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Open Roads Forum  >  RV Pet Stop

 > Sammi the pup has panosteitis

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chemisd

Lancaster, Ohio USA

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Posted: 05/13/06 06:41am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Good morning....Sammi, our 6 month old german shepherd, started limping about Sunday. We live in the country with lots of moles, so I just figured she stepped in a hole and it was tender. Limping continued and although I checked her pads, between the toes for thorns, felt her joints, etc. by Friday it seemed as though her back leg was lame also. She didn't seem to want to stand long, not running around the house as usual, etc. So called the vet and took her in at lunch. When I picked her up after work, they told me she has what is called panosteitis. You can read about panosteitis in this article. I don't think any of our other shepherds had ever had it. Although stress is listed as a possible factor, she didn't seem to think our recent training with the dog trainer had anything to do with it. She is taking rimadyl, 100 mg. which brings me to a question - is 100mg chewable rimadyl, the same as 100 mg. swallow kind? We have some leftover - but still not outdated, from Maicey. I realize the chewables would be easier to swallow, but at $45 for a month's supply, I'd like to be able to use the 8 or so that I have left also. And yes, I do know I need to watch her liver functions, so if need be, she will go back in for more bloodwork. Actually, she is getting spayed on the 23rd, so will probably see if they want to do more bloodword then. She also had bloodwork done yesterday to rule out - I think the vet said any endocrin issues. Thought I would let all of you with larger size dogs be aware of this. I had a friend who lost a Golden not long ago to bone cancer and he started out with a limp. I was pretty worried, but guess this will go away with no lasting effects.
Jana


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helixcontrol

Dracut, MA

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Posted: 05/13/06 07:19am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Best wishes for Sammi's speedy recovery.


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CatandJim

Tulsa, as in Oklahoma

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Posted: 05/13/06 08:28am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I am sorry to hear about Sammi.....I hope she bounces back and is as good as new soon! I don't want to be negative but the treatment you described seeing the trainer use on your dogs would raise a question or two in my mind.

The Rimadyl should work just fine, especially since it isn't outdated. Just be sure and mention to your vet that you are using up your left over medication.

Best wishes for a speedy recovery, give Sammi a big hug from her Oklahoma friends!


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Code2High

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Posted: 05/13/06 09:54am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

100 Mg should be the same in either form. And its all chewable if its slathered in butter or wrapped in cheese... or more like gulpable [emoticon]

Hope she's feeling better soon.


susan

Fuzzy Wuzzy was a wabbit, Fuzzy Wuzzy had a dandelion habit! RIP little Wuz... don't go far.


rockhillmanor

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Posted: 05/13/06 12:32pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

My only comment on this is when I had Danes this was sadly a 'very' common occurance.

Our research found that the old believe that fast growing large breed puppies needed HIGH protein in their food was waaaay wrong. Studies have since proved this.

Since the advent of NOT feeding large breed puppies high protein we rarely see this in the Danes anymore. Pretty much proof that the food is the culprit. And like the link you provided stated, we also stopped allowing our vets to use live distempter vacs.

Danes are no longer listed as the 'primary' breed that are affected by this.

We as a tight and well informed breed group changed the feeding/vac practices and have eliminated the common occurance of pano from our breed.

If it 'were' genetic we would still be the number one breed for pano.
Something to think about.[emoticon]

And not so surprisingly the same is for horses, foals fed high protein develope OCD. It took over 20 years for them to figure this out, AND to get the dog/horse food companies to STOP promoting high protein for the youngins.[emoticon]

This runs its course and IMHO, JMHO I would not use Rimdayl. The side effects of this drug (which may or may not help with the discomfort), are way to damaging and it does NOT CURE the problem, that in time goes away on its own.

I had 4 Danes that had Pano and all we did was keep them quiet till it ran its course. AND removed the high protein puppy feed.

What percent protein is the dog food you have your dog on? Did he just get his distemper shots?


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chemisd

Lancaster, Ohio USA

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Posted: 05/13/06 01:19pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

We are feeding both girls IAMS puppy food for large breeds, and I don't know the percentage. No to the shots. Training with a trainer is the only "new" thing introduced to the girls.
I "googled" pano this morning to read up before posting. Vet called later this a.m. and said bloodwork was fine. X-rays definitely had shown the pano. When I questioned her about the food issue, she said she really didn't know if there was any proof, and didn't suggest a different food. No way am I going to ask that one here! I can feel the flames already! [emoticon]

rockhillmanor

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Posted: 05/14/06 12:03pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

chemisd wrote:

Nikki1979 - We had a Maddey and she looked so much like yours! She died just about 18 months ago.
Food is so confusing to me. I feel like the vets should be able to tell us the best kind, but with all 3 I have dealt with, none have been really helpful.


They won't and they can't suggest food. Most vets carry Science Diet because of all the studies behind it. Hence forth they are not professionally able to discuss what food you should use,other than suggesting Science Diet. Keep in mind, at vet school they work on small breed dogs, simply due to space limitations.
So unless you own a Beagle all their research won't help you if you own a Burmese Swiss Mountain Dog. [emoticon]

We are now finding out Breed Specific and disease specific ailments that are attriibuted to diet. Food companies simply cannot research each and every breed nor each and every ailment related to food.[emoticon]

I am in contact with all breed owners each and every weekend. Problems that arrise in each breed is discussed within their clubs and members and the word is sent out. Every one has input what works, what didn't and what the suspect cause was. Then they act upon it.
Many times we get the Universities to do studies on it from donations from the clubs. Your vet will most likely NOT be able to keep up on EACH and EVERY breed health problems, food reactions, drug reaction, etc. I found that people who have owned one specific breed for over 30 years, ultimately know more than the local vet.

The best advice I can give anyone is that if you have a dog with a health problem contact their National Club for your breed and start networking the phone numbers. You WILL find they know of these problems and will be more than happy to assist you in getting your pet the correct medical or diet attention.

The National and Local clubs all have websites that always include links for breed specific health problems and food alerts.

You don't have to show, or even have your dog registered to access these wonderfully packed with info sites. The commonality is the breed of dog you have. Even if your dog is a mutt of 2 breeds. Take the time to research both breeds and their health problems they may encounter.

I am anal about getting all the info I can on anything related to my pets.....and it has helped me assit them in living healthy lives AND helps me to educate my vet about my specific breed in hopes he can then some day help another client and their dog.[emoticon]

Sorry for the long post, but nowadays you can not simply rely on your vet alone. The chemcical and medical industries are moving at warp speed, many times without regard to their affect. And the FDA works for them NOT us.
It is up to us as owners to research each medical treatment and insist on knowing just what is being put in our pets feed. Not to mention what we eat too. [emoticon]

CatandJim

Tulsa, as in Oklahoma

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Posted: 05/13/06 01:37pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Here is the nutrition information from the Iams website.....

*******************

Iams® Smart Puppy™ Large Breed


Recommended For
Large breed puppies that will reach 51 to 90 lbs., from weaning to 12 months; giant breed puppies that will reach more than 90 lbs., from weaning to 24 months. Not recommended for pregnant or nursing dogs.

Product Information
Nutritionally controlling the growth rate of large and giant breed puppies helps minimize the risk of common bone and joint problems. Adjusted calcium and phosphorus levels help support healthy skeletal development. Iams® Smart Puppy™ Large Breed has 16% less fat than Iams® Smart Puppy™ to help maintain a healthy growth rate. DHA (Docosahexaenoic Acid) a brain-building nutrient found in Iams® Smart Puppy™ Large Breed nourishes your puppy’s brain during the critical rapid-growth months. DHA is a key nutrient that’s found naturally in mother’s breast milk and is important for a baby’s neural development. And just like babies, a puppy’s ability to learn depends upon healthy brain development. This natural omega-3 fatty acid, DHA, is “brain food” for your puppy. Providing DHA supports the early development of neural tissues for optimal brain function. Iams® Smart Puppy™ Large Breed is made with nutrient-rich chicken, as well as fiber and carbohydrates specially balanced for your large or giant breed puppy.

Calories
Moderate: 4,057 kcal/kg, 369.85 kcal/cup

Ingredients
Chicken, Corn Meal, Ground Whole Grain Sorghum, Chicken By-Product Meal, Fish Meal (source of fish oil), Corn Grits, Natural Chicken Flavor, Chicken Fat (preserved with mixed Tocopherols, a source of vitamin E, and Citric Acid), Dried Beet Pulp (sugar removed), Dried Egg Product, Brewers Dried Yeast, Potassium Chloride, Salt, Vitamins (Vitamin E Supplement, Ascorbic Acid, Vitamin A Acetate, Calcium Pantothenate, Biotin, Thiamine Mononitrate (source of vitamin B1), Vitamin B12 Supplement, Niacin, Riboflavin Supplement, (source of vitamin B2), Inositol, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (source of vitamin B6), Vitamin D3 Supplement, Folic Acid), Calcium Carbonate, Choline Chloride, Minerals (Ferrous Sulfate, Zinc Oxide, Manganese Sulfate, Copper Sulfate, Manganous Oxide, Potassium Iodide, Cobalt Carbonate), DL-Methionine, Rosemary Extract

Caloric Distribution
Protein 26%...Fat 34%...Carbohydrate 40%

Guaranteed Analysis

Nutrient (percent)
Crude Protein not less than 26.0%
Crude Fat not less than 14.0%
Crude Fiber not more than 5.0%
Moisture not more than 10.0%
Docosahexaenoic Acid not less than 0.10%*
Omega-6 Fatty Acids not less than 2.80%*
Omega-3 Fatty Acids not less than 0.28%*

****************************

Just for your information. I was curious about the protein content. Oh and no flames coming from me since I used to feed our dogs Iams, that was until we adopted Pistol Pete and all that corn caused his allergies to go crazy!!

nikki1979

Greene, NY

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Posted: 05/13/06 08:50pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

rockhillmanor wrote:

Our research found that the old believe that fast growing large breed puppies needed HIGH protein in their food was waaaay wrong. Studies have since proved this.


I also tend to think that high protein food plays a role in developing Pano. I never fed Maddy puppy food due to this beleif and I never have had any problems with her development. She was put on a adult food with a protein % of 21. The slower the growth and development of the skeletal system the better it is for the animal. Growing too fast leads to all types of skeletal problems for large breed dogs including Pano and Hip Dysplasia. Many people think that puppy food is a great thing but many of the large breed dogs develop numerous problems from being on a puppy formula due to the protein content. Skeletal Problems


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chemisd

Lancaster, Ohio USA

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Posted: 05/14/06 05:55am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Nikki1979 - We had a Maddey and she looked so much like yours! She died just about 18 months ago.
Food is so confusing to me. I feel like the vets should be able to tell us the best kind, but with all 3 I have dealt with, none have been really helpful.

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