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johndeerefarmer

Texas

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Posted: 12/11/20 10:33am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

rhagfo wrote:

Lynnmor wrote:

DEF is DEF, buy whatever has the lowest price. I do have concerns with dirty nozzles at truck stops, but many use it with no problems. Walmart most likely has the best price on their own brand.

agesilaus wrote:

As noted DEF is DEF is DEF. It is all the same, save yourself some money and buy the $7 stuff from Walmart.

So you are both certified chemist that have tested all brands of DEF on all counts including purity.

The effects of less pure DEF likely will not appear right away, the same as using cheap engine oil will only build sludge which leads to issues down the road.
As often as I need to add DEF I will use a brand name.


All DEF is the same percentage of water and urea and you don't have to be a chemist to know that. Walmart DEF is also API certified.
If you want to buy Peak and waste money then go for it.


2020 Ford 350 6.7 PSD & 2017 F150 3.5 EB max tow
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StirCrazy

Kamloops, BC, Canada

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Posted: 12/12/20 05:33am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

NRALIFR wrote:

rhagfo wrote:

Lynnmor wrote:

DEF is DEF, buy whatever has the lowest price. I do have concerns with dirty nozzles at truck stops, but many use it with no problems. Walmart most likely has the best price on their own brand.

agesilaus wrote:

As noted DEF is DEF is DEF. It is all the same, save yourself some money and buy the $7 stuff from Walmart.

So you are both certified chemist that have tested all brands of DEF on all counts including purity.

The effects of less pure DEF likely will not appear right away, the same as using cheap engine oil will only build sludge which leads to issues down the road.
As often as I need to add DEF I will use a brand name.


I’m not a chemist, but I have a DEF refractometer and use it to check the DEF that I buy in jugs, and keep at home. Cheap DEF, expensive DEF, new DEF, old DEF, BlueDEF or Supertech DEF, if the refractometer says the urea is 32.5%, it will do it’s job in your exhaust system. DEF doesn’t get used in, burned by, consumed by, or run through the engine, so you don’t have to worry about any sludge buildup there.

Because DEF is a legally required pollution control fluid used in literally millions and millions of Diesel engines, the urea used to produce DEF is already extremely pure, pharmaceutical grade. The only other substance in DEF is deionized water.

Diesel Exhaust Fluid doesn’t degrade nearly as quickly as people assume. For example, at 86°F, DEF has a shelf life of a year. BUT REMEMBER: Don’t equate shelf life to spoiling like food, as DEF will not “go bad”. It will lose some effectiveness, and the SCR will dose at a higher rate, but it won’t “go bad.” If maintained at a constant temperature, DEF manages to stay for several months. For example, at 74°F Diesel Exhaust Fluid has the shelf life of 44 months.

My garage supply cabinets get zero sunlight, and rarely if ever exceed 85 degrees. I don’t stockpile it, but I’ve usually got a 2.5 gallon box or jug of it my garage. I make note of the date code on it when I buy it. It’s always used up in less than a year.

When my truck says the DEF tank is less than 1/2 full, I pour in 2.5 gallons when I get home, and buy a new jug the next time I’m able. If we’re on a long trip and it gets under 1/2 full, the next time I need to stop at a Walmart I buy a jug or box and dump it in. I have never used the bulk pumps because there’s never a convenient one when I need it. I’m not driving miles out of my way to buy such a low usage item in order to save what? About a dollar a gallon?

Finally, ONLY product that adheres to the ISO 22241 specification and is licensed with the API can be called Diesel Exhaust Fluid…all other products are simply Urea Solutions to various concentrations and cannot be called Diesel Exhaust Fluid.

[emoticon][emoticon]


first real good answer here, I can add a couple thing. DEF freezes at -10C or 14F which is why you have heaters in your def tank. so from personal experiance if you live in an area that sees freezing temps a lot never fill up from a truck stop in the winter, or fill untill it comes out of the filler. I know for my truck they say add one jug when it says 1/2 full this allows expansion room in the tank.
I made this mistake once and the result was a cracked housing allowing the def to leak into the heater coil area, the fix was a brand new heater assembly and 3 hours of my time. ford up here wanted 1600 bucks to do the job. also as stated a few times, buy the cheepest one, they are all mandated to be a spicifc purity and such and they are a POST treatment so the worst that I can see happening is they dont work quite as good if your doing a smog test but should still be good enough to do the job.

Steve


2014 F350 6.7 Platinum
2016 Cougar 330RBK

justme

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Posted: 12/16/20 12:17pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

The important thing is that whatever DEF is used, that it's properly certified. That certification assures pharmacy grade urea and the water is properly distilled as well as the proper mixture ratio. Walmart and Blue DEF and many others are properly certified. It makes a lot of sense to buy the least expensive and assure the date codes are recent. Also, when buying that product make certain the seal is in place. There have been reports that some scum bags have purchased DEF and emptied the container and refilling it with tap water and returning the jug for credit.

minnow

Upstate South Carolina

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Posted: 12/19/20 05:41pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

2oldman wrote:

Blue is fine for pulling a 5th wheel.


??? And what pray tell do we use when not towing?

DEF is DEF. The only difference is what you pay for it.

hotpepperkid

Kingman AZ

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Posted: 12/21/20 10:11am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

rhagfo wrote:

Lynnmor wrote:

DEF is DEF, buy whatever has the lowest price. I do have concerns with dirty nozzles at truck stops, but many use it with no problems. Walmart most likely has the best price on their own brand.

agesilaus wrote:

As noted DEF is DEF is DEF. It is all the same, save yourself some money and buy the $7 stuff from Walmart.

So you are both certified chemist that have tested all brands of DEF on all counts including purity.

The effects of less pure DEF likely will not appear right away, the same as using cheap engine oil will only build sludge which leads to issues down the road.
As often as I need to add DEF I will use a brand name.


Today, cars and trucks and other applications using diesel engines sold in the United States must meet stringent U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) emissions requirements. To meet these requirements, many diesel engine manufacturers use Selective Catalytic Reduction (SCR), an emissions aftertreatment technology that converts nitrogen oxides (NOx) in the diesel-engine exhaust stream into nitrogen and water vapor, two natural components in the air we breathe.

Diesel exhaust fluid (also referred to as DEF or AUS 32) is injected into the diesel exhaust stream and the heat from the exhaust, the fluid, and a catalyst convert the NOx into the harmless gases.

Diesel exhaust fluid is a 32.5% solution of technically pure urea in purified water. For the SCR unit to operate properly, the DEF must meet an exacting purity standard. This standard, published by the International Organization for Standardization (ISO), is intended to ensure that the diesel exhaust fluid used in SCR-equipped cars and trucks provides the purity required by diesel engine manufacturers and the quality to preserve the emissions control system and the environment.

The API Diesel Exhaust Fluid (DEF) Certification Program is a voluntary program designed to certify and monitor the quality characteristics of diesel exhaust fluid intended for use in motor vehicles with diesel engines. Diesel exhaust fluid marketers that have demonstrated that their products satisfy the requirements of the most recent and applicable edition of ISO 22241, Diesel engines – NOx reduction agent AUS 32, may be licensed to display the API Diesel Exhaust Fluid Certification Mark.

API Diesel Exhaust Fluid Certification has many benefits:

Identifies for consumers diesel exhaust fluids that meet diesel engine manufacturer requirements.
Helps consumers find those fluids.
Gives consumers a choice of quality brands from which to choose.
Helps reduce Nitrogen Oxide emissions.
Provides rigorous monitoring of fluids in the marketplace.
Tests licensed fluids to ensure that they meet program requirements.
A complete list of licensees is available on our Licensee Directory.

Please download the Diesel Exhaust Fluid Program Overview for additional information and program requirements.

Please direct any questions or comments regarding licensing to apidef@api.org


2019 Ford F-350 long bed SRW 4X4 6.4 PSD Grand Designs Reflection 295RL 5th wheel

justme

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Posted: 12/22/20 10:53am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Just because something costs more money does not mean it is better. Pricing strategy is very complex and rarely has anything to do with manufacturing costs by themselves. It is all about a marketing strategy to maximize profits. That is why there are so many government regulations, testing labs, and competition. Blue Def, Walmart, and many other reputable brands meet the proper certifications and testing. So it is foolish to pay a higher price for that product. This is a guide that some companies use for pricing. Companies are in business to make a profit and do what they have to do to do that. https://quickbooks.intuit.com/r/pricing-strategy/6-different-pricing-strategies-which-is-right-for-your-business/

sayoung

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Posted: 12/22/20 08:20pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

LOL, 3 pages discussing chicken whiz. For the experts, do you get better def from a Rhode Island Red , a Plymouth Rock , or a Leghorn ?

NRALIFR

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Posted: 12/22/20 10:40pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

sayoung wrote:

LOL, 3 pages discussing chicken whiz. For the experts, do you get better def from a Rhode Island Red , a Plymouth Rock , or a Leghorn ?


Uh, that would have to be a milking chicken, right???

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Michelle.S

Western NY till fall, then Sebring, FL

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Posted: 12/23/20 07:02am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I think some people just feel better paying more for something, so I say good for them.


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ol Bombero-JC

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Posted: 12/25/20 07:58pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

2oldman wrote:

Blue is fine for pulling a 5th wheel.


As well as for *not* pulling anything.

As to which one *might* be better (excluding "use by" date), go to
any of the various (by brand) diesel forums and check opinions.
(Get the "scoop" from owners of *your* brand - and decide if you like what they say).)

Besides self, you may find someone with a Chem major who cares -or-
one of the forums may have done an extensive study - as one of 'em did for diesel fuel additives "long ago"!...[emoticon]

~

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