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Open Roads Forum  >  Travel Trailers  >  General Q&A

 > Deep Cycle Battery???

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SoundGuy

S Ontario

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Joined: 02/11/2015

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Posted: 02/15/17 08:39am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

full_mosey wrote:

Does anyone know why temp comp is important enough to be printed on the label?


AGM batteries are "sealed" so there's no way to replace fluid should it be depleted by overcharging. If it is overcharged, as can easily be the case if temp compensated charging is not used, fluid will vaporize and vent out the one way vents that are provided to prevent the battery from bulging and completely self destructing ... problem is, because the battery is "sealed" there's no way to replace that fluid as there is with a conventional flooded battery and it will prematurely sulfate. Likewise, if the battery is undercharged it will also prematurely sulfate, shortening it's expected lifespan significantly. Temperature compensated charging is the solution, labeling the battery to this effect is to remind owners this is an issue not to be ignored. Each battery manufacturer has their own specific recommendations, such as this East Penn AGM Technical Manual, which would apply to that Duracell AGM being discussed as in reality it's an East Penn / Deka AGM.

pianotuna

Regina, SK, Canada

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Posted: 02/15/17 09:24am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Hi John,

No way to add liquid to an AGM so if you exceed the gassing voltage it may turn into a too heavy doorstop rather than a battery. Therefore temperature compensation is a good plan.


Regards, Don
My ride is a 28 foot Class C, 256 watts solar, 556 amp hours of AGM in two battery banks 12 volt batteries, 3000 watt Magnum hybrid inverter, Sola Basic Autoformer, Microair Easy Start.

SoundGuy

S Ontario

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Posted: 02/15/17 09:29am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

From the East Penn AGM Technical Manual ...

[image]

... considerable difference in appropriate charge voltages as temperature changes, even between 32F and 90F which many of us would typically camp in. [emoticon]

Is AGM temp compensated charging important? ... no doubt in my mind. [emoticon]

full_mosey

Oklahoma

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Posted: 02/15/17 10:03am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I read here very often that the WFCO charger dries out regular flooded batteries(FLA) which results in exposed plates and permanent damage or destruction.

Is there any situation where the WFCO's 13.6V could cause an AGM to vent and dry out?

HTH;
John

SoundGuy

S Ontario

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Posted: 02/15/17 10:58am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

full_mosey wrote:

I read here very often that the WFCO charger dries out regular flooded batteries(FLA) which results in exposed plates and permanent damage or destruction.

Is there any situation where the WFCO's 13.6V could cause an AGM to vent and dry out?


I don't see how a WFCO could dry out any battery as it rarely if ever bulk charges at it's claimed 14.4 volt bulk charge voltage ... the most I've ever seen from mine at the battery terminals is ~ 13.72 volts. Undercharging a depleted battery, AGM or flooded, however will lead to excessive sulfation and ultimately premature death. For those of us who normally camp on electric sites and therefore rarely deep discharge the battery this isn't much of an issue as the battery is as likely to die of old age. My own 9 yr old flooded G27 Interstate is a case in point, has always been maintained by WFCO converters but still holds a full charge just fine and rarely requires watering ... but it also rarely see deep discharge. That said, this past fall I turned my current WFCO off permanently and now use a CTEK portable charger that does do a proper 14.4 volt bulk charge and lo & behold the battery is now performing even better ... after surface charge wears off it holds ~ 12.82 volts unloaded for weeks while sitting on my workbench. [emoticon]

full_mosey

Oklahoma

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Posted: 02/15/17 04:02pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

It is settled then. An AGM battery like the DEKA 31 is a drop-in replacement and the worst the WFCO can do is UNDER-charge.

Get a portable regular automotive charger that can do 14.4V and use that to give the DEKA a decent top charge.

I would let the WFCO run as usual, but periodically use the portable.

HTH;
John

Huntindog

Phoenix AZ

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Posted: 11/29/19 05:36am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

SoundGuy wrote:

full_mosey wrote:

I read here very often that the WFCO charger dries out regular flooded batteries(FLA) which results in exposed plates and permanent damage or destruction.

Is there any situation where the WFCO's 13.6V could cause an AGM to vent and dry out?


I don't see how a WFCO could dry out any battery as it rarely if ever bulk charges at it's claimed 14.4 volt bulk charge voltage [emoticon]
This depends on where you live.
In Phoenix AZ, my WFCO will dry out golf cart 6 volt batteries as 13.6 V (where it seems to always be) is too much when the tempertures get over 110 pretty often.
In Ontario...probably not a problem.



Huntindog
100% boondocking
2010 Palomino Sabre 30 BHDS
84 gal. Grey. 84 gal. Black
2 bathrooms, no waiting
2011 Silverado CC DA big dually.



gmw photos

midwest

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Posted: 11/29/19 06:37am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I took possession of my 2012 funfinder on Nov 15, 2011. The trailer has a AGM "marine starting battery". It's been charged by the much maligned WFCO converter/charger. The battery is still in there, and still holds a charge.

My WFCO must be the "only" (LOL) good WFCO in existence, as I have seen it charge at over 14V, also it drops to 13.2 to 13.0 after about a day or day and half. 13.6 is it's mid-level. If the battery is not run down a whole lot, it simply starts out it's charge cycle at 13.6. Here I am, 8 years on, I'm happy with that.

As others have said, your discharge strategy needs to be smart. Do some reading on what parasitic draws you may have, and address those if needed.

EDIT: I put one of those little voltminder gadgets in the trailer to keep an eye on battery voltage. It plugs in to the 12 cig lighter power port.

Huntindog

Phoenix AZ

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Posted: 11/29/19 04:02pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

gmw photos wrote:

I took possession of my 2012 funfinder on Nov 15, 2011. The trailer has a AGM "marine starting battery". It's been charged by the much maligned WFCO converter/charger. The battery is still in there, and still holds a charge.

My WFCO must be the "only" (LOL) good WFCO in existence, as I have seen it charge at over 14V, also it drops to 13.2 to 13.0 after about a day or day and half. 13.6 is it's mid-level. If the battery is not run down a whole lot, it simply starts out it's charge cycle at 13.6. Here I am, 8 years on, I'm happy with that.

As others have said, your discharge strategy needs to be smart. Do some reading on what parasitic draws you may have, and address those if needed.

EDIT: I put one of those little voltminder gadgets in the trailer to keep an eye on battery voltage. It plugs in to the 12 cig lighter power port.
Mine is stuck at 13.6. I really don't care about the boost mode that much. But it will not go into float/13.2 ever. In AZ, it boils the water away in the summer. I no longer use it for that.

Vintage465

Prunedale CA.

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Posted: 12/05/19 07:17am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

And one more thing to add to your things to think about is:
1. When someone says "Solar" it can mean different things to different people. When someone says solar can't keep up, to me it means "their solar" can't keep up. There are so many different solar set ups and darned near all of them are junk when it comes to real charging. I am a big fan of solar and not a fan at all of generators(though I do carry one for emergencies). I can say pretty surely that all the factory installed set ups are really a waste of money if you really want to use your furnace at night in 10-30 degree temps then hope to harvest from the sun in the day time. There is a lot of great info out there on how to set up a great solar system that can harvest and charge even on pretty cloudy days(not dark rain cloudy days....)As stated in another post on this thread, there is not a one size fits all. It takes a fair amount of research and thought and if I were you and thinking of solar:
1. Build big, use hefty conductors, like #4 and #2
2. Get an MPPT type controller and install it as close to the battery bank as possible. Not in the cabinet over the bed like the RV manufacturers do.
3. Get panels that have the highest wattage(most important)and smallest foot print(not as important as highest wattage)
4. I wouldn't let a dealer install it unless they have a reputation as solar experts and have a proven track record.


V-465
2013 GMC 2500HD Denali. 2015 Creekside 20fq w/450 watts solar. Retiring in 2021, then look-out road, here we come!

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