RV.Net Open Roads Forum: Tow Vehicles: Ultimate payload monster?

RV Blog

  |  

RV Sales

  |  

Campgrounds

  |  

RV Parks

  |  

RV Club

  |  

RV Buyers Guide

  |  

Roadside Assistance

  |  

Extended Service Plan

  |  

RV Travel Assistance

  |  

RV Credit Card

  |  

RV Loans

Open Roads Forum Already a member? Login here.   If not, Register Today!  |  Help

Newest  |  Active  |  Popular  |  RVing FAQ Forum Rules  |  Forum Posting Help and Support  |  Contact  

Search:   Advanced Search

Search only in Tow Vehicles

Open Roads Forum  >  Tow Vehicles

 > Ultimate payload monster?

Reply to Topic  |  Subscribe  |  Print Topic  |  Post New Topic  | 
Page of 7  
Prev  |  Next
Sponsored By:
rjstractor

Maple Valley, WA

Senior Member

Joined: 01/20/2003

View Profile


Offline
Posted: 07/28/21 07:42pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Cummins12V98 wrote:

GVWR is a JOKE!!! Someone please tell me how I can stay at or under 14k when my RAWR is 9,750# and my unloaded front axle weight is 5,250# when they add up to 15k. My solution is to have tonnage enough to cover my 6 tires load.


Even worse with my 2000 F250 diesel, to get to its 6100 lb or so RGAWR without exceeding its 8800 GVWR, I would have to pile all the weight behind the rear axle to unload the front axle from its 4500 lb or so empty weight to under 2800 pounds. Far safer to load the truck at 5500 on the rear, 4500 on the front even though at those weights I'm exceeding the GVWR by 1200 lbs.

CA Traveler

The Western States

Senior Member

Joined: 01/03/2004

View Profile


Offline
Posted: 07/28/21 08:32pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

GVWR isn't just about dead weight. Consider suspension, brakes, stopping distant, stability when turning/swerving, weather, road conditions etc. Maybe other factors like mfg libiality etc.


2009 Holiday Rambler 42' Scepter with ISL 400 Cummins
750 Watts Solar Morningstar MPPT 60 Controller
2014 Grand Cherokee Overland

Bob


blt2ski

Kirkland, Wa

Moderator

Joined: 03/15/2001

View Profile


Offline
Posted: 07/28/21 08:38pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

rjstractor wrote:

Cummins12V98 wrote:

GVWR is a JOKE!!! Someone please tell me how I can stay at or under 14k when my RAWR is 9,750# and my unloaded front axle weight is 5,250# when they add up to 15k. My solution is to have tonnage enough to cover my 6 tires load.


Even worse with my 2000 F250 diesel, to get to its 6100 lb or so RGAWR without exceeding its 8800 GVWR, I would have to pile all the weight behind the rear axle to unload the front axle from its 4500 lb or so empty weight to under 2800 pounds. Far safer to load the truck at 5500 on the rear, 4500 on the front even though at those weights I'm exceeding the GVWR by 1200 lbs.


Nothing "ILLEGAL" about either of these options. Reality per federal bridge laws, Cummins can go to 32k gvw, 20k on rear 12k or so on FA before being over the FBL standards.
RJ can hit 10-12k on his two axles ALSO before being over wieght per FBLs.
There are other issues that will get them off the road... Wieght will not be an issue, assuming they have the correct paid for tonnage.
Just like I've been pulled over multiple times, been thru DOT scale house upwards of 26000 gvw, I have yet to get an overweight ticket. Even tho door jam tag says gvwr is 18200. By the way, door tag sticker is in OM in my office.

A lot of what others have implied are correct if your going after manufacture warranty performance ratings. Add more options, get a heavier engine, tranny, dual alternators, AC, power windows etc, ALL take away payload, assuming FA and RA have the same numbers. Ext cab also heavier than regular, crew is heaviest yet.
Choose poison, hope it works for you, how you want to use it......

Marty


92 Navistar dump truck, 7.3L 7 sp, 4.33 gears with a Detroit no spin
00 Chev C2500, V5700, 4L80E, 4.10, base truck, no options!
92 Red-e-haul 12K equipment trailer

Check RV.Net Blogs at: blog.rv.net

Grit dog

Black Diamond, WA

Senior Member

Joined: 05/06/2013

View Profile


Offline
Posted: 07/28/21 09:52pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

CA Traveler wrote:

GVWR isn't just about dead weight. Consider suspension, brakes, stopping distant, stability when turning/swerving, weather, road conditions etc. Maybe other factors like mfg libiality etc.


Meh….
Easier to consider learning how to drive than worrying about all that fodder!


2016 Ram 2500, MotorOps.ca EFIlive tuned, 5” turbo back, 6" lift on 37s
2017 Heartland Torque T29

JRscooby

Indepmo

Senior Member

Joined: 06/10/2019

View Profile


Offline
Posted: 07/29/21 05:40am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Cummins12V98 wrote:

GVWR is a JOKE!!! Someone please tell me how I can stay at or under 14k when my RAWR is 9,750# and my unloaded front axle weight is 5,250# when they add up to 15k. My solution is to have tonnage enough to cover my 6 tires load.


I ain't much smarter than a box of rocks, but I would guess there might be other components that limit GWR?
BTW, I don't think I have ever seen a weight tag where the total of axle weights is not greater than GVWR.



Grit dog wrote:

CA Traveler wrote:

GVWR isn't just about dead weight. Consider suspension, brakes, stopping distant, stability when turning/swerving, weather, road conditions etc. Maybe other factors like mfg libiality etc.


Meh….
Easier to consider learning how to drive than worrying about all that fodder!


IMHO, when it comes to hauling or towing, knowing your actual weigh, how it compares to ratings of you vehicle, and how it can effect " stopping distant, stability when turning/swerving" is a pretty important part of "learning to drive", but you do you.

rhagfo

Portland, OR

Senior Member

Joined: 07/06/2012

View Profile



Good Sam RV Club Member

Offline
Posted: 07/29/21 07:16am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

blt2ski wrote:

rjstractor wrote:

Cummins12V98 wrote:

GVWR is a JOKE!!! Someone please tell me how I can stay at or under 14k when my RAWR is 9,750# and my unloaded front axle weight is 5,250# when they add up to 15k. My solution is to have tonnage enough to cover my 6 tires load.


Even worse with my 2000 F250 diesel, to get to its 6100 lb or so RGAWR without exceeding its 8800 GVWR, I would have to pile all the weight behind the rear axle to unload the front axle from its 4500 lb or so empty weight to under 2800 pounds. Far safer to load the truck at 5500 on the rear, 4500 on the front even though at those weights I'm exceeding the GVWR by 1200 lbs.


Nothing "ILLEGAL" about either of these options. Reality per federal bridge laws, Cummins can go to 32k gvw, 20k on rear 12k or so on FA before being over the FBL standards.
RJ can hit 10-12k on his two axles ALSO before being over wieght per FBLs.
There are other issues that will get them off the road... Wieght will not be an issue, assuming they have the correct paid for tonnage.
Just like I've been pulled over multiple times, been thru DOT scale house upwards of 26000 gvw, I have yet to get an overweight ticket. Even tho door jam tag says gvwr is 18200. By the way, door tag sticker is in OM in my office.

A lot of what others have implied are correct if your going after manufacture warranty performance ratings. Add more options, get a heavier engine, tranny, dual alternators, AC, power windows etc, ALL take away payload, assuming FA and RA have the same numbers. Ext cab also heavier than regular, crew is heaviest yet.
Choose poison, hope it works for you, how you want to use it......

Marty


I find it interesting that a moderator would say that federal bridge laws make it legal to exceed the listed axle and tire ratings on truck.
Once you exceed GVWR you hit a grey area. While axle and tire may be considered legal to some, a lawyer will go after the statement in owners manuals that is is unsafe to exceed any of the weight numbers on the VIN tag.


Russ & Paula the Beagle Belle.
2016 Ram Laramie 3500 Aisin DRW 4X4 Long bed.
2005 Copper Canyon 293 FWSLS, 32' GVWR 12,360#

"Visit and Enjoy Oregon State Parks"


blt2ski

Kirkland, Wa

Moderator

Joined: 03/15/2001

View Profile


Offline
Posted: 07/29/21 07:57am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Russ,
I would suggest you and others look up HOW weights are enforced on highways etc. Manufacture labeling us not enforced. OR if the road you are driving on has federal funds to it, your state enforced a lower standard, funds can be held from said state. Granted some exceptions do apply, frozen thawing ground, a lower axle limit can be applied.
Getting an over wieght ticket is a non moving violation. It does not go against driving record.
WHERE an Leo/cveo will get you if over a manufactures rating, they will do a field test braking your rig. You don't stop in X ft, at y mph. Ie about 10-29 mph, you have a failed braking system. THAT is a moving violation. Ticket goes against driving record. Vehicle is red tagged. It cannot beover off road on its own power. Or it needs to be fixed where it sits. This hurts ones pocket book from a legal standpoint
IF you want to to talk getting sued after an accident etc in civil court. That's another can of worms. Even if I'm under ALL of my legal wts etc, depending upon injuries etc, I can still lose my shirt, house etc.

Marty

Cummins12V98

on the road

Senior Member

Joined: 06/03/2012

View Profile


Offline
Posted: 07/29/21 09:42am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

CA Traveler wrote:

GVWR isn't just about dead weight. Consider suspension, brakes, stopping distant, stability when turning/swerving, weather, road conditions etc. Maybe other factors like mfg libiality etc.


GVWR is all about licensing and keeping it in a certain weight class.


2015 RAM LongHorn 3500 Dually CrewCab 4X4 CUMMINS/AISIN RearAir 385HP/865TQ 4:10's
37,800# GCVWR "Towing Beast"

"HeavyWeight" B&W RVK3600

2016 MobileSuites 39TKSB3 highly "Elited" In the stable

2007.5 Mobile Suites 36 SB3 29,000# Combined SOLD

Cummins12V98

on the road

Senior Member

Joined: 06/03/2012

View Profile


Offline
Posted: 07/29/21 09:47am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

No one is going to respond directly to my question of how my SAE rear axle rating plus unloaded front axle weight is 1.000# over my 14k GVWR???

ktmrfs

Portland, Oregon

Senior Member

Joined: 06/22/2005

View Profile


Offline
Posted: 07/29/21 04:52pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Cummins12V98 wrote:

CA Traveler wrote:

GVWR isn't just about dead weight. Consider suspension, brakes, stopping distant, stability when turning/swerving, weather, road conditions etc. Maybe other factors like mfg libiality etc.


GVWR is all about licensing and keeping it in a certain weight class.


maybe not all, but certainly a big part of it. "3/4" ton trucks usually fall under class 2? rating which is GVWR<0=10,000lbs. so at least part of the rating is the class. GM last year or so finally bit the bullet and has the 2500HD as a class III so the SRW has a GVWR of around 11,400 similar to a 3500SRW. Now if you want less for licensing as expected there is a <10,000 GVWR option, just like on the 3500's SRW.

And IIRC the 1/2 tons class rating is <=8800 lbs.


2011 Keystone Outback 295RE
2004 14' bikehauler with full living quarters
2015.5 Denali 4x4 CC/SB Duramax/Allison
2004.5 Silverado 4x4 CC/SB Duramax/Allison passed on to our Son!


Reply to Topic  |  Subscribe  |  Print Topic  |  Post New Topic  | 
Page of 7  
Prev  |  Next

Open Roads Forum  >  Tow Vehicles

 > Ultimate payload monster?
Search:   Advanced Search

Search only in Tow Vehicles


New posts No new posts
Closed, new posts Closed, no new posts
Moved, new posts Moved, no new posts

Adjust text size:




© 2021 CWI, Inc. © 2021 Good Sam Enterprises, LLC. All Rights Reserved.