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Open Roads Forum  >  Towing

 > Thoughts on WD hitch need

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Grit dog

Black Diamond, WA

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Posted: 05/11/21 07:36pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

BarneyS wrote:

Mike134 wrote:

I have to chuckle at the weight police. I've been on the forum a few years and all you read is you need a bigger truck, blah, blah, blah. The OP has a 1-TON DUALLY ONLY towing a 10,000 trailer and suddenly it's not enough truck?
You guys crack me up.

Safe travels, hitch up and never look back at the forum.

Who said he needed a bigger truck? I noticed a lot of questions about the receiver on the truck but not the "blah, blah, blah" that you talk about.[emoticon]
Barney


Technically you're correct, but the blah blah blah has started in earnest.

So I been reading bout how trailers "need" all this stuff to tow correctly. And given I've towed, idk, maybe 100s of different trailers behind light and med duty trucks over the years, I never could figure out what most of the hype was about.
With that, I've only casually towed a couple travel trailers over the years until a couple weeks ago.
Got me a 34' long toyhauler, thought maybe I'd see the magic happen with a wdh and sway control. Prev owner had a wdh he sold with the trailer. Same story "Ohhh man, you gotta use that thing or she's all over the road."
I was almost excited to try it, but alas it was too short for my truck sitting on a 6" lift and 37s, so I had to go old school...
With nervous trepidation (LOL) I hooked 'er up "naked" to the back of the truck. Stuffed 40psi in the bags since the truck is leveled and has the nice cushy Ram coil springs. That brought her back up to level so I didn't look like a 5 star Joe going down the road, and off we went.
Ripped off 300miles in about 4 hours. Most of the time cruise set on 80, save for pulling a big grade and the top of the pass....and that 50 miles or so of nasty quartering headwinds that greet you every time coming up out of the Columbia river basin it seems. Windy stretch I backed er down to about 70mph mostly because I thought I might run out of fuel before my fuel stop. Didn't know the lie o meter could read 5mpg, but it does!

My bubble was blown. Didn't get to see the magic. Still wonder what it's all about...
No white knuckles, no spilt drinks, no getting tossed allover the road...Oh well, maybe next time it'll be worse!


2016 Ram 2500, MotorOps.ca EFIlive tuned, 5” turbo back, 6" lift on 37s
2017 Heartland Torque T29

deltabravo

Spokane, WA

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Posted: 05/11/21 10:07pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I have a dually as well. I towed my ORV 24RLS without WD hitch once. It was a pretty gnarly experience, so I installed the WD apparatus at camp and drove home using the WD hitch at the end of the trip. The ride and handling was much better.


2009 Silverado 3500HD Dually, D/A, CCLB 4x4 (bought new 8/30/09)
2009 Arctic Fox 811 (bought new 11/9/09)
2018 Timber Ridge 24RLS (bought pre-owned 3/12/20)
2008 Haulmark 8.5x20 toy box trailer

loydt

Cornelius, NC, USA

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Posted: 05/12/21 03:51am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I did go ahead and order a Curt brand WD hitch with sway that will handle the weights of the trailer. Mainly because 90% of the time I will have the golf cart loaded in the bed of the truck while pulling the trailer as well.


2021 Jayco Seismic 4212 (on order)
2021 Jayco White Hawk 32BH
2018 Ram 3500 DRW 4x4 CC Cummins/Aisin Laramie Longhorn

Tvov

CT

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Posted: 05/12/21 04:52am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

loydt wrote:

... So far I have only found one hitch system, made by Curt, that has a tongue weight rating of 1500 lbs.


?? A lot of hitches have two "tongue weights", one without weight distributing bars attached and one with the bars.

You should find plenty of hitches with tongue weight rating of 1500lbs or more with WD bars attached.

The Reese hitch I have is 1500lbs (or more, I forget) with the WD bars attached.

The receiver attached to your truck probably also has two weight ratings.


_________________________________________________________
2008 F-250 CrewCab 5.4L,
2004 21' Forest River Surveyor


mkirsch

Rochester, NY

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Posted: 05/12/21 07:02am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Something not mentioned yet is the load leveling system does NOT address the same issues as a WD hitch.

Load leveling only affects the ride height of the rear of the truck. It does nothing to help prevent sway events with the trailer, and it does nothing to return weight to the front wheels of the truck.

Hitch up your trailer and watch the front of your truck as you lower the tongue on to the ball. The nose of your truck will go UP. That's weight coming off your front wheels. Maybe it's enough to affect steering and braking, maybe not. 3500 duallys can usually stand to lose some weight off the front without affecting handling, especially if they are diesels.

What the WD hitch will MOSTLY do in this situation, is provide sway control. These WD hitches with integrated sway control are much more effective than the cheesy old friction bars, plus they are ready-to-use. You would need to have friction sway control attachment points welded on to a heavy hitch shank. By the time you are done paying the fabricator, and buying the parts, you're well into a modern WD hitch with integrated sway control.

Plus while you may not "need" to have weight transferred back to the front end of the truck, the truck will definitely handle better with a properly adjusted WD hitch in play.

It may not be necessary, but it is still a good idea nonetheless. I applaud your decision to order a WD hitch.


Putting 10-ply tires on half ton trucks since aught-four.

Mike134

Elgin, IL

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Posted: 05/12/21 08:53am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

loydt wrote:

Just bought a new Jayco White Hawk 32BH. It has a GVWR of 9995 Lbs and a dry hitch weight of 1,100 Lbs. My truck is a 2018 Ram CC 4x4 dually with the Cummins/Aisin combo and a factory class V hitch. Do I need to mess with a WD hitch for this massive truck?


I don't think folks read word questions very well here based on the responses.

You have a 1-ton dually that has a payload in the neighborhood of 5500lbs. Was factory equipped with a class V hitch. Those can have a 18,000- 20,000 rating. You have the extra heavy duty transmission for that diesel. I'd bet if you dropped 1800 lbs of tongue weight on that beast of a truck your front wheel well height might go up 1/4". If you properly load the trailer you won't need sway control because a "PROPERLY" loaded trailer won't sway.

Just my 2 cents based on the information you provided.


2019 F150 4X4 1903 payload
2018 Adventurer 21RBS 7700 GVWR.

loydt

Cornelius, NC, USA

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Posted: 05/12/21 09:24am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Mike134 wrote:

loydt wrote:

Just bought a new Jayco White Hawk 32BH. It has a GVWR of 9995 Lbs and a dry hitch weight of 1,100 Lbs. My truck is a 2018 Ram CC 4x4 dually with the Cummins/Aisin combo and a factory class V hitch. Do I need to mess with a WD hitch for this massive truck?


I don't think folks read word questions very well here based on the responses.

You have a 1-ton dually that has a payload in the neighborhood of 5500lbs. Was factory equipped with a class V hitch. Those can have a 18,000- 20,000 rating. You have the extra heavy duty transmission for that diesel. I'd bet if you dropped 1800 lbs of tongue weight on that beast of a truck your front wheel well height might go up 1/4". If you properly load the trailer you won't need sway control because a "PROPERLY" loaded trailer won't sway.

Just my 2 cents based on the information you provided.


I thought about that after I posted the question. Sometimes you get more than you ask for.

I have towed trailers all over the place, even across the county thru Yellowstone, Big Horns, you name it. Be it they were all heavy 5th wheels similar to the new massive Seismic unit I have ordered.

I asked the question due to this being a "bumper hitch style" only.

You are right on my trucks capacity. The manual states that any trailer over 20k pounds should utilize a 5th wheel or gooseneck hitch. Which means anything less than that can be towed by the class V hitch.

However I do believe that the WD hitch will more than likely improve the ride with the trailer back there. So thats worth the $600 or so over the long run.

BackOfThePack

Fort Worth

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Posted: 05/13/21 06:04pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

The question is not about the stationary (static) “weight” value of the trailer tongue. That’s a moment frozen in time. The dynamic of being in motion means the two vehicles are rotating on separate axes most of the time AND that the FORCE on the hitch ball is constantly changing. It may increase to several thousand pounds in one moment to pulling upward by a few hundred or more in the very next. Trailer leaning left and TV leaning right.

The game is at the contact patches of the rear tires.

A WDH distributed the VARYING TW loads across BOTH vehicles. Preserves solo steering & braking “feel”.

The prime risk isn’t weight when towing. It’s crosswinds. Sudden gusts where the driver doesn’t understand how to correct. Over in about 1.5-seconds.

A DRW isn’t any guarantee of safety. They suck, unless — like all other tow vehicles — they have sufficient load in the bed to SHOW tire loads are maximizing the tire contact patch. The more stiffly sprung is a TV, generally the worse it is unless being used to design. An SRW nearer GAWR beats it every time where the DRW is underloaded.

A DRW is what you might want for a GN/5er. It’s the wrong direction for a conventional hitch where the bed isn’t sufficiently loaded.

A WDH makes the combined vehicle react more as a single vehicle. Keeping the TT Under control means increasing the weight on its axles, and reducing front-end rise on the TV. “Weight” is the dumb new-guy thing. Steering & braking ARE improved by use of a WDH.


2004 555 CTD QC LB NV-5600
1990 35’ Silver Streak

BackOfThePack

Fort Worth

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Posted: 05/13/21 06:21pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Mike134 wrote:

loydt wrote:

Just bought a new Jayco White Hawk 32BH. It has a GVWR of 9995 Lbs and a dry hitch weight of 1,100 Lbs. My truck is a 2018 Ram CC 4x4 dually with the Cummins/Aisin combo and a factory class V hitch. Do I need to mess with a WD hitch for this massive truck?


I don't think folks read word questions very well here based on the responses.

You have a 1-ton dually that has a payload in the neighborhood of 5500lbs. Was factory equipped with a class on V hitch. Those can have a 18,000- 20,000 rating. You have the extra heavy duty transmission for that diesel. I'd bet if you dropped 1800 lbs of tongue weight on that beast of a truck your front wheel well height might go up 1/4". If you properly load the trailer you won't need sway control because a "PROPERLY" loaded trailer won't sway.

Just my 2 cents based on the information you provided.


Looking forward to your (5) scale tickets where you’ve shown us tire and axle loads isolated. As well, your COG calculations

All trailers sway once to the right speed on a given road under given conditions of wind. There are no constants, is the problem. It’s USUALLY in the transitions from one state to another that things go haywire.

Know when I’d like to see you blow a rod thru the block? As I’m just under the posted construction zone speed limit yanking a 53’ and we have DOUBLE camber changes at each end of a bridge diversion . But there you go passing me (again) blind to vehicle dynamics in every sense of the word when we both have combination vehicles.

Think of it this way: Trailers DONT move side-to-side. They ROTATE in an arc that increases over the travel length. Longer the trailer, greater motion at the farthest end.

That ROTATION means a trailed 1,800-lb construction-site compressor can whip a DRW right off the road. Empty bed, low tire load, shiny concrete. Seen it more than once.

“Properly-loaded trailer” is pretty much meaningless for TTs except toy haulers where bad mis -judgment can come into play.

Camber changes, tripping hazards, curbs, etc are the invisible subjects on RV boards.

.

mkirsch

Rochester, NY

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Posted: 05/14/21 06:49am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Mike134 wrote:

If you properly load the trailer you won't need sway control because a "PROPERLY" loaded trailer won't sway.


What's "proper?" Do you have a formula, or a method? Every trailer is different. Some will not even wiggle with 5% tongue weight. Some will whip all over the road with 20%.

"Move stuff around until the trailer stops swaying" doesn't seem like a very practical way to go about it.

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