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 > Cleaning up rear rotted 'skirts' on camper...

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AnEv942

CA

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Posted: 06/08/14 04:25pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Literally

Drivers side 06/08/14
Passenger Side 07/23/14

[image]
Last thing yesterday, swept up our rear driver side skirt or rear wing.

After putting it off for way too long- forced to start the rebuild of skirt. Simply didnt want to address but last trip out, when I opened door the whole frame was moving, trying to come out of the wing (skirt). There are a few good skirt rebuild threads linked in the TCU. Ive studied them 'till my eyes are swimming & blue, seems a simple repair. Not sure why it seems such a task...I guess because camper still 'looked' ok. However aux battery is on shelf, plumbing valves etc. are in there- need to fix, before door falls off.

But I have some questions for some that have done this or thoughts. Ill outline with pics where Im at and plans. Same as most, a stapled 1x2 frame with luan glued to both sides/filon on outer side. Once I removed I realized the skirt really isnt as structural as I had thought to the box and shelfs. I have no clue why the wing overhangs the box other than appearance, boxed square would be a better design as far as structure/sealing. But Ill duplicate swept look just 'cause .

When I get around to the generator side skirt (not as bad I think) Ill use same original method to reconstruct. 1x2 frame sandwiched. But only because it has no doors. And its rather large.
The drivers side though is allmost all door. I am considering using a single piece of ~7/8" plywood. It would be a lot stronger, simpler to build and reattach. Edge sealing only critical concern? Though no more/less than the luan which I do have a sheet of 1/8". Opinions?
Most of the water intrusion source was the corner wall trim which Im addressing. Second was just the edge trim allowing to wick-but that mostly because what it was attached to rotted.

At any rate where Im at so far.
First clue problem was greater than appeared was pulling off the filon seam trim.
[image]

When slipping the putty knife under to cut adhesive tape the filon was squishing. Couple of staples completely rusted off. Oh boy...

Continuing decided to cut the edge trim.
[image]
Allow removing only whats needed to remove filon and subsequent cleaning and resealing. I did carry up a bit.

Removed jack.
[image]
This is where most of the water is coming from. Ive dealt with this on front jacks. The edge trim has a vinyl cosmetic screw cover trim. Water gets behind. On ours its tucked under jack mounts, water seeps.. On the front of camper especialy on nose bottom the 'trim' literally fills with water. I cut ends before termination under jacks so water could drain out. Underneath nose I also used a hole punch on vinyl added a few holes so water could get out before direct down wall. If its not being channeled to where it shouldn't be its sweating and rusting out screws...

[image]
At any rate, once trim removed you can see at lower edge is the nocthed edge of skirt 1x2, above that is the corner of aluminum frame.

[image]
Door removed, getting quite discouraged at this point what I going to find under filon, obvious rot..Margaret actually picked up some photo adds. In an attempt to save the filon skin I used a sonic (oscillating multi tool) cutter to cut the perimeter staples. The skin fell off.

[image]
wow...
Amazing how something can almost look good and function yet nothing there. Most of the wood visible isnt. Trying to remove just turned to dust.

[image]
Once all the rot removed looks pretty good. I expected to see rot traveling into camper. But its all sound and was contained to the 1x2s of the skirt. The very bottom right edge was starting to be attacked but mostly discolored.

The top of skirt frame was screwed from above and thru the aluminum wing frame. No way to get to without loosening a LOT of upper filon. I left the top most 1x2 and shaped lead section of ply block attached (hidden behind filon). As its still sound I can reattach new skirt frame to the existing wood behind upper filon and from the back side of inside of cabinet. Ill also add some blocking inside. Upper and lower filon panels re-stalled along seam to new wood.

If I were replacing the filon think I would have cut lower section up to aluminum frame.

Spent 2 hours cleaning old silicone from filon panel and years of re-caulking ..Because of the limited free area of drivers side skirt/filon panel, though Ill reglue I 'think' a non issue on this side.
The purposeless and exposed back side of wing Im unsure. Could glue plastic or vinyl to back side but thinking just cover exposed area with aluminum sheet. Ding ding, use 3/4 ply, laminate luan to back side running long on top to glue/staple to existing blocking. Allow tucking behind cabinet wall, stapling/tying front & upper block piece. Cool-knew there was a reason to documenting this. Then cover-Aways off yet.

Off to the hardware...

* This post was last edited 01/08/18 11:50am by AnEv942 *   View edit history


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mike mck

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Posted: 06/08/14 05:48pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I believe I will be doing the same task next year on my 96 caribou.
Continue with Pics please.

* This post was edited 06/23/14 04:55pm by mike mck *

AnEv942

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Posted: 06/08/14 08:20pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

It'll be a slow process. Mostly cause I really dont want to do it so draggin my feets. But I did pick up sheet of plywood. I had hoped to rough cut drivers side tonight so I could laminate the luan to one side and allow to set for awhile before cutting. But when I pulled out of truck and set on table its curled, warped and twisted. Laying flat its 3/16" in 24" in any direction.
Never seen a piece of 3/4" so bad. If I didnt know better Id say its been edge standing for a while. Oh well, try again tommorrow, and self pick & load.

96 probably wood frame I believe. Simular construction just different obstacles I would think. There are some good threads in the TCU.

faucet1

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Posted: 06/08/14 10:20pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Don't mean to high jack your post, but I had an old Cruise Air MH with wood framing. Had to replace part of back corners due to rot. Made repairs similar to yours which took a little time. But, it served me well until I sold it. Take heart, your work is looking good.

I also have a Cab-over(CO) constructed by my dad and me in 1967. I keep planning to start reconstruction/repair and currently have it stored indoors(after having it sit outside on the jacks for 25 years). Time really passes by. My question is....where are your holding tanks mounted? And about how many gallons do the tanks hold? When we built this CO, you could dump grey water on the ground, so we didn't put a holding tank on it. Toilet is self contained. Thanks David.

AnEv942

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Posted: 06/09/14 11:53am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

No hi jack- just documenting what been done a gazillion times. If our 'aluminum' frame camper was wood Im sure the corner where water was entering, some would be involved in the replacement. Looking at it you can almost trace the water path. going down the rear corner, almost no damage until it got past the al tube then water wicked sideways.
Advertised @16 gal black-24 grey. In last 2 pics you can see the ends of both tanks. They overlap each other at right angles. Lower part of wing is end of plastic box that contains the black tank-its ~10x14x6+' running width of camper behind bumper. The grey is behind white wall, running north/south in basement. Both tanks have protrusions that stick into compartment. Top half is grey tank setting on bump out of black. Odd arrangement. Among other discrepancies the black is much larger than 16 gal. I think I have the 24gal black that was offered on next size camper.

Edit: Correction- I was wrong-the tank across the back is the grey, black is the one on top and behind the wall. From the cabinet door looking in appears the 3" is going to tank in rear but its not. Also looks like the 1 1/2 is dumping in side tank but its not. Theres a notch in back of side tank that allows the 1 1/2" drain from shower to pass, then angles behind it to rear tank. Having cabinet open plus the rear access panel under wing, revealed my mis assumption having always looked at it thru door. Actually kinda nice discovery-as Ive always want to add a rinser to black tank-located where it is (now) would be easy to plumb. Doesnt explain the volume differance though.

* This post was edited 06/19/14 09:19pm by AnEv942 *

AnEv942

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Posted: 06/09/14 11:31pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Got a flat piece of plywood...wasnt going to spring for cost but was given option of a sheet of marine. Better anyway but mostly cause it was flat. Hardware stores entire a stack of 20-30 sheets of 3/4" acx- is twisted and bowed, apparently there rack is racked-every sheet is just about ruined.

Got it home measured out the "puzzle" piece.

[image]
As mentioned the forward curve block and top 1x2 is still attached to the aluminum frame which I left. Cut new ply to match.

[image]
Test fitting new 3/4" skirt. Wow. That it actually fit simply amazed me.

[image]
This is camera inside cabinet lookin out showing notched to fit against existing 1x2. When I laminate the luan it will run all the way to top & tie new ply to existing 1x2 (once I clean it up). After skirt installed more than likely will go back in and add some 1x1 corner blocking to tie inner box walls to skirt. Think I might tidy up this wiring since I have access.

[image]
And again camera looking out from under wing and skirt. Shows continued 1x2 and lead ply block. A wide crown stapler sure would be nice here, though on outside before I install filon.

[image]
Cut the luan pieces. Sandwiched and test fit everything again. Left the top lead curve long, be easier to cut after glued in place to insure it matches profile of existing block.

Tomorrow Ill glue the laun to plywood and the other piece to the filon and let set for a day or so. Once they're dry I'll sand out the edges, then seal all the wood. Still debating material, that and what Im using on back side, details. Hmm I have some extra epdm left over.. But I have at least a days worth of trim & camper wall to de-silicone and clean up.

* This post was last edited 01/03/18 06:47pm by AnEv942 *   View edit history

mooring product

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Posted: 06/10/14 06:21am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Nice work..


Pete
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Eric&Lisa

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Posted: 06/10/14 03:55pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Did that, done that. I am sure you saw my TCU thread on the subject. Nice work & good luck!!

-Eric


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AnEv942

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Posted: 06/10/14 10:09pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Well fog rolled in last night- I mean serious coastal fog that we havent had in several months, all but raining. 'member mentioning how dry the camper was?

[image]
Camper uncovered, water was running down the rear corner this morning. The raw edge of luan soaked enough water to swell and pull away from the al tube...had the big fan on it most of the day. Pumped both edges full of gorilla glue and clamped.
I had briefly thought about sealing the raw edges yesterday but decided it could wait until I had the new stuff ready...doh!
Got out some sealer and painted every piece of raw wood I could find, inside the cabinet, all the edges.

Anyway got the skirts laun/plywood and glued and stapled, glued the filon back luan. Sanded out the edges.
[image]

Then I completely sealed the filon backing and new skirt. Tomorrow Ill second coat skirt pieces, remove clampage on camper and seal the edges. I had some spar urethane but ended up just using some kilz premium exterior primer. Brighten inside of cabinet, pretty good in damp areas, dries faster and its a just cause thing. Plus glue will stick to it.

Did get the silicone off the camper and skirt filon. I had a bottle of silicone remover that doesn't really work. When I was doing the skirt filon I got out some paint thinner to remove putty. To my surprise the silicone when rubbed would ball up like rubber cement?Still took a bit of elbow grease but it actually made it a lot easier. Never heard of using thinner. Doesn't dissolve but it turns gooey-odd.

The skirt after second coating will just hang out some more tomorrow. Need to finish cleaning the trim pieces. I'm considering drilling some holes where edge trim wraps the bottom of skirt, to allow any water to get out. Also need to get some new trim plastic insert for the door-brittle and just cracked when removing. Too much fun...

* This post was edited 07/07/17 06:33pm by AnEv942 *

AnEv942

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Posted: 06/13/14 01:22pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Almost got it. Set the door today, reinstall rear jack brackets, then corner trim corner trim. The edge trim, though back on, is coming off and wont get reinstalled until I cover the exposed back side of skirt surface.
When I reinstall edge trim Im not using butyl or putty tape. One is previous tape only had about 30% contact, did nothing other than hold water. Being at bottom of wall, Ill seal the edges but intent is any water getting in will drain out. All it takes is an 1/8" failure of the caulk bead in several feet of trim and you've got water standing.
More pics..

[image]

To the sealed wing plywood I wrapped all the edges that might see water with aluminum tape. Glued some old vinyl to the back side, just in case or until I get sheathed. Also, other than coming to the conclusion that everything about the way the box & wing/skirt is built is WRONG, The previous vinyl acted as an isolation barrier and stopped the rot from migrating into camper. Drill and chamfered drain holes in trim.

Installing the skirt

[image]
Glued and stapled overlapping luan of new skirt to existing blocking. again this will get covered in some al. flashing.

[image]
Fuzzy pic of row of screws to left of door into 1x2 block inside box. Used 1/2" crown stapler at exterior side of forward block joint, probably not doing much but couldn't justify buying another stapler for this joint, though I may before I do the other skirt as it may be a frame instead of solid ply. I also used the 1/2" at upper filon to new skirt. Most of the pre-construction was using the 1/4" crown stapler of varying lengths and brad nailer, but from here on out was primarily the 1/2" where stapling the 1/8" luan and filon at face.

[image]
The rear of skirt is attached with screws thru back wall-thru al frame into edge of skirt. As I used plywood which isn't to edge strong I had added a 1x2 inside to also face screw/glue the skirt.

[image]
Had to stick my head inside when stapling the inside-my ears only rang for an hour.

Added 3 flat head bolts thru skirt and bumper wing that protrudes into box. One, there wasnt anything holding lower half of skirt. Two, bumper flex made keeping the edge sealed impossible.

But mostly, three, Im adding some lower brackets from jacks to bumper. I want to add them to lower part of bumper which would move the leverage point on jacks down 16". This will tie the 2 jacks together across the bottom, and lower the leverage point, greatly minimizing the sway when jacks fully extended.
Might induce more fore/aft movement between bumper & skirt, hopefully adding the bolts will spread loads. Tying all together Im seeing the bumper stabilizing the jacks, the jacks stabilizing the bumper. Thats the plan, but for now just secures lower half of skirt and joint to bumper. But back to task...

Working against glue setting, didn't get many pics of attaching the filon. Actually once I had started I had set camera inside cabinet.
I had a Doctor Suess bridgework of support from filon to jeep tire in addition to clamps & I wasnt sticking my hand in there.

[image]
Used predrilled holes for lower jack bracket and forward top curved section trying to align outer filon. Stapled along top and all around the door hole. Reattached the rear corner trim to hold edge. Used every clamp I had, blocking perimeter, large C's from door opening to mid of panels then started adding blocks between the filon & tire of jeep setting next to it. Pretty funny looking-didn't think this out before hand.

[image]
Next morning removed clamps and 'bridge work', didn't block but lightly put some clamps back on the lead edge until I get front edge trim back on.
Weired being able to place thumb against the filon and it doesn't move like a flat bicycle tire. My filon hole is about an inch larger than door hole. Previously was all to one side, door barely covered edge of filon. I centered the opening with hole in luan backing which gave me a nice stapling edge (and the door flange more likely to seal now).

[image]
Poor camper getting a bit shabby but this is looking better already.
Thinking about replacing the reflector with an led light and smaller reflector. At minimum will be a glue on reflector. Off to pick up some auto molding tape to reattach the seam piece, flashing for the back side and miles of caulking...

* This post was last edited 07/07/17 06:40pm by AnEv942 *   View edit history

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