07/19/2010
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That is quite a story! Unbelievable they would use such a cheap hose. Glad you found the problem.
2000 H.R. Imperial 38wds rr8r roadmaster, isc 350 cummins
2007 Chevy Trailblazer, Blue ox towbar
Ready Brake with breakaway.
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mmiille
Iowa
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I have an air leak also. I wonder if it could be similar.
Martin & Cheryl
40 Foot 2009 Damon Tuscany
Two kids left the nest and left the wiener dog.
Full timing since Sept. 2010 so we sold the house in Feb. 2011.
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00 BUCK
NE Ohio
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Good job
Thanks for the pass on I have a "non DOT air line " for the air brakes
this is a good thing to remember
2011 Newmar - VENTANA -- with COMFORT DRIVE 
2011 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited Sahara
Blue Ox Aventa LX Tow bar w/ Roadmaster adapters
AirForce One brake system
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If your not the lead dog
the view never changes
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dougrainer
Carrolton, Texas
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Joined: 06/11/2007
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Are you the original owner? Doug
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plumgrubby
Florida
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No, I'm not the original owner. I have no idea how it went this long without rupturing. On the day I was leaving to meet our son and his wife, when I pulled out of the storage area I thought I was dragging something. It sounded like that but it must have been the air coming out of the ruptured line leading to the air horn.
Right after that I started noticing the air pressure gauges fluctuating.
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SpinRite
Research Triangle, NC
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Joined: 07/17/2006
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I had a similar phantom air leak that no one could find. It gradually worsened over many months. During that time, several people crawled all around under the coach listening for the sound of escaping air. Gallons of soapy water was slopped all over the air lines and connections to look for telltale bubbles. Finally, the pressure dropped so fast that the leak just had to be audible -- but no one could hear it!
It turned out to be the air horn solenoid leaking. The hose to the horn carried the leaking air up to the roof where no one could hear it hissing (and there wasn't enough air to actually toot the horn).
It was finally discovered, not by detection, but by deduction!
'94 Holiday Rambler Navigator
38', Cummins 8.3 300hp, Allison 3060
pushed by a 2005 Honda Element
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dougrainer
Carrolton, Texas
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plumgrubby wrote:No, I'm not the original owner. I have no idea how it went this long without rupturing. On the day I was leaving to meet our son and his wife, when I pulled out of the storage area I thought I was dragging something. It sounded like that but it must have been the air coming out of the ruptured line leading to the air horn.
Right after that I started noticing the air pressure gauges fluctuating.
I asked because that hose was probably NOT original equipment. IF it was, it would have ruptured long before this. 2nd and other owners should NOT be so quick to condemn Manufacturers when they are NOT the original owner and cannot be positive it was a Factory installed problem. I see non factory modifications all the time on 2nd,3rd and so on owned RV's. Doug
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steeler85048
Peoria AZ
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Joined: 12/21/2012
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I have a 2004 Alfa See-ya and also had the exact same leak in the exact same location.
The tubing was a white poly tubing and the split in the line was just up from the push fitting. It would have been an easy fix on the road but the engineers at Alfa in their infinite wisdom decided to super-glue the push fitting so that it could not be compressed. To me it was obvious that Alfa did this install because the line has the black expanding foam on it they used to fill the voids in the front end with.
I simply plugged the port to the air horn line. (Of course I now have no horn) I have yet to fix because the push fitting they glued was not re-usable after they ruined it with glue. I was tempted to get a plastic push fitting from Lowes but thought better of it. I will wait till I can get a brass push fitting similar to the one removed.
I hope everyone checks this as well,
Cheers and Happy Holidays,
Philip
* This post was
edited 12/21/12 07:32pm by steeler85048 *
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