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Open Roads Forum  >  Class A Motorhomes  >  Restoration & Vintage RVs

 > Anyone interested in 83 Pace Arrow Tear down and Rebuild?

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fulltimin

Home is where we Park It.

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Posted: 06/12/19 09:46pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Preacher Man wrote:

I have a question, how will you install whatever the outside skin will be with the windows already installed?

BTW, I've been watching this thread from the beginning, very impressive.




Thanks for following. Hopefully you are enjoying it.

I am looking at the windows, like windows in a house. The windows go in before the siding goes on, and they don't leak.

My plan is to secure the window frames to the siding. If I use fiberglass siding, I will add fiberglass to the frames and the siding, so they all become one. No caulking nor adhesive will be needed to seal them.

For those that think this is crazy, you don't cut a hole in the side of a house after the siding is on, and then just caulk around the outside of the window, do you? No.

We already know the general way rv windows are installed doesn't work long term. Yes, I know, I could use something like Eternabond. I also would not expect ChemLink to leak for a lot of years.

That being said, I want to do this differently, and we'll see what happens long term. If it doesn't work, I can always cut the window frame out, replace it, and caulk it in, just like the rest of the rv's on the market, but I don't think that will be necessary.

We'll see in about 10 to 20 years. [emoticon]


If you want to do something, you will find a way.
If you don't, you will find an excuse.

-------------------------------------------------

Good judgement comes from experience.
A lot of experience, comes from bad judgement.

fulltimin

Home is where we Park It.

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Joined: 12/14/2003

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Posted: 06/12/19 09:47pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

My first post has absolutely nothing to do with an rv.

We have a local gas station/convenience store that sells made to order food. Here is a picture of one of their signature items.



[image]



It is called the Route 30 Burger.

The 2 red arrows point to the top and the bottom of the sandwich. The top is a grilled cheese sandwich, with 2 pieces of bread. The bottom is also a grilled cheese sandwich, with 2 more pieces of bread.

The 3 yellow arrows, point to 3 burgers, ( 1, 2, or 3 are available). The green arrows point to extra add on's like bacon, ham, cheese, lettuce, tomatoes, onions, mushrooms, mayo, olives, and a whole host of other items available.

Starts at about $5.99 plus some of the add on's are additional, some are free. Quite the burger.

fulltimin

Home is where we Park It.

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Joined: 12/14/2003

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Posted: 06/12/19 09:48pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Now for tonight's update. I went shopping today. Since I have the inside of the rear wall up to date, I need some plywood for the inside of the walls.

As you remember, I found what I was looking for at the Home Depot, but not at our local store.

So, I had to head for another store that was about an hour away - one way. Between the trip there and back, along with looking through most of the stack of plywood to find ones that I liked, I spent nearly all afternoon for said trip.

Here's what I bought! 18 sheets of 1/8 inch thick plywood. YeeHaw!



[image]



Funny thing happened while at the Home Depot. While I was looking through the stack, I noticed that there were 6 that were damaged at the one corner. Not badly, but enough that if I was using the full sheet, it would be a problem.

I knew I could use them, because that area would have to be cut off anyway. I asked the guy if there would be a discount if I took those 6 pieces, and he said, yes, 50% off.

I asked him if I could borrow a hammer. (I figured, maybe I could get them all at 50% off). This guy had no sense of humor. He just looked at me with a blank look on his face and said nothing. I told him I was just joking, but he still wasn't impressed.

Go figure. Lol.

fulltimin

Home is where we Park It.

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Posted: 06/12/19 09:49pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Final update tonight, which is the spreadsheet. Plywood was $10.98 a sheet for 12 sheets, and 6 sheets at $5.49. Total with tax amounted to $174.59.

Adding that to the last total of $6773.20, and our new total is $6947.79.

I plan on starting to install plywood inside tomorrow, hopefully. Yay!

Bruce Brown

Northern NY

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Posted: 06/13/19 04:42am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

fulltimin wrote:

Preacher Man wrote:

I have a question, how will you install whatever the outside skin will be with the windows already installed?

BTW, I've been watching this thread from the beginning, very impressive.




Thanks for following. Hopefully you are enjoying it.

I am looking at the windows, like windows in a house. The windows go in before the siding goes on, and they don't leak.

My plan is to secure the window frames to the siding. If I use fiberglass siding, I will add fiberglass to the frames and the siding, so they all become one. No caulking nor adhesive will be needed to seal them.

For those that think this is crazy, you don't cut a hole in the side of a house after the siding is on, and then just caulk around the outside of the window, do you? No.

We already know the general way rv windows are installed doesn't work long term. Yes, I know, I could use something like Eternabond. I also would not expect ChemLink to leak for a lot of years.

That being said, I want to do this differently, and we'll see what happens long term. If it doesn't work, I can always cut the window frame out, replace it, and caulk it in, just like the rest of the rv's on the market, but I don't think that will be necessary.

We'll see in about 10 to 20 years. [emoticon]


Good luck with that window idea.

A few reasons to consider;

House windows are designed to be installed before the siding goes on. MH windows are not.

Trying to make the window one with the wall will work awesome, until you hit the first big bump in the road and the chassis flexes. Those windows need room to "float".

Properly installed, most MH windows *don't* leak for many, many years, if ever. Most that leak have plugged drains. Thats a maintenance issue, not an installation issue.

If there is a seal issue with a normally installed window, removal and reinstallation is a quick, simple, easy job. With a window thats part of the wall...well, good luck!

I know this is your baby but I'd reconsider that plan if it were me. But as they say, "not my circus, not my monkeys".


There are 24 hours in every day - it all depends on how you choose to use them.
Bruce & Jill Brown
2008 Kountry Star Pusher 3910


fulltimin

Home is where we Park It.

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Posted: 06/13/19 09:05pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Bruce Brown wrote:


Good luck with that window idea.

A few reasons to consider;

House windows are designed to be installed before the siding goes on. MH windows are not.

Trying to make the window one with the wall will work awesome, until you hit the first big bump in the road and the chassis flexes. Those windows need room to "float".

Properly installed, most MH windows *don't* leak for many, many years, if ever. Most that leak have plugged drains. Thats a maintenance issue, not an installation issue.

If there is a seal issue with a normally installed window, removal and reinstallation is a quick, simple, easy job. With a window thats part of the wall...well, good luck!

I know this is your baby but I'd reconsider that plan if it were me. But as they say, "not my circus, not my monkeys".



Thanks for the info.

The rear window is already a done deal. That will be fiberglassed into place and become part of the rear wall, and there is no room for "floating". The frame is stationary, and will remain that way. If It leaks, I'll cut it out, and redo the window. I really don't expect any problems with that and I'll explain why.

Then again, I could be completely wrong and it will leak like a sieve. Time will tell.

After watching countless videos of rv's being manufactured, I would agree that they are designed to be just stuck into the sidewall with caulk/adhesive to stop the leakage.

I don't think that is used because it is a good design. I think that is designed that way, because it is easy, quick, and cheap to install. What that means is, the manufacturer can just cut a hole in the wall, slap some caulk around it, install a few screws inside to help hold the window into place, and they are done with it.

However, after pulling this apart, those windows "float" like you said. The caulk is what is really supporting the window, and over time the vibration of going down the road, loosens the caulk and it leaks. I do think that the ChemLink would do an admirable job for a long period of time, and as it cures, stays flexible, but still seals.

Personally, I don't think wall flexing enters into it. I think it is vibration, rather than flex. If flex did it, the wall would crack due to the flexing. I am talking about a fiberglass wall, not one make of wood with thin aluminum stapled to the wood wall studs.

I will revisit my plans on the side windows before final installation of the siding, and who knows, maybe I'll change my mind.

Thanks.

fulltimin

Home is where we Park It.

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Joined: 12/14/2003

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Posted: 06/13/19 09:16pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Hey, hey, hey! What did you do today?

Prepared to install some plywood on the walls.

First step was to cut some 3" strips of plywood and add a small strip of ChemLink on the one side, like this.



[image]

fulltimin

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Posted: 06/13/19 09:21pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Why would I do that? Because I could. Lol.

Anyway, I fastened them to the backside of the plywood that I plan to install on the wall, like this.



[image]


You will notice that the extra plywood strips are aligned with the plywood that are on the walls now. (red arrows).

Why did I do that? My plan was to use 2 different types of adhesive to hold the plywood to the wall.

The uncovered areas on the back of the plywood are getting the 3M spray adhesive, which is a contact type glue.

I then pulled off the extra strips from the back of the plywood.

fulltimin

Home is where we Park It.

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Joined: 12/14/2003

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Posted: 06/13/19 09:26pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Next step was to apply some ChemLink to the plywood on the walls, but not the insulation.

Yes, I used black ChemLink here instead of white. Ran out of white, so I used the black that I had.

I wanted to use ChemLink on the plywood areas of the wall, but contact glue on the insulation parts.

Why? I figured the contact glue would hold the plywood in place while the ChemLink cured. No fuss, no muss, and I don't have to apply pressure to the plywood until it cures. It's a win-win, with the extra strength of the ChemLink. Yay!



[image]

fulltimin

Home is where we Park It.

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Joined: 12/14/2003

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Posted: 06/13/19 09:27pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Then we end up looking like this, with a single piece of plywood getting installed today. Not as much progress as I wanted, but at least I have one glued into place. Yippee!



[image]

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