RV.Net Open Roads Forum: Tech Issues: solar

RV Blog

  |  

RV Sales

  |  

Campgrounds

  |  

RV Parks

  |  

RV Club

  |  

RV Buyers Guide

  |  

Roadside Assistance

  |  

Extended Service Plan

  |  

RV Travel Assistance

  |  

RV Credit Card

  |  

RV Loans

Open Roads Forum Already a member? Login here.   If not, Register Today!  |  Help

Newest  |  Active  |  Popular  |  RVing FAQ Forum Rules  |  Forum Posting Help and Support  |  Contact  

Search:   Advanced Search

Search only in Tech Issues

Open Roads Forum  >  Tech Issues

 > solar

Reply to Topic  |  Subscribe  |  Print Topic  |  Post New Topic  | 
Page of 3  
Prev
Sponsored By:
Crabbypatty

Long Island, New York

Senior Member

Joined: 02/18/2004

View Profile



Posted: 01/20/21 04:45am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

We dry camp around 40 nights a year, have 648 watts of solar and 4 trojan t125s wet cells. That gives us 250 amps usable power, that is if you want your wt cells to last. they are designed for full draw down, but then you'll get around 3 years out of them. I sold my first TT after 10 years and they were still going strong. All you need is either a volt meter plugged into the 12 volt house system, or check them manually. I would love lithium but prices haven't come down enough for me. As stated a back up gen is a good idea. Since we solar-ed we no longer carry the 3000i, but rather the 2000i. We seem to use it maybe 2x a year as we also work while camping.

While im a solar fan, I am wondering what the cost would be for a propane rv fridge vs cost of solar & batt set up.Just a thought. We seem fine with up to 4 people for a week in terms of food storage typically without a cooler outside.

Good Luck and happy trails!


John, Lisa & Tara">">">
2015 F250 4x4 6.2L 6 spd 3.73s, CC Short Bed, Pullrite Slide 2700, 648 Wts Solar, 4 T-125s, 2000 Watt Xantrax Inverter, Trimetric 2030 Meter, LED Lights, Hawkings Smart Repeater, Wilson Extreme Cellular Repeater, Beer, Ribs, Smoker

StirCrazy

Kamloops, BC, Canada

Senior Member

Joined: 07/16/2003

View Profile



Posted: 01/20/21 05:50am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

BFL13 wrote:



I don't think you have done the calculations for that.

You keep seeing this claim about faster charging with LFP, but nobody explains how to do that. EG this "4 times the rate" claim that will reduce gen time.

To me that must mean restoring four times the AH in the same time that it would take with FLAs . Or same AH in 1/4 the time.

If you now have four 6s at 460AH and a 75 amp charger powered by a 2200w gen (like my set-up), that means you can do a "50-90" (184AH) in about 3 hours.

To do that in 1/4 the time- 45 minutes-that means charging at 245 amps. (184 x 60/45) So first you need a 245 amp charger or combination of chargers, and a generator to run that.

I doubt that is what was meant! So how about some realistic numbers with a realistic RV set-up for chargers and gen sizes and the LFP bank vs the four 6s, a 75 amper, and a 2200w gen?

EDIT--ok, say I had the same set-up only with LFP so no amps tapering. It all gets done at 75 amps. 184/75 is 2 hrs , 27 min. so I would save 33 minutes (from 3 hours) of gen time. Not quite the same as "four times faster" is it?

How about I do a 50-80 with my four 6s? Now it all gets done at 75 amps where amps start to taper at 80% SOC. 150AH in two hours. Swap to LFP and--oops--still 150AH in two hours.


you can charge at a 1C rate with LFP, so if you have a 486 ah battery bank and you are setting up your system to be compatable with a generator why wouldnt you get a larger charger? aside from they get ecpensive above a point but relisticly a 150 amp charger wouldnet be out of the question if you were setting up for Li in the first place, so 150 in one hour. or if you have money to spend you could set that bank up with a 300 watt charger and 150 in 30 min. that is the big advantage of LFP, you build to pound the amps in when you have them available. so hugly oversized solar, or chargers and so on. not saying most people do this so in 80% of the cases your example may be right, the LA may have some aceptance limitations but for the most part it will be close.

Steve


2014 F350 6.7 Platinum
2016 Cougar 330RBK

pianotuna

Regina, SK, Canada

Senior Member

Joined: 12/18/2004

View Profile


Offline
Posted: 01/20/21 07:22am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

time2roll wrote:

jshupe wrote:

pianotuna wrote:

Start with an energy audit. Decide how much reserve capacity you want. From that design the battery bank. Build a solar panel system that will recharge the battery bank.
This is the proper way to go about it.
I prefer to max out the solar and deal with the consequences.
Solar is so inexpensive today there is no reason to aim for the minimum.


Which is why I recommend the largest capacity charge controller that one can fit the budget. There are at least 2 100 amp controllers available.


Regards, Don
My ride is a 28 foot Class C, 256 watts solar, soon to have SiO2 batteries, 3000 watt Magnum hybrid inverter, Sola Basic Autoformer, Microair Easy Start.

BFL13

Victoria, BC

Senior Member

Joined: 02/15/2006

View Profile



Posted: 01/20/21 07:41am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

You can do more amps with a Power Factor corrected charger (if you can find one--there are a few) with the same VA sized gen, but you still have limits on gen size in an RV set-up. With the 5er we could carry the Honda 3000 in the truck. No room for it in the Class C (with no built-in gen) so 2200 gen is our limit.

Before buying a bunch of LFPs, just be sure you can carry what's needed to charge at 200 amps or whatever. How many know how to calculate what's needed? [emoticon]

Another thing I don't understand is where they advertise how great LFP is with solar for "fast charging". You have all day to do a recharge, so what's the hurry? With FLAs now you can be "full" by just after lunch. AND where are you going to carry the solar panels to produce the high amps to do it faster anyway? 800w of panels flat on the roof will do maybe 50 amps at noon and less the rest of the day. 50 amps is peanuts. That's why solar takes all day. Where is the LFP fast charging advantage?

It is really about carrying more usable AH in the same small space in a RV that is weight limited, but IMO the fast charging claim is not realistic.


1. 1991 Oakland 28DB Class C
on Ford E350-460-7.5 Gas EFI
Photo in Profile
2. 1991 Bighorn 9.5ft Truck Camper on 2003 Chev 2500HD 6.0 Gas
See Profile for Electronic set-ups for 1. and 2.

n0arp

FT

Senior Member

Joined: 08/20/2016

View Profile


Offline
Posted: 01/20/21 10:03am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

BFL13 wrote:

... It is really about carrying more usable AH in the same small space in a RV that is weight limited, but IMO the fast charging claim is not realistic.


The charging speed becomes much more important as you scale it up. It doesn't make a lot of difference if you have a small setup with four GC2s or two BattleBorns, but if you have several thousand watts, tens of thousands of Wh of storage, and a load that can draw the bank down significantly overnight, it becomes quite important.

For our 2925W array we can usually harvest around 18kWh of energy per day in AZ in summer. We have a 22.8kWh bank in that rig. In 100F temps, we'll consume right around 22kWh per day keeping the rig at 72F. That leaves us with a deficit of around 4kWh, that we want to cram into the bank as quickly as possible, in the middle of the day so we're not having to listen to it during the evening. It's not unusual to run the genset around lunch time and when the AC compressor kicks off, push 3800W from the generator and 2500W from the solar array to the bank at the same time. 525A of charging if it were a 12V system (it's 48V).

A bank of 16 225AH GC2s has a max charge rate (C/3) of 600A@12V, a recommended charging rate (C/10) of 180A@12V, and an absorb stage that substantially tapers the charge above 85-90%. They also need to be routinely charged to full to retain that ability. We'd either trash the batteries in short order, never make it to full, or more than likely, some combination of both. By contrast, the recommended charge rate (C/2) for our LFP bank is 900A@12V, so we easily make it to full each day and never have to worry about it.

We are far from the only people with setups like this.

* This post was last edited 01/20/21 10:59am by an administrator/moderator *   View edit history


2019 Ram 3500 HO/AISIN CCLB DRW Longhorn
2020 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited Rubicon 2.0T (follow or TC toad)
2015 Keystone Alpine 3730FB 2925W/22.8kWh, 30K multi-split
2016 Arctic Fox 1140 WB 1800W/11.4kWh

pianotuna

Regina, SK, Canada

Senior Member

Joined: 12/18/2004

View Profile


Offline
Posted: 01/20/21 10:42am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

jshupe,

Do you have a picture of the panels?

What controller are you using?

SiO2 can manage c/4 (25 amps per 100 amp-hours). They don't have to be fully recharged each cycle. Of course, that is no match for the charging rate on Li chemistries, but it is double that of regular flooded.

n0arp

FT

Senior Member

Joined: 08/20/2016

View Profile


Offline
Posted: 01/20/21 10:54am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

pianotuna wrote:

jshupe,

Do you have a picture of the panels?

What controller are you using?

SiO2 can manage c/4 (25 amps per 100 amp-hours). They don't have to be fully recharged each cycle. Of course, that is no match for the charging rate on Li chemistries, but it is double that of regular flooded.


Fifth wheel:

[image]

9x 325W panels, 3x strings of 3 in series, Victron SmartSolar MPPT 150/35 controllers

Depending on how much time we spend in the fifth wheel moving forward, we may pull up all the panels and build a raised rack that holds twelve. We've been spending more time in the truck camper lately.

Truck camper:

[image]
[image]

5x 360W panels, 1x string of 5 in series, Victron SmartSolar MPPT 250/60 controller.

Truck camper has a Coleman Mach 11 AC unit and we haven't been able to test it in the summer yet. There are no easy provisions for a mini-split in the rig, though I'm still scheming.

* This post was edited 01/20/21 11:02am by an administrator/moderator *

BFL13

Victoria, BC

Senior Member

Joined: 02/15/2006

View Profile



Posted: 01/20/21 11:21am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

pianotuna wrote:

jshupe,

Do you have a picture of the panels?

What controller are you using?

SiO2 can manage c/4 (25 amps per 100 amp-hours). They don't have to be fully recharged each cycle. Of course, that is no match for the charging rate on Li chemistries, but it is double that of regular flooded.


PT, you know regular RV FLAs can be recharged at 25% charging rate too, no harm. SiO2 "advantage" is only when amps taper with FLA and amps are still at Bulk Stage with the SiO2.

In my example you saw, a 50-80 would be at the same amps/same time, but if you go on to 90, the 80-90 part takes longer with the FLA due to tapering amps. So it is scenario dependent how much "faster" it would be with SiO2 and whether that amount of time saved has value wrt the price.

pianotuna

Regina, SK, Canada

Senior Member

Joined: 12/18/2004

View Profile


Offline
Posted: 01/20/21 03:13pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

BFL13,

Cold weather use and ability to be partial charged are my interests. I have not set eyes on my RV for 10 months now. Makes me quite sad.

Reply to Topic  |  Subscribe  |  Print Topic  |  Post New Topic  | 
Page of 3  
Prev

Open Roads Forum  >  Tech Issues

 > solar
Search:   Advanced Search

Search only in Tech Issues


New posts No new posts
Closed, new posts Closed, no new posts
Moved, new posts Moved, no new posts

Adjust text size:




© 2021 CWI, Inc. © 2021 Good Sam Enterprises, LLC. All Rights Reserved.