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 > Switch to LIFePO4?

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pianotuna

Regina, SK, Canada

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Posted: 06/30/19 12:01pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Thanks Jon


Regards, Don
My ride is a 28 foot Class C, 256 watts solar, 556 amp hours of AGM in two battery banks 12 volt batteries, 3000 watt Magnum hybrid inverter, Sola Basic Autoformer, Microair Easy Start.

3 tons

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Posted: 06/30/19 03:49pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

BFL13 wrote:

No idea what the Trimetric should be programmed at for charging efficiency with Li. About that, where with Wets the efficiency goes off the rails above 80% SOC due to gassing, Li being kept under 80% (however measured) and being Li must make it very high.

OP has Victron instead of Trimetric. PT said Victron accounts for Peukert while Trimetric does not (Tri's manual has a note on why it doesn't bother with that)

So Li and Peukert? Any conflict with Victron's setting?


I spoke to Victron tech and was told their battery SOC meter IS compatible with Li via a simple setting on the app...Xantrex tech says LinkLite is compatible too with Li.

Itinerant1

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Posted: 06/30/19 06:44pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

It's one thing to be compatible it's another thing to be at a SoC % compared to cell balance/ resetting the capacity %.

Meaning if a manufacture requires the battery periodically be charged to say 14.2-14.6 (3.55 - 3.65 vpc) for balancing of cells and possibly resetting the capacity % meter.
So if you set your bulk to 13.8 -14.0v, then disconnect, then reconnect and do the same. While all that time discharging the batteries down to 20 or 30% DoD is your capacity % the same compared to your SoC %?

If you do not have a way to actually see your individual cell voltage is your battery actually balanced, are you playing in the knees banking that you bms is going to do its job or hoping the warranty will do its job?

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Posted: 06/30/19 07:31pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

The question that I asked concerning SOC and Li had to do with available amp/hrs (per programming), and a running tab of amps out versus amps in...

steveh27

Grosse Pointe Woods, MI

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Posted: 07/01/19 05:44am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I have some LiFePo4's on order. Here is what Trimetric told me:


We have a link below to the TM-2025's User Manual. In it you'll find, on pages 6 & 7, a description of all the 'P' parameters.

For Lithium LFP batteries, the changes needed are as follows:

P1 - 14.4 Volts.

P2 - 2% of P3 (battery bank capacity)

P3 - Battery Bank capacity in Amp-hrs

P7 - L3

P10 - 98%

P14 - 0.00 hrs

http://www.bogartengineering.com/wp-content/uploads/docs/TM-2025%20Users%20Instructions062017.pdf

I also talked to PD re my PD4635 charger/converter. They said I should keep the boost mode button on.

grizzzman

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Posted: 07/01/19 05:46am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

BFL13 charging efficiency for the Trimetric is 99% for Lifep04.
Bogart LFP charging spec.
I personally would not run the charging without having access to cell level monitoring. Good Luck with your project!

* This post was edited 07/01/19 06:56am by grizzzman *


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BFL13

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Posted: 07/01/19 07:44am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Interesting. I have the 2010 version of the Trimetric manual. I have not read the newer version(s) to see what's changed, but will later. I know Bogart has a newer version of the 2025 firmware than mine has, where they made some improvements.

It seems that if Li is usually operated under 80% if I got that right, and would have a very high charging efficiency, that the Trimetric's idea of "full" wouldn't be much use, so I was curious.

If you have a % SOC meter of some sort right on the Li bank, I suppose you don't even need the Trimetric, I don't know.

Guys with Li can figure it all out as another adjustment they have to make in how to do things!


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phemens

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Posted: 07/01/19 09:08am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

There is a SOC meter on the BMS panel on each battery.

For wiring the Samlex for grid input, I guess I can take it right from the 30A input receptacle since that is a shorter run than back to the distribution panel, correct?

The Samlex guide recommends 8 AWG for the AC wiring, but isn't 10 AWG sufficient for 30 amp. I have 10 gauge here, rather not buy 8 if I can avoid it. The run is about 10 feet.


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MrWizard

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Posted: 07/01/19 10:03am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

10ga is sufficient when used to power (1) appliance or outlet

but to act as a 'service' for the RV, I would prefer 8ga


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Itinerant1

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Posted: 07/01/19 10:12am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

BFL13 wrote:

Interesting.

It seems that if Li is usually operated under 80% if I got that right, and would have a very high charging efficiency, that the Trimetric's idea of "full" wouldn't be much use, so I was curious.

If you have a % SOC meter of some sort right on the Li bank, I suppose you don't even need the Trimetric, I don't know.

Guys with Li can figure it all out as another adjustment they have to make in how to do things!


BLF13 there really is not a lot to figure out, the bms protects the cells (this is the last line of protection). The fail safe if you wish.
Better to have programmable settings in the charger source but if using one that is "set up" generically for lfp, that's your first line of defense.

Lfp have a high efficiency rate in all levels of the SoC % right up to 99% SoC.

I'll use mine as the example again for fimilarity and long term hands on experience.
1,280w solar & 500ah lfp, all Magnum charge sources. I'll max out at 80a (.16c) when the sun is perfect, the norm is 60-75a (.12c -.15c) continous charging and it will keep feeding the batteries to 99% when it hits 14.2v, does it 10 minutes in absorb at 14.2v then backs off to 13.6v float for the afternoon at which time the solar is feeding all my 120ac items (tv, fridge, dvd, phone chargers, laptops). So that what's being produced in solar or consumed in the rig (my display will show 40-60a draw). When the sun goes down the lfp takes over the heavy lifting.

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