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RE: Trimetric Monitor and Battery Charging Help

Battery death sentence Not guesswork. The WFCO snotrag is 101% sure to destroy your excellent batteries. 101% is pretty bad odds. I'll make fifty to one book on it and walk away grinning at the loser's expense. I've done the following to a 55-amp WFCO. From a different power supply I passed 50 amps through the solid block aluminum heat-sink for nine minutes. I was foolish enough to not testing thermally before I touched it. HELLO FIRST DEGREE BURN thumb and forefinger. The aluminum was at >400F Say nothing about the cooling fan. The factory fan is obstructed and is near useless. For finishing charging the most economical fix is to buy the 400-watt MEGAWATT Set the EXTERNAL VOLTAGE ADJUSTMENT TO FOURTEEN POINT FOUR 14.4 VOLTS, USE 10 GAUGE WIRE TO THE BATTERIES. and plug it into 120 volts AC. When the batteries drop charging amperage to 3.0 amperes, the batteries will be happy. If charging with a generator when the WFCO falls flat on its face and charges less than 30.0 amps, shut it off and start the Megawatt. Add 2 hours of charging time every week until you get home. For 1st aid at home connect the Megawatt for 2-days solid with your battery bank. Then disconnect. For pure rig storage, you may then want to connect a battery maintainer. Your reward if you deeply cycle those lifelines will be DOUBLE the battery life. The formula for charged voltage is one half of one percent of TWELVE VOLT (six cells) total amp-hour capacity. The above meets and agrees with Concorde's Lifeline operating manual exactly. No factory charger or converter is preset to do this -- not even close.
MEXICOWANDERER 07/12/19 12:20pm Tech Issues
RE: new westinghouse generator 3700/4500

Yeah, it's a real undercut. Selling out. Plumb for carpenter tools. Remember the triangle? I stuck by Bryant brand until it was bought out. Ersin Multicore, perhaps the finest solder ever made. And American made fasteners. KATO makes only near megawatt size generators. Basler regulators were garbage while Delco reigned supreme. LIMA generators were a fine generator. Disappeared. LeRoy Sommers is absolute garbage. Onan, without corruption, would disappear. Landyacht is the owner of a Transpo voltage regulator derived from scribbling on one of Vince's tablecloths at a restaurant overlooking Noyo Harbor. Frank Oropeza and I belted out perhaps seven or eight radical concepts and bless his heart he came through on production. Most of the basic concepts came from pulse width modulation (my idea) and MOSFET finals (his idea). No voltage droop and near 0% warranty failures. Adjustable voltage (his concept), and the masterpiece 911 series of voltage regulators that are virtually blow up proof. But the Chinese are incapable of producing the self-excited 911-04 because Texas Instruments will not OK the chip for foreign use. I am having problems accessing mil-spec switches the NOS is running dry. The Chinese have to buy jet engines from the Russians and Russia has junked ski-jump design aircraft carriers after one too many Flankers were photographed hanging off the bowsprit. Russia CAN NOT MANAGE to manufacture many superior quality items. one exception is the SOVTUBE. When transistors were unattainable they were forced to design halfway decent vacuum tubes or be threatened with a Siberian future. America could produce an overhead cam direct port ECU closed cooling system loop generator with a lifetime brush-less alternator inverter that could be half as loud as a Honda while using 2/3rds the fuel. But it'll never happen.
MEXICOWANDERER 07/10/19 01:05am Tech Issues
RE: charging batteries with truck

Unless you have a digital gauge on the dash your gauge cost thirteen cents. According to experience with my factory temperature gauge if it ever went to "H" the engine would be around 2,000 C Dollar for dollar nothing can touch the cost, ease of installation and fuel cost of a Harbor Freight 2-cycle engine and a Megawatt 36-amp charger. Not even close. Don't bother to compare. Not good for campgrounds with generator bans or national parks where employees pray for an outbreak of Lyme disease because their pay does not change whether there is a thousand campers or zero.
MEXICOWANDERER 07/05/19 02:45pm Tech Issues
RE: Charging battery with Honda 2000

Will my Honda 2000 charge the battery as fast on eco as it will fill throttle?You said 'the battery', which implies you have a single 12V battery. I assume either a group 24 or 27. The direct answer is YES, you can leave it on eco. What others are referring to is depending on the converter you use to charge the battery or how you are connecting the generator to the battery, there may be a quicker, better, or more efficient way to do it. I use a 30A Megawatt power supply similar to what Mex mentioned. You can buy one for $50 +shipping. And there is no need to go down to Mexico to get your fuel.
2112 06/25/19 06:06am Tech Issues
RE: On line source for Lifeline batteries?

I haven't done this but it might be a wise idea to divide $ by amp hours and see if there's a valid difference between the two BCI sizes. Four 4-D's make sense. Suddenly the last 20% of charging means not 10 amps but a 40 amp charge rate. This makes the running of a generator much more valid. With my wet Rolls batteries 100 amperes is quite near where the specific gravity readings tell me to revert to float. And that is = to 2,800 watts. Weight, space, and initial cost are the counterpoints and with AGM it is vital that the first 90% of your charge regimen reaches 20% of total amp hour capacity of the bank IF THE BATTERIES ARE DRAWN DOWN to 50% amp hours remaining. Means discharging to deep cycle exercise. This high amperage can be reduced to 10% if recharging occurs when remaining ampere hours total 60% of total capacity. Around 75% remaining amp hours the necessity of a minimum amperage recharge vanishes but the bank requires a full recharge every 2 weeks or so. A 36 amp Megawatt feeding off a small 1000 watt generator for 5 hours will take the sting out of this top charging. Let the gen run out of gas as a foolproof timer. Any time the regular onboard charger dips below 40 amps charge, revert to the Megawatt and tiny generator and save a lot of money in fuel. This only happens when top charging. I am presently residing in a stick and brick house. My consumption of electrical averaged over 24 hours ia NINETY SEVEN WATTS I am planning on using the 120amp charging from the truck and then using a Outback VFXR2812 that has a 125amp charger. Bulk charge at 14.4 from the truck and Honda 2200 watt gen or shore power and Outback for fully charging. So should I stick to just two of the 8D with a max 125amp charging rate?
S Davis 06/13/19 01:16pm Tech Issues
RE: On line source for Lifeline batteries?

I haven't done this but it might be a wise idea to divide $ by amp hours and see if there's a valid difference between the two BCI sizes. Four 4-D's make sense. Suddenly the last 20% of charging means not 10 amps but a 40 amp charge rate. This makes the running of a generator much more valid. With my wet Rolls batteries 100 amperes is quite near where the specific gravity readings tell me to revert to float. And that is = to 2,800 watts. Weight, space, and initial cost are the counterpoints and with AGM it is vital that the first 90% of your charge regimen reaches 20% of total amp hour capacity of the bank IF THE BATTERIES ARE DRAWN DOWN to 50% amp hours remaining. Means discharging to deep cycle exercise. This high amperage can be reduced to 10% if recharging occurs when remaining ampere hours total 60% of total capacity. Around 75% remaining amp hours the necessity of a minimum amperage recharge vanishes but the bank requires a full recharge every 2 weeks or so. A 36 amp Megawatt feeding off a small 1000 watt generator for 5 hours will take the sting out of this top charging. Let the gen run out of gas as a foolproof timer. Any time the regular onboard charger dips below 40 amps charge, revert to the Megawatt and tiny generator and save a lot of money in fuel. This only happens when top charging. I am presently residing in a stick and brick house. My consumption of electrical averaged over 24 hours ia NINETY SEVEN WATTS
MEXICOWANDERER 06/13/19 12:51pm Tech Issues
RE: Parallel batteries and a question regarding reserve capacity

My vote is for the 31 Lifeline in parallel. AGM batteries always render higher CCA qualities than standard flooded of the same group size. Add that to the fact that the Lifeline has the highest rating for 100 hour discharge and the plates are twice as thick and it adds up to an almost no brainer. Whom else makes their battery from case to lead paste in the USA? Deka will not respond to me to the answer. Even the lowly spiral batteries now come from Mexico. Read the online LIFELINE USER MANUAL and obey it. Charging is simple. 2 group 29 Lifelines XT batteries hold 100 USABLE amp hours. A simple Megawatt charger adjusted to 14.4 volts with a tiny screwdriver can recharge them "good enough" in four hours to endure a 3 month trip without a total charge. To total charge, get to an overnight power plug then plug the battery in at night and disconnect it in the morning. Can't get any simpler than that.
MEXICOWANDERER 06/10/19 09:07pm Tech Issues
RE: Help! Power Converter stopped charging batteries.

I got frustrated at the ever-increasing out of stock inventory of rectifiers and substituted 70-amp silicon stud rectifiers. The even more ancient ferro resonant converter rising voltage issue now costs $200+ to replace the computer type capacitors. The CHEAPEST way to go (because this rig seems to be a power pole princess) is the 400-series Megawatt. Chop AC power to the Magnatek and reconnect the Megawatt AC input terminals. Extend Megawatt 12 vac power outlet to original fuse panel 12vdc power inlet. For permanent PPPrincess duty set voltage at 13.5 Sixty bucks and it's an infinitely better system than the original. Clean battery terminals. PAINT positive terminal and nearby battery case RED. Do the negative with GREEN. Then spray anti corrosion coating over everything. If the battery sees cycling duty the above will not work. Use a modern converter.
MEXICOWANDERER 06/06/19 12:01pm Tech Issues
RE: Outback IC

Administration and engineering that takes fierce pride in their work is the envy of the world. No one except perhaps the British and the Krauts, have such and attitude. Caterpillar decades ago became disgusted with fasteners and batteries so they branded their own. Japan, India, and Korea all make their own heavy construction equipment. Come to Mexico and ask companies why they insist on Caterpillar and you will hear an earfull. We can manufacture the best stuff on earth, bar none. Little old me, takes a power supply apart and upgrades some parts and ends up with something damned near blowup proof. The upgraded 55 amp Megawatt laughs at overloading to the point of absurdity. My real thoughts about a good power supply would give it status worthy of intelligence. There is NO WAY I would think about building a hands off SMART CONVERTER because IT CAN'T BE DONE without extensive sensors and a central processor, for an off-grid or boondocking battery system. A lazy person is one of the most illogical things on the face of the earth.
MEXICOWANDERER 06/04/19 09:01pm Tech Issues
RE: Xantrex/magnum inverter

I am MOST interested in products that in fact need a warranty. The epitome of the "Best Warranty" LIFETIME WARRANTY Exchanged 6 times in 5 years. 2-times while on vacation, both were two hundred dollar tow jobs off the freeway. One time in a remote national park by a company that does not accept insurance ($375) the second time it took five days for a truck to arrive. Another time the parts store was out of stock OR.... No warranty and six years of trouble-free service just like the new factory starter. One of these scenarios will appeal to the person who drives 15 miles across town to save twenty five cents per gallon on gasoline. Their inverters cost more, but Outback has unrivaled history of fewest warranty claims. My 1993 2500 SB Trace inverter sort of reassures me I chose wisely over Trace's competition. And outback was the destination for Trace's top engineers when they learned that XANTREX bought out Trace. They fled in droves. Xantrex downgraded Trace's FETs and transformer's to Junk status, to save a few dollars. My Samlex is heavy and trouble free doing very occasional work. It took me twenty six dollars to upgrade my Megawatt to the point where I can SHORT CIRCUIT the output leads and eventually the 1200 watts of input circuit board fuse fails. My least concern is that I damaged something. Concentrate only on price and warranty and lose your hind end, part of both legs and most of your colon.
MEXICOWANDERER 05/28/19 02:11pm Tech Issues
RE: Watts Help Needed.

Hi, I would spend the extra 100 dollars for the 1800 watt unit. It is much more capable than the 1000 watt. Consider this manual charger instead of the automatic: https://www.harborfreight.com/10250-amp-12v-manual-charger-with-engine-start-60581.html Do use a coupon to reduce the price. The Megawatt may be a better choice. Have a look here: https://www.amazon.com/MegaWatt-S-350-12-9-5-15-Adjustable-Supply/dp/B00JZBE97U As of now I am going to use the generator for charging the battery. I'm guessing I will get a charger that uses about 25 amps. Wouldn't the 1,000 watt generator be plenty? My thinking is if I get the bigger one it will be a little heavier(not much), little more fuel and a tad bit louder. How acurate is published db levels? Are most published levels rated at 1/4 load? I never see published at what distance the db levels were taken. We will be tent camping on the beach so the next person may be closer than would be in a campground so I would like to keep the generator noise to the lowest level I can. If could afford it I would get a Honda. I know there are other brands just as quite as a Honda but still a bit more than I can afford right now. Jim
jbfoster 05/24/19 06:11pm Tech Issues
RE: Watts Help Needed.

"automatic" means it shuts off and does not go into float mode. "manual" means it does not shut off and you have to unplug it before the battery voltage goes too high. "regular charger" means it just brings the battery up in voltage and then shuts off (if automatic type) "RV converter/charger" most have "three-stage charging" ( three different voltages ) and stays on to do the float charge. it is "automatic" for changing its stages, but it stays on. "adjustable voltage charger" -you pick a voltage and it stays at that until you change it. so it is "manual" for that. Charger stays on. It is not "automatic" --you have to change the voltage from charging at say 14.5v then when the battery is full you can drop it to a float voltage, say 13.5. The Megawatt is like that last one. The PowerMax LK model of converters has three-stage automatic or you can set it to adjustable voltage. If you have the adjustable voltage set to 14.5, say, then you need to change that when the the battery is full to a float voltage, OR you can use Mex's timer to just turn the thing off, guessing how long to leave it on for. My suggestion is to pick the car type automatic charger and when it shuts itself off, then you can turn on the Tender to do the float , which you can leave on as long as you like. No timer, no complications.
BFL13 05/24/19 03:22pm Tech Issues
RE: Watts Help Needed.

I really appreciate all the advice. I thought it was better for the charge to start off high then as it charges the amps slowly starts to drop then when full the charger goes into trcikle cahrge? So it's better to charge a battery a full amps during the whole charge time? Like you said, going this way with the Megawatt I would need to put on a timer. Now the question is how long to set the timer for? From what I have seen and somewhat understand there is two types of automatic chargers. Regular and one for RV batteries. The car charger - depending the level of charge in the battery the charger starts at x amount of amps then slowly drops in amps then at a preset voltage the charger goes into trickle mode and the charging is done. RV battery charger - basically does the same but goes through these 6 or 7 different stages to charge and condition the battery. I have gone to different sites and talked to people that have RV's. Some say the one type, some say no get this type. I don't know which is the best so it is hard to make my mind up. I have looked at all types of chargers on Amazon and most have a lot of good reviews with a smaller amout of bad reviews. I really want to to what is best. I would rather have a charrger that gooes into trickle when done. With the Megawatt there is a chance to over charge or under charge if I don't get the timer on for the correct amount of time. Decisions decisions decisions Thanks guys Jim
jbfoster 05/24/19 02:04pm Tech Issues
RE: Watts Help Needed.

Do yourself a favor and get a Megawatt.
pianotuna 05/24/19 01:13pm Tech Issues
RE: Watts Help Needed.

Just fine. Smart chargers fill the battery to 80% which allows them to start sulfating right off the starting blocks. They end up ruined maybe 3 or 4 months after the warranty ends. Always wanted a SMART charger that turns a 100 amp hour battery into an 80 amp hour battery. You can thank the Socialist State of Californiagrad for outlawing the importation of ANY manual charger. Companies like Harbor Fright REFUSE to ship manual chargers to zip codes in Californiastan. A place where failed lawyers in Sacramento think for you. Even manual chargers with timers to shut off automatically are outright BANNED. Soon, don't laugh, they will be playing the part of doctors and electrical engineers and dieticians. Without a shred of proof they damned near got to the first stage of banning coffee (enforcing the law of putting a cancer warning label on packaging). Instead of insisting on a right out way of thirty feet clearance around power lines, when it's windy they are going to shut the grid down. Remember, you cannot cure STUPID The MEGAWATT or converters like what BFL 13 likes are the SOLE sources of battery chargers that do not murder batteries in California. Don Pianotuna, here are the SPECIFICS I have found in repairs to Harbor Freight chargers. Button diodes that release their bond to cheap aluminum heatsinks. They will then instantly overheat and burn up. Cheap 19 gauge POWER WIRES inside that attempt to pass 20 amps of current. BRASS fast-on terminals that overheat, then anneal, get soft as butter then the terminal burns up. Selector buttons that burn out, and their function means trying to switch six terminals at once. A DO NOT BUY even at a 90% discount recommendation from me. They are total 100% garbage. Down here in Mexico, wheeled Schumaker manual chargers are sold in COSTCO for $107 dollars + 8% tax. Mexican batteries are not worth their cost. Cut out the fan cutout atop a MEGAWATT then place s correct WIRE fan guard using GOOP and this will drastically increase cooling airflow through the unit. Credit where credit is due to LANDYACHT for finding this. For the last year MEGAWATT switched to a higher airflow ball bearing cooling fan that quadruples fan life. Always use a reliable timer on the AC of a manual battery charger. Unlike a Failed lawyer you can THINK to resolve a problem. Yeah CALIFORNIA. The home of Ocasio Cortes who wants to ban RV's and air travel. "Take the midnight train to Tashkent and Tokyo?" Because I am a battery engineer I despise the double-digit IQ in Sacramento. Sue me. Either charge a battery right or spend $500 by destroying them regularly by boondocking with a SMART charger.
MEXICOWANDERER 05/24/19 10:45am Tech Issues
RE: Watts Help Needed.

Just fine. Smart chargers fill the battery to 80% which allows them to start sulfating right off the starting blocks. They end up ruined maybe 3 or 4 months after the warranty ends. Always wanted a SMART charger that turns a 100 amp hour battery into an 80 amp hour battery. You can thank the Socialist State of Californiagrad for outlawing the importation of ANY manual charger. Companies like Harbor Fright REFUSE to ship manual chargers to zip codes in Californiastan. A place where failed lawyers in Sacramento think for you. Even manual chargers with timers to shut off automatically are outright BANNED. Soon, don't laugh, they will be playing the part of doctors and electrical engineers and dieticians. Without a shred of proof they damned near got to the first stage of banning coffee (enforcing the law of putting a cancer warning label on packaging). Instead of insisting on a right out way of thirty feet clearance around power lines, when it's windy they are going to shut the grid down. The MEGAWATT or converters like what BFL 13 likes are the SOLE sources of battery chargers that do not murder batteries in California. Don Pianotuna, here are the SPECIFICS I have found in repairs to Harbor Freight chargers. Button diodes that release their bond to cheap aluminum heatsinks. They will then instantly overheat and burn up. Cheap 19 gauge POWER WIRES inside that attempt to pass 20 amps of current. BRASS fast-on terminals that overheat, then anneal, get soft as butter then the terminal burns up. Selector buttons that burn out, and their function means trying to switch six terminals at once. A DO NOT BUY even at a 90% discount recommendation from me. They are total 100% garbage. Down here in Mexico, wheeled Schumaker manual chargers are sold in COSTCO for $107 dollars + 8% tax. Mexican batteries are not worth their cost. Cut out the fan cutout atop a MEGAWATT then place s correct WIRE fan guard using GOOP and this will drastically increase cooling airflow through the unit. Credit where credit is due to LANDYACHT for finding this. For the last year MEGAWATT switched to a higher airflow ball bearing cooling fan that quadruples fan life. Always use a reliable timer on the AC of a manual battery charger. Unlike a Failed lawyer you can THINK to resolve a problem. Yeah CALIFORNIA. The home of Ocasio Cortes who wants to ban RV's and air travel. "Take the midnight train to Tashkent and Tokyo?" Because I am a battery engineer I despise the double-digit IQ in Sacramento. Sue me. Either charge a battery right or spend $500 by destroying them regularly by boondocking with a SMART charger.
MEXICOWANDERER 05/24/19 10:45am Tech Issues
RE: Watts Help Needed.

You still don't understand Automotive battery chargers are not designed to do a full charge They bring the battery to about 90% charge, They charge enough for you to start the vehicle the battery came out of and to be used intermittently as needed Power supplies are designed to supply the rated voltage and amps continually, for as long as needed Most battery chargers will never reach full saturation voltage that will insure the battery electrolyte was returned to correct specfic gravity density Aka all sulfur from the acid returns to the acid and not left on the battery plates to harden The mega watt with cables and clamps attached will exceed the performance of any car/vehicle battery charger NOW available The megawatt will out preform your chosen battery charger It does require the user to pay attention, it's not idiot proof Maybe on your case the battery charger is the safer option And you can upgrade to a megawatt when you have more experience
MrWizard 05/24/19 10:02am Tech Issues
RE: Watts Help Needed.

they are often used as chargers they are SOLD as power Supplies for 12v DC electronics there is small adjustable control (tiny screw driver needed-set it and leave it) to adjust voltage from 13v to 15v for correct charging, set at 14.4 to 14.7 and leave it, use a digital volt meter at the output, with nothing/no battery connected, adj for 14.4v shut off, then connect to battery with some alligator/battery clamps turn on , will reach correct volts at full charge, Megawatt on Amazon https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/712mWHUoe1L._SL1500_.jpg width=400 megawatt on ebay
MrWizard 05/23/19 10:23pm Tech Issues
RE: Watts Help Needed.

Hi, I would spend the extra 100 dollars for the 1800 watt unit. It is much more capable than the 1000 watt. Consider this manual charger instead of the automatic: https://www.harborfreight.com/10250-amp-12v-manual-charger-with-engine-start-60581.html Do use a coupon to reduce the price. The Megawatt may be a better choice. Have a look here: https://www.amazon.com/MegaWatt-S-350-12-9-5-15-Adjustable-Supply/dp/B00JZBE97U
pianotuna 05/23/19 10:18pm Tech Issues
RE: Watts Help Needed.

"SMART" portable battery chargers are just about useless. Save up a bit more then something that works -- a 400 watt Megawatt connected to a 4 hour wind-up timer like an INTERMATIC. Possibility of a SMART charger ruining your battery = 100% Possibility of a Megawatt ruining your battery = only if you are unbelievably careless (takes a lot of effort and stubbornness even at that) The timer saves the day. The INTERMATIC timer does not have a continuous on setting -- 4 hours is it. If you keep the generator running for a month or so and rewind the timer 400 times you probably will damage the battery. This is NOT an old-fashioned uncontrolled garage charger. It has a finite voltage limit where you fix it -- recommended 14.7 volts for wet cell batteries and 14.4 volts for AGM. I just did a quick look on Amazon and Google and did not find any of those chargers. Jim
jbfoster 05/23/19 09:30pm Tech Issues
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