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Open Roads Forum  >  Towing

 > ProPride and lifted 3500

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ApexAZ

Gilbert, AZ

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Posted: 09/10/21 09:18am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

n0arp wrote:

ApexAZ wrote:

blt2ski wrote:

Simple method to figure out you lower rating is old diam tire/new diam tire times rear ratio. (32/35)3.73 = 3.41 effective axel ratio.
If you were stock at 31", then you are down to a 3.3 effective ratio.
I'm assuming you have a DMAX with that high of a GCWR. Being as 3.73 is the only ratio, no way to tell where you really are per say now in comparison. SWG about 88% or 26,300 +/-.
Remember gcwr is a performance/warranty rating only. Question becomes, what performance are you looking at etc. Holding 60 in DOD vs OD vs Direct at 1800 rpm......pulling an X% grade with out stalling in 1st gear.
Marty


Yes it's a duramax with a 10 speed allison. According to their spec sheet it's actually 3.42. I went from a 33" tire to a 35" tire and it dropped my ratio to 3.22. About a 6% loss. I did some regearing research and I'm not sure a 6% difference is worth it?

SWG about 88% or 26,300 - What is SWG?


I think that trailer is light enough that if I were happy with the performance, I wouldn't bother.


This is sort of what I'm thinking, but I guess I'll just have to see how it performs.

One other question I have is, I currently have a B&W tow and stow that is rated for 1450 VTW and 14,500 trailer weight. I have to drive from Gilbert to Tucson to pick up the trailer and wondering if I can get by with this for the hour and a half drive back without permanently hurting my truck suspension? You know those trucks out there that seem to have perma-sag in the rear end...? I want to avoid that if I can.

I don't necessarily want to spend 3 hours at the dealer trying to install the ProPride in their parking lot.

blt2ski

Kirkland, Wa

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Posted: 09/10/21 09:35am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

SHould have been SWAG. scientific wild assed guess......

I noticed the change in my truck from a 31.5 to 32.5 tires. Also 10 lbs heavier! Latter is probably the biggest part. Then I only have a 4.3 V6. Raised it 2". I'm now about a 3.2 effective vs the 3.42 stock. Even at that, It does good. Lost 1-2 mpg tho.....

If you can not get bars correctly connected to come home/get somewhere etc. I would not worry too much. With 40 years pulling with 8 lug 25/35 series trucks. I found it took 500+ lbs of weight off the front axel to effect how it felt etc. That is around 1500-2000 lbs of HW for a crew cab 170'ish inch WB. 6400 lbs rear springs. With 8500 springs, typical of duallys a decade back, then it was 2000+ lbs of HW to really effect the steering etc. my Reg cab 2500's was more in the 1000-1200 lbs relm. This is stock setups. You being lifted, taller tires. I'm not going to say my experience is equal.


Marty


92 Navistar dump truck, 7.3L 7 sp, 4.33 gears with a Detroit no spin
2014 Chevy 1500 Dual cab 4x4
92 Red-e-haul 12K equipment trailer

Grit dog

Black Diamond, WA

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Posted: 09/10/21 09:51am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

ApexAZ wrote:

n0arp wrote:

Check your wheel ratings. Method makes a nice wheel called the NV305HD that has a 4500lb capacity per wheel, if your current ones aren't sufficient. A lot of aftermarket wheels have poor capacities.

Be aware of your rear axle capacity, and confirm where you are loaded with the trailer, at the scales.

I wouldn't bother upgrading brakes on the truck. Upgrading the trailer to EoH disc, on the other hand, is worth doing.



Thanks.

Wheels are XD Monster III's rated at 3640 and the tires are Toyo AT Open Country rated around the same. My rear axle is rated for 7250 so I think I should be fine? Or should I consider higher capacity wheels?

The trailer tongue weight is 1400 lbs, but obviously this will change once I add the ProPride and add cargo, toys, etc. I assume I should still be under the 2k limit on the truck. I do plan to find some scales once I have the trailer and everything dialed in.

I'll check around on the trailer brake upgrades.


You’ll have no issues with tire/wheel capacity. Not even close to the limits of either.
Nor any of the rest of your truck either.
Having a 3500, it will handle the tongue weight likely 100% without too much squat or any suspension mods needed.
I’m pulling a similar weight/configuration TH with a 6/4” lift coil sprung Dodge on 37s. Aside from needing bags for the squishy springs, the rest of the truck has zero issue towing it. I was a bit skeptical, even though I’ve towed a lot, never towed much with a lifted truck.
I drop it on the hitch ball and hit the road. Sway is 100% a nonissue. Even in Eastern WA winds.
Personally I wouldn’t spend $5 on a wdh for your setup. Especially without trying it first.
Congrats on the new rigs!!


2016 Ram 2500, MotorOps.ca EFIlive tuned, 5” turbo back, 6" lift on 37s
2017 Heartland Torque T29

Grit dog

Black Diamond, WA

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Posted: 09/10/21 10:02am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

ApexAZ wrote:

n0arp wrote:

ApexAZ wrote:

blt2ski wrote:

Simple method to figure out you lower rating is old diam tire/new diam tire times rear ratio. (32/35)3.73 = 3.41 effective axel ratio.
If you were stock at 31", then you are down to a 3.3 effective ratio.
I'm assuming you have a DMAX with that high of a GCWR. Being as 3.73 is the only ratio, no way to tell where you really are per say now in comparison. SWG about 88% or 26,300 +/-.
Remember gcwr is a performance/warranty rating only. Question becomes, what performance are you looking at etc. Holding 60 in DOD vs OD vs Direct at 1800 rpm......pulling an X% grade with out stalling in 1st gear.
Marty


Yes it's a duramax with a 10 speed allison. According to their spec sheet it's actually 3.42. I went from a 33" tire to a 35" tire and it dropped my ratio to 3.22. About a 6% loss. I did some regearing research and I'm not sure a 6% difference is worth it?

SWG about 88% or 26,300 - What is SWG?


I think that trailer is light enough that if I were happy with the performance, I wouldn't bother.


This is sort of what I'm thinking, but I guess I'll just have to see how it performs.

One other question I have is, I currently have a B&W tow and stow that is rated for 1450 VTW and 14,500 trailer weight. I have to drive from Gilbert to Tucson to pick up the trailer and wondering if I can get by with this for the hour and a half drive back without permanently hurting my truck suspension? You know those trucks out there that seem to have perma-sag in the rear end...? I want to avoid that if I can.

I don't necessarily want to spend 3 hours at the dealer trying to install the ProPride in their parking lot.


As this appears to be your first time towing a “heavy” (relative term) trailer, all I can say is don’t sweat it. Seriously. Your hitch is fine (maybe a bit light if your fully loaded tongue weight goes up considerably) as long as it’s a 2.5” shank. If it’s a 2” + adapter, I’d still tow it home no problem, but long term, adapter sleeves raise hell with hitch receivers and pins.
Once you hit 70mph for about 5 min on I10 north and realize it tows fine, a lot of this becomes a moot point.
Gearing, brakes, etc, all are a non issue. You have a brand new trailer and the newest most capable 1 tons on the road. Pulling or stopping this trailer is not an issue whatsoever with any newer 1 ton diesel. You’ll probably want to run er in 7th or 8th gear on the flats though. Keep your rpms up. Less stress on the drivetrain internals.

One other thing to consider, I found out the hard way that the short tongue on our toyhauler and the short shank on the stinger I bought , don’t mix. And I’ve scratched the front cap with the trucks taillights in tight turns.

Grit dog

Black Diamond, WA

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Posted: 09/10/21 10:03am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

It would take alot more than towing that trailer to put a perma sag in your springs.

ApexAZ

Gilbert, AZ

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Posted: 09/10/21 10:03am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

blt2ski wrote:

SHould have been SWAG. scientific wild assed guess......

I noticed the change in my truck from a 31.5 to 32.5 tires. Also 10 lbs heavier! Latter is probably the biggest part. Then I only have a 4.3 V6. Raised it 2". I'm now about a 3.2 effective vs the 3.42 stock. Even at that, It does good. Lost 1-2 mpg tho.....

If you can not get bars correctly connected to come home/get somewhere etc. I would not worry too much. With 40 years pulling with 8 lug 25/35 series trucks. I found it took 500+ lbs of weight off the front axel to effect how it felt etc. That is around 1500-2000 lbs of HW for a crew cab 170'ish inch WB. 6400 lbs rear springs. With 8500 springs, typical of duallys a decade back, then it was 2000+ lbs of HW to really effect the steering etc. my Reg cab 2500's was more in the 1000-1200 lbs relm. This is stock setups. You being lifted, taller tires. I'm not going to say my experience is equal.


Marty


Gotcha, thanks! I think I should be fine. I'm estimating a max of 22-23k combined weight when loaded, but I will likely also avoid carrying water as much as possible.

But for the sake of getting it home without a WD hitch installed, I expect the rear end to sag. I just hope it doesn't become a permanent sag [emoticon]

n0arp

FT

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Posted: 09/10/21 10:14am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

ApexAZ wrote:

But for the sake of getting it home without a WD hitch installed, I expect the rear end to sag. I just hope it doesn't become a permanent sag [emoticon]


What kind of lift do you have? That makes a big difference.


2021 Ram 5500 Limited 84CA Cummins 4x4 w/ flatbed
2020 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited Rubicon 2.0T (follow or TC toad)
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2016 Arctic Fox 1140 WB 1800W/11.4kWh

ApexAZ

Gilbert, AZ

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Posted: 09/10/21 10:26am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

n0arp wrote:



What kind of lift do you have? That makes a big difference.


It's a CST stage 1 suspension subframe lift. The rear has blocks between axle and leaf springs.

n0arp

FT

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Posted: 09/10/21 10:27am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

ApexAZ wrote:

n0arp wrote:



What kind of lift do you have? That makes a big difference.


It's a CST stage 1 suspension subframe lift. The rear has blocks between axle and leaf springs.


If you just have blocks on the rear, you don't have to worry about permanently deforming your springs under the load in question.

ApexAZ

Gilbert, AZ

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Posted: 09/10/21 11:02am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

n0arp wrote:



If you just have blocks on the rear, you don't have to worry about permanently deforming your springs under the load in question.


Really appreciate yours and others help! I think I'll just make due with the current hitch I have to get it home where I can install the ProPride.

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