 |
|
|
|
JBarca
Radnor, Ohio, USA
Senior Member
Joined: 12/16/2004
View Profile
 Offline
|
Hi TECMike,
Thanks for the good words.
I too have a lot of eternabond up there. Every Dicor'ed anything that was a primary water seal was Ebonded over starting back in 2010.
Here is my roof after being washed 2 summers ago. This is a 16 year camper. I washed it 4 times a year when it lived outside all the time until 2013 when the new barn came. Now 2 times a year being stored inside. And I put 303 UV protectent on everything up there after washing it. The 303 for sure helped.
![[image]](https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51064616202_3efc21b782_o.jpg)
To your question about only coating the areas that are not eternabonded, when mine comes time to be coated, I was looking heavily into the high solids silicone treatment. The Henry's or the Crazy Seal. They will cost more then the other coatings, but this all comes down to how much longer does one want to keep the camper? Do you need a 50 year warranty?
In my case, it could be another 16 years or more. I may get a new one sometime or a different one, but I do not think I will ever get rid of this one. Like yours, everything in it is dry and in top maintained shape. I sealed every siding joint too. Trust me I spent $$$ maintaining it.
When I installed the Ebond, I put a light coat of non sag Dicor caulk on the exposed sealant edge of the E bond. This flowed over about 1/8" to 1/4" onto the Ebond. I did this to not have dirt stick the exposed E bond layer. I'm not sure what you did.
When I coat the roof, I will coat over that Dicor and stop there just past the Dicor. That is due to the coatings I am looking at. Since I 303 the Ebond, there is no notable degradation on the white layer of the Ebond. Since I still need to treat all the roof plastic up there, this would not be an extra step, just do it when I treat the rest of the plastic.
The folks with the Heng's, for me that is an unknown. I have no data to prove it is a problem other then the issues I have found on other brands of acrylic coatings. If the coating did lift off the Ebond, as long as it did not tear into the main roof coating, it may not be an issue. If it would make a clean break and stick solid at the end of the Ebond and not cross it, well you can see it and then figure out what to to.
You could also coat up to the Ebond from the start and not go onto it. If your Ebond has no signs of top layer degradation, that at least helps give you part of an answer. From what I know, if the top of Ebond is UV treated frequently, at least 2 times a year, more is better, the Ebond may last as long as the camper will.
Hope this helps.
John
* This post was
edited 03/22/21 09:49pm by JBarca *
John & Cindy
2005 Ford F350 Super Duty, 4x4; 6.8L V10 with 4.10
CC, SB, Lariat & FX4 package
21,000 GCWR, 11,000 GVWR
Ford Tow Command
1,700# Reese HP hitch & HP Dual Cam
2 1/2" Towbeast Receiver
2004 Sunline Solaris T310SR
(I wish we were camping!)
|
TECMike
Texas
Senior Member
Joined: 01/03/2010
View Profile
Offline
|
Thanks, John, for your insight regarding possibly coating Eternabond on my trailer. I deeply appreciate all the great help you have given to this forum's members throughout the years, John.
I had even considered and thought about spraying some paint primer on the Eternabond plastic to making coatings stick better and longer. The jury is still out for me as to what I am going to do. I am leaning, as mentioned, not even coating over the Eternabond. I feel it is a remarkable product is used correctly.
You have me beat on care of your roof, John. Yours looks great. Much better than mine. And I also should have used 303 Protectant on mine through the years. Your roof is a testimony to that product.
I also am a big fan on 303 protectant, and have used it regularly on my 2002 Ford F250 7.3 Powerstroke dash and interior for about eighteen years. I am proud to say my dash and interior still looks nice for an old truck with close to 250K miles, most of which has been pulling our camper.
We sometimes travel to the Rocky mountains in North New Mexico and Southern Colorado at 8500 feet, which does a real number that high with UV deterioration on vehicles and camper roofs unless there is protection on the dash and interior. Same goes for camper roofs.
Later during the first year of ownership of our twelve year old camper, I replaced about eighty percent of all the exterior screws with stainless screws. I also used a small piece of doublestick Eternabond on each screw prior to sinking it, thus making a seal around each screw head.
Yes, this took a very long time and stainless screws were not cheap.
Also removed each marker light and tail light and made gaskets of doublestick Eternabond and replaced screws with stainless screws. All of this to prevent leaks.
My wife and I are now in our seventies. Like you, we do not plan on ever selling our camper. When the end of our camping days arrives, we plan on selling our camper at a very low price or perhaps giving it to a deserving young couple just starting out who will take care of it.
When that day arrives, I expect the Eternabond and stainless screws will still be holding up fine. I would hope that whatever roof coating I decide to use will also be holding up well.
Mike
|
JBarca
Radnor, Ohio, USA
Senior Member
Joined: 12/16/2004
View Profile
Offline
|
TECMike wrote: And I also should have used 303 Protectant on mine through the years. Your roof is a testimony to that product.
Thanks Mike,
Yes, the 303 makes a big, big difference on the EPDM roof and caulk. Since I retired 5 years ago, I acquired a somewhat, extreme hobby. I restore water logged campers... Some guys do boats, cars, trucks, motorcycles, houses, well I do campers. ![[emoticon]](http://www.rv.net/sharedcontent/cfb/images/smile.gif "smile") I am on my 13th camper rot repair. Some for friends, and some I own. I have 5 campers now in my barn, our big one we camp in all the time in my sig, then 4 other that are projects campers in stages of drying out and restoration.
These campers are the same brand, Sunline, that I have in my sig. Three of them are 2004 campers and one a 2007. These have the classic, the owner never took care of the roof, or the siding seals. They never knew they had to. As such, they all had seeper type drip leaks in them, leaking for years.
The key point of this, they never did much to the roof. The original Dicor caulk is literally toast. All dried up, split, heavy dirt imbedded. The white shed layer of the EPDM is cracked like lighting bolts everywhere. These campers are the same age as mine. I never knew how much the 303 really does for the good of the caulk and the rubber, by cleaning the roof correctly and using the 303, until I saw it with my own eyes, on the same age roofing system, that is not washed, and not cared for on the caulk. The UV kills the caulk and the shed layer on the rubber.
Not to mention the heavy flexing of the camper from towing in the 4 corners of the roof system. That splits the caulk big time, even if the caulk is in good shape. I saw that on my big one in 2010 and I was being anal about the caulk. The roof was spotless on the caulk in November, come March after a snowy winter, there was a big split in the corner from being stored outside on a 6 year old camper. That is when I said, even I could not keep up this caulk mess, it is not going to cut it. Thus the Eternabond was born and is the best thing I ever did for the roof sealants.
Using only caulk as your primary seal against water intrusion on a camper roof, is a leak waiting to happen if you plan on keeping a camper much past 5 to 8 years. Especially if the camper lives outside all the time.
Eternabond, 303 and taking care of the roof is the winner.
Let us know what you come up with on your roof.
Thanks
John
|
Crabbypatty
Long Island, New York
Senior Member
Joined: 02/18/2004
View Profile
|
My Sunnybrook had a EDPM Rubber roof, so I assume you have the same. I sued the Dicor two part system, primer and top coat. Easy to do and it came out like new.
We now have a 37' fiver and the roof, in good shape was tan. I used the same Dicor for the EPDM roof but this time used Cool Beads Dicor and painted it White. Reduced inside temp by 15 degrees. Great product along with dicor sealant that I used when mounting 6 solar panels.
John, Lisa & Tara">">">
2015 F250 4x4 6.2L 6 spd 3.73s, CC Short Bed, Pullrite Slide 2700, 648 Wts Solar, 4 T-125s, 2000 Watt Xantrax Inverter, Trimetric 2030 Meter, LED Lights, Hawkings Smart Repeater, Wilson Extreme Cellular Repeater, Beer, Ribs, Smoker
|
qtla9111
Monterrey, Mexico
Senior Member
Joined: 09/17/2003
View Profile
Offline
|
JBarca wrote:TECMike wrote: And I also should have used 303 Protectant on mine through the years. Your roof is a testimony to that product.
I never knew how much the 303 really does for the good of the caulk and the rubber, by cleaning the roof correctly and using the 303, until I saw it with my own eyes, on the same age roofing system, that is not washed, and not cared for on the caulk.
John
John,
Could you share your process for cleaning the roof correctly?
Thanks
2005 Dodge Durango Hemi
2008 Funfinder 230DS
Living and Boondocking Mexico Blog
|
|
|
JBarca
Radnor, Ohio, USA
Senior Member
Joined: 12/16/2004
View Profile
Offline
|
qtla9111 wrote:JBarca wrote:TECMike wrote: And I also should have used 303 Protectant on mine through the years. Your roof is a testimony to that product.
I never knew how much the 303 really does for the good of the caulk and the rubber, by cleaning the roof correctly and using the 303, until I saw it with my own eyes, on the same age roofing system, that is not washed, and not cared for on the caulk.
John
John,
Could you share your process for cleaning the roof correctly?
Thanks
Hi,
Here is the process I use on Dicor EPDM Brite Ply roofing. In my case I do not have a walk on roof so I do this from the side of the camper. I would do it from the side even if I had a walk on roof. The roof is too slippery when wet. The key for cleaning is, you want to remove the dirt but not over scrub to take off the white shed layer. Mold is cleaned differently and is not dirt, one needs to learn what is mold and what is dirt. If the detergent did not touch it, odds are high, it's mold.
1. Rinse roof with hose sprayer to rinse off loose dirt and fully wet the work area.
2. Using laundry detergent (I use Tide) water mixture and a "soft" car wash brush on a pole, wash the roof like you do your high end sports car. All this is trying to do it get the dirt as that is all the detergent will take off.
3. I clean the inside of the gutter rail with a tooth brush. The dirt/dust buildup can be bad in there and the dirt slows down water draining from the gutter.
4. Rinse the work area well. Move ladder down to the next work area and repeat. Rinse side of camper as you move from the stuff that flows off as you go. Do not let it dry on.
5. I can only reach a little past half way across the camper, so I need to go down both sides to do the total roof. The work area is about 4 1/2 ft across the 8 ft wide roof, and about 6 feet down the length of the camper for each ladder setting.
If you live in an area, the midwest or northeast, where mold grows, (in Ohio it grows fast) I do a mold clean on the roof every so often. This removes the black specs that can look like dirt. This is separate from the detergent washing.
Mold kill process. This is not done after every wash, only when needed. For Ohio and camper living outside, this may be once a year, maybe twice for heavy mold growing times.
6. After the detergent cleaning is over, and the conditions of day are right, I start the mold kill process. You want to avoid the high sun, high temperature and a high wind part of the day. Everything evaporates too fast in those conditions. The ideal condition is a cloudy day with low, to no wind, temps below 78 F ish. Early morning or later after dinner in the summer can work.
7. Hose wet the work area you are working on.
8. Using a non scented standard bleach and water solution in a 5 gallon bucket. (I use 2 gal water to 1/2 to 3/4 cup of fresh bleach to do a 32 ft camper) Spread the mixture on the roof with the car wash brush and you want it on wet. Do "not" scrub, scrubbing will not help, just brush it on, good and wet. And let it sit and soak for 10 to, most times no more then 15 minutes. Rewet it with solution if it starts drying during this time. You do not want it to dry onto the roof intentionally. The bleach needs time to work.
9. Before leaving that work area to go to the next, rinse the sides of the camper well for any bleach solution that runs down the side of the camper.
10. Move to the next work area and repeat the above. Ideally you can get the whole camper at once before it starts drying. But if you can't, then just do the left and right side and half the camper at once or what ever length you can do. You just do not want to rinse off the treated area until it has had time to do the mold kill work.
11. After the mold kill time is up, rinse the area well and the sides of the camper again. If there are some areas still not killed, repeat those areas. The roof will come back white.
12. Treat roof with 303 after it has dried after every cleaning/mold kill.
Notes:
Do not over scrub, that is what can take off excess white shed layer on the EPDM.
If the camper lives outside, 3 to 4 cleanings a year helps keep the dirt in check and build up bonded to the roof. The dirt comes off a lot easier, especially with the 303 on the roof. If the camper is stored inside, then about 2 cleanings per year.
If you have not done a cleaning in a few years, you most likely need to do 2 detergent washes, sometimes 3. You may even need to use a different cleaner if 2 washes with Tide do not remove the bonded on dirt buildup. On my project camper that have not been cleaned in many years, (some 10 years), 2 to 3 detergent washes plus a different detergent is really needed before the mold kill is common to bring the roof back to life. I have pics of that if wanted.
I really did not invent this process, maybe embellished it. Below is what came in my owners manual from Dicor in 2003. They state full strength bleach is OK, but I would never do that due to the decals on the camper.
A few pics from the process.
![[image]](https://live.staticflickr.com/4642/24497127267_62405813bc_o.jpg)
![[image]](https://live.staticflickr.com/4739/25492326238_17033a26c1_o.jpg)
Directions that came in my manual.
![[image]](https://live.staticflickr.com/4590/25492326758_8005a20281_b.jpg)
![[image]](https://live.staticflickr.com/4644/24497128797_72e0817840_o.jpg)
This does take time. The bigger the camper, the longer the time.
Hope this helps
John
* This post was
edited 03/24/21 11:16am by JBarca *
|
qtla9111
Monterrey, Mexico
Senior Member
Joined: 09/17/2003
View Profile
Offline
|
Great write up John. Truly appreciated. I am wanting to use the Eternabond on the edges and other areas as you show in the picture.
On the roof accessories, is it necessary to use Dicor first and then later follow up with Eternabond or can I just put the Eternabond over the cleaned area?
Thanks again.
|
JBarca
Radnor, Ohio, USA
Senior Member
Joined: 12/16/2004
View Profile
Offline
|
qtla9111 wrote:Great write up John. Truly appreciated. I am wanting to use the Eternabond on the edges and other areas as you show in the picture.
On the roof accessories, is it necessary to use Dicor first and then later follow up with Eternabond or can I just put the Eternabond over the cleaned area?
Thanks again.
Your welcome and glad it helped.
A heads up on using Eternabond and Dicor under the eternabond (Ebond). Dicor gases off as it cures, and that gassing off period can be 2 to 3 weeks pending drying conditions. If you apply Ebond over uncured Dicor, the gassing off will create bubbles in the Ebond.
I wait 3 to 4 weeks for the gassing off and then Ebond. Longer is OK, just not shorter.
I'm note sure what context you are asking about Quote:On the roof accessories, is it necessary to use Dicor first and then later follow up with Eternabond
I do not know the condition of your existing Dicor, or how old it has been on. Pictures really help in these cases. If Dicor is heavily cracked and crumbled, in my mind it shot. In that case, I would use a heat gun and all edges dulled putty knife and clean off the bad Dicor down to clean Dicor or none left, put new Dicor on, let it gas off, then Ebond. This gives you double sealing.
Also about cleaning, Ebond or even more Dicor, will not properly adhere to dirt filled old Dicor or roofing. If you have sound, old and dirt imbedded caulk, or the roof, it has to be totally cleaned before applying new Dicor or Ebond. Most times, soap and water will not clean heavy dirted up Dicor. For EPDM roofing, you need to use mineral spirts on a rag, clean with it, wipe it off as soon as it is clean, then follow with a high evaporating off cleaner wiped on a rag to take the oily reside left over by the mineral spirits. Do not let the mineral sprits soak on the caulk on rubber. I use Naphtha as my high evaporating off cleaner. Etneraclean works and some use denatured alcohol as the high evaporative cleaner. Technically denatured alcohol is not rated as a cleaner, it is stove fuel, but they still use it.
If that does not answer your question, explain more what your mean.
Hope this helps.
John
|
qtla9111
Monterrey, Mexico
Senior Member
Joined: 09/17/2003
View Profile
Offline
|
Ok. I removed some Dicor last year from across the front seam. The new seal looks great and good thing I took off the old.
I don't have a lot on my roof but I will remove the old Dicor that is around the antenna and apply new.
Thanks again for the information. I'd go up on the roof and take some pics but its covered with ash from the forest fires we are having. If it clears up I will do it.
|
BarneyS
S.E. Lower Michigan
Moderator
Joined: 10/16/2000
View Profile
|
I used the ProGuard product quite a few years ago on my Sunnybrook trailer and again a few years back. At first I was quite happy with it but it has rapidly deteriorated and I am now in the process of scheduling a complete tear off and replacement of the roof covering.
You can see my post from 2012, with pictures, here.
I am afraid I can no longer recommend the use of this product.
Barney
2004 Sunnybrook Titan 30FKS TT
Hensley "Arrow" 1400# hitch (Sold)
Not towing now.
Former tow vehicles were 2016 Ram 2500 CTD, 2002 Ford F250, 7.3 PSD, 1997 Ram 2500 5.9 gas engine
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
