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Open Roads Forum  >  Tech Issues

 > Thingamabob disconnected on top of Cummins engine

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GlennLever

Rochester, New York USA

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Posted: 02/20/14 08:58am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

In the process of the regeneration of my 1997 American Dream it was found that this doodad on top of the engine was disconnected.

[image]

I suspect that when my meniscus ConWay was working on the engine it was disconnected / stepped on, while the work was being done on the exhaust manifold.

It looks to be a pressure sensor more than a shut of solenoid but could be either.

[image]

There was one wire laying there broken so a new end was put on it and connected to the doohickey.


It could be grounded through the unit but the second terminal certainly looks as if it had been protected from the elements making me believe that there was another wire connected to this gizmo.

[image]

Does anyone know what this is, what wires would be connected to it (pictures would be outstanding).

Other interesting stuff on this coach can be found here
http://www.rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/27344098.cfm


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GlennLever

Rochester, New York USA

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Posted: 02/20/14 09:02am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I got out to the shop today and the MH should be completed tomorrow. I did not get a chance to call anyone, but did find the data plate. It is directly under a line for the A/C compressor and has to be read upside down. I took some shots with a camera and they came out better than I thought. They were upside down but I rotated them with picture editing.

The plate says it is a 6CTA, Ref # 53-34874-004 engine # 45358278, model C8.3-325, read that as 325 HP.

Looks like I have more engine then I thought! I thought it was a 300 HP. It seems this engine was used in marine applications and fire trucks

I googled the engine and it comes up with many references to Marine Diesel References, any ideas??????

http://www.sbmar.com/cummins-6cta-tech-info.php

[image]

[image]

GlennLever

Rochester, New York USA

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Posted: 02/20/14 09:03am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I called Cummins Customer Service today.

Phone number 1-800-377-3000

They were unable to identify the doohickey on top of the engine (I did not use that terminological with them I am reserving that technical description for this forum as a joke).

I was given an e-mail address to send the photos along with text to request that information.

The e-mail address was powermaster@cummins.com

It is a general e-mail box and I was told it would be forwarded to the correct department, so it may be some time before I hear back.

Here is the text of the e-mail I sent.

Sirs,

I have a 1997 Fleetwood American Dream which has a Cummins engine in it

Ref # 53-34874-004
Engine # 45358278
Model C8.3-325
Cummins 6CTA

It was in a repair shop where the repairs were less that adequate.

In the second repair shop that repaired the damage done by the first shop a senor or solenoid was found to have at least one broken wire one it (the connector was still on the sensor, but the wire was laying beside it). This is an RV shop not an engine shop and they have been unable to determine what the sensor or solenoid is and whether it should have a second wire attached to it.

This is a diesel pusher so if this was in a normal location the sensor would be located on the top of the engine on the left rear as the driver sits in the vehicle.

I have attached three photos starting with a full shot and then with each additional shot gotten closer to the item in question.

My questions are, what is it, should there be two wires attached to it, the contacts were clean which would indicate to me that they were protected from the weather.

Your help would be greatly appreciated.

I have received this back from them

Thank you for contacting Cummins.

You will receive a personal response from one of our customer service specialists within two business days. If you have a more immediate need for assistance, please call Monday through Friday, 6 a.m. to 6 p.m. CST at 1-800-DIESELS (1-800-343-7357). If you are located outside of North America, you can reach us at 812-377-3000.

Please do not reply to this email as it was automatically generated in response to your communication.

I tried Syracuse, NY | Cummins Northeast, LLC and was asked to send them an e-mail with engine info and pictures. I did that and the e-mail was returned with

Reason: 550 5.1.1 unknown or illegal user: matthew.barklty@cummins.com

It is after hours now so I will call tomorrow and check the e-mail address.

GlennLever

Rochester, New York USA

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Posted: 02/20/14 09:06am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

So.....

I have an answer from cummins and an answer from Syracuse, NY | Cummins Northeast, LLC

They contradict each other.

Cummings says

"Good Afternoon Glenn,
The part that you are referring to in the pictures, looks to be a temperature sensor for coolant. I had go ask someone more more technical skills than I do. He also stated that the wiring question is kinda hard to figure out. I was advised that the sensor probably only has 1 wire, but there could be other leads that are connected to it, but that is usually done by the mechanic, not by the company. By having the leads on the sensor, it may have helped someone with the set up of the wiring so that they wouldn't have to splice somewhere else.
I hope this helps
Thank you for contacting Cummins.
Mark
Customer Care Representative
If we have misunderstood the information in your communication or you have additional questions please feel free to respond to our support staff by e-mailing powermaster@cummins.com or call Monday through Friday, 7 a.m. to 7 p.m. ET at 1-800-DIESELS (1-800-343-7357). If you are located outside of North America, you can reach us at 812-377-3000.
For authorized service center locations please visit:
Cummins.com
Cummins.com
Everytime.cummins.com"


Syracuse, NY | Cummins Northeast, LLC says

It is a solenoid in the air intake heater system. Judging from your photo's, it should have 2 wires connected.


Matt Barkley
Service Writer
Cummins Northeast LLC
6193 Eastern Ave.
Syracuse, NY 13211
Phone: (315)437-2751 ext 5103
Direct line: (315)410-7523
Fax: (315)437-8141

One says one wire the other says two, one says temp sensor the other says solenoid.

Syracuse also sent along a diagram (attached) which describes the part as a solenoid valve, but no wiring diagram is included.

[image]

[image]

* This post was edited 02/20/14 05:37pm by an administrator/moderator *

GlennLever

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Posted: 02/20/14 09:09am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Can anyone one help?

ScottG

Bothell Wa.

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Posted: 02/20/14 09:30am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I don't think it's a grid heater solenoid that controls current flow because it has air or fluid lines connected to it. Also there would be two of them (matching).
A wild guess would be either something to support the cooling fan or cruise.

* This post was edited 02/20/14 10:17am by ScottG *


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gkainz

Arvada, CO, USA

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Posted: 02/20/14 09:34am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

You might try posting this to dieselram.com forum under RV section ... there's a number of Cummins savvy folks there ... one guy works on firetrucks specifically, iirc.


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Handbasket

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Posted: 02/20/14 10:09am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Best start by saying that I've never owned a diesel, but I did work on them in the USN long ago. Here's my interpretation:

Parts # 6 are starting aids, which to me says they're 'choke' injectors. They're akin to the choke on an old carbed gas engine, used to give a richer mixture when starting. Part # 2 is a solenoid (operated) valve, probably energized on cold start and allowing fuel to flow to #6.

At a total guess, it's a generic solenoid valve, with several uses. The second terminal may be to allow for a ground wire when needed. Yours may not need a ground wire, since it may ground thru the mount or the metal line to the 'start aids'.

Check for continuity & resistance with a volt-ohm meter, measuring from the wired terminal to both the body of the solenoid & to unwired terminal. If I'm right, there'll be almost no resistance between the unwired terminal & the body, but there will be measurable resistance between the body & the wired terminal.

Good luck, both with it, and with following my gibberish... [emoticon]

Jim, "The old expert, often wrong but never in doubt."


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ScottG

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Posted: 02/20/14 10:15am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

It has two or three lines attached to its body, can you trace any of those to see where they're going?

It's interesting that in the exploded view diagram that solenoid (item #2) kinda shows one of the connector tabs being short or removed, suggesting it isn't used.

GlennLever

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Posted: 02/20/14 10:51am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Handbasket wrote:

Best start by saying that I've never owned a diesel, but I did work on them in the USN long ago. Here's my interpretation:

Parts # 6 are starting aids, which to me says they're 'choke' injectors. They're akin to the choke on an old carbed gas engine, used to give a richer mixture when starting. Part # 2 is a solenoid (operated) valve, probably energized on cold start and allowing fuel to flow to #6.

At a total guess, it's a generic solenoid valve, with several uses. The second terminal may be to allow for a ground wire when needed. Yours may not need a ground wire, since it may ground thru the mount or the metal line to the 'start aids'.

Check for continuity & resistance with a volt-ohm meter, measuring from the wired terminal to both the body of the solenoid & to unwired terminal. If I'm right, there'll be almost no resistance between the unwired terminal & the body, but there will be measurable resistance between the body & the wired terminal.

Good luck, both with it, and with following my gibberish... [emoticon]

Jim, "The old expert, often wrong but never in doubt."


Your suggestion to check to see if it is grounded through the boby is a good one, thanks, will do, will also check to see if the wire that is connected goes hot when cranked outside in the cold.

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