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Open Roads Forum  >  Tech Issues

 > Not the cells that fail it is the battery Management System!

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time2roll

Southern California

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Posted: 04/10/22 08:55pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

3 tons wrote:

This is where a few ‘determined’ FLA folks, unable to wrap their minds around LFP, inoculate themselves from empirical reality…
Yes and all the while cranking on the FLA at max voltage and amps as if it does not matter too.


2001 F150 SuperCrew
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3 tons

NV.

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Posted: 04/10/22 09:49pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

pianotuna wrote:

Hi 3tons,

I do have an li battery device. They happen to recommend 85% maximum charge to extend the life of the battery.


That’s good to know, but ‘service application’ matters (say, appliance, RV or what??) which will dictate both chemistry and charging requirements, right??.… Bottom line is ‘Li’ does not specifically denote LiFePO4 chemistry (nor do we know it’s a/hr capacity, or type of charging device?)…For clarity’s sake (meaning confusion avoidance) there’s no reason why a LiFePO4 cannot be fully charged - it’s just that it’s seldom necessary, and I suspect that (say, after one’s gained some hands-on familiarity and understanding - e.g. NOT of the Flooded Lead Acid type!…), few will commit to do so on a routine basis…

3 tons

pianotuna

Regina, SK, Canada

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Posted: 04/11/22 08:37am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Stir crazy,

I have no way of knowing what the battery chemistry is. It is not specified in the owners manual.

I'm only providing information for others. LiFePo4 are useless for me.

I believe they are wonderful batteries for temperatures above freezing.


Regards, Don
My ride is a 28 foot Class C, 256 watts solar, 556 amp-hours of Telcom jars, 3000 watt Magnum hybrid inverter, Sola Basic Autoformer, Microair Easy Start.

StirCrazy

Kamloops, BC, Canada

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Posted: 04/12/22 08:19am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

pianotuna wrote:

Stir crazy,

I have no way of knowing what the battery chemistry is. It is not specified in the owners manual.

I'm only providing information for others. LiFePo4 are useless for me.

I believe they are wonderful batteries for temperatures above freezing.


so your providing information for other on somthing you have not used or don't know if you used, and yet the information you like to provide is from older chemestry lightium batteries which don't share the same properties as newer versions.... just think about that for a second...


as for tempatrue outside temprature has absolutly nothing to do with useing or charging LiFePO4 batteries, it is the battery temprature that matters, they are no use to you becasue ou refuse to put them in a conditioned space or use a heating system for them. for others who camp at -40 they might just be fine.

It just seams to me that because you don't want to put in the work to make them suitable, which is fine, you think that nobody should find them suitable and spread half truths or total BS about them in your never ending attack posts..

I have one of my rv's set up on LFP now and I think its wonderfull, and I would have no issue of camping at -35 except my old small furnace wouldnt keep up and theres hardly any insulation in the camper [emoticon] when I do up the 5th wheel that will be the test as I will camp in -15 to -20 in that if I have to.


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pianotuna

Regina, SK, Canada

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Posted: 04/12/22 07:35pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

StirCrazy wrote:

pianotuna wrote:

Stir crazy,

I have no way of knowing what the battery chemistry is. It is not specified in the owners manual.

I'm only providing information for others. LiFePo4 are useless for me.

I believe they are wonderful batteries for temperatures above freezing.


so your providing information for other on somthing you have not used or don't know if you used, and yet the information you like to provide is from older chemestry lightium batteries which don't share the same properties as newer versions.... just think about that for a second...




Old? Nope just got it 2 weeks ago. Recommended 85% max charge for long life. I do read manuals and follow the recommendations.

What I don't know is the exact type of li battery.

StirCrazy

Kamloops, BC, Canada

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Posted: 04/13/22 06:33am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

pianotuna wrote:

StirCrazy wrote:

pianotuna wrote:

Stir crazy,

I have no way of knowing what the battery chemistry is. It is not specified in the owners manual.

I'm only providing information for others. LiFePo4 are useless for me.

I believe they are wonderful batteries for temperatures above freezing.


so your providing information for other on somthing you have not used or don't know if you used, and yet the information you like to provide is from older chemestry lightium batteries which don't share the same properties as newer versions.... just think about that for a second...




Old? Nope just got it 2 weeks ago. Recommended 85% max charge for long life. I do read manuals and follow the recommendations.

What I don't know is the exact type of li battery.


if you just got it they do put the chemistry type in the owners manual nd it is written on the battery. so realy theres no excuse for you not to know.

nobody is disputing that if you use less of the capacity you get more life. this happens with every battery chemistry out there, flooded , agm, Si02, and Li. but they do have there rated life and at 3000 to 4000 cycles at 100% discharge are you worried about getting more cycles. when I sized my camper I used to have 110 usable AH in it with two 6v batteries, now I have 300AH so to use the full capacity would be a strech as the solare would charge long before I ever got that low. (I could go 3 days with out sun with the old batteries) so will I use all the battery, no i set my cut off to 11.9V so I am not using the bottom 8ish % and I'll probably only charge to 100% when I am actualy camping. I can change that setting in about 30 seconds with my phone. so maybe on the day I go home I'll set the charge limit to about 70% for storage and a day or two before I go camping Ill set it for 100% or heck I could use 90% that will still give me about 250 usable AH, thats the beautiful thing about sizing a battery properly, if gives you options and reserve capacity. so by using say 82% of my battery I could maybe get 7000 cycles instead of the 3500.. is that my concern? naw Ill be dead by the time I would ever use 7000 cycles, maybe I can leave this pack to my kids in the will...[emoticon]

* This post was edited 04/13/22 06:44am by StirCrazy *

Itinerant1

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Posted: 04/13/22 08:38am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Today makes 6 years of continuous use of my system with lfp of fulltime boondocking and the days that I was on a power pole I would turnoff the charging from inverter and let the power pass through so only solar was charging the the batteries if needed it from misc 12v loads (fridge, furnace).

2016_ 200 of 261 days
2017_ 365 of 365 days
2018_ 365 of 365 days
2019_ 344 of 365 days
2020_ 282 of 365 days
2021_ 349 of 365 days
2022_ 102 of 102 days

Total of 2,007 days boondocking.

Everyday there are high draw appliances being used from 5-20 minutes (coffeemaker, microwave) to 2-3 hours (15k air conditioner) or just the idle draw of the inverter with a humidifier always going 24/ 7 of 7ah. We live off of the system almost like being on the grid.

My solar and inverter/ charger are set to the same settings of 14.1v absorb (10 minute max, 6 minutes is the normal time till it switches to float), 13.6v float. Our daily power consumption can range from 175ah to 275ah just depending on the season. Shorter the day light hours the more power consumed from batteries. This is running everything in the trailer (not at once). Coffeemaker, microwave, air conditioner, vacuum, ice maker, fridge, air compressor, and other misc hand tools. My inverter is set to 12.0v cut off and never have had it shut down yet due to low voltage even when drawing 150a load at 30% SOC for 5 minutes.

If I have lost capacity I can not tell yet in my day to day use of the system. I have/ do use between 20-100% depending on the season.
I have not had to break the system apart for rebalancing of cells but had to replace 2 senseboards on 2 cells a couple years back. The cpu/ bms shut my batteries down and after bypassing the cpu/ bms was back up and running. Ran it like that for 2 months till I got south to replace them.

I guess my point being is that there are not alot of folks using their rvs in an extreme boondocking/ dry camping situation and try to get "longevity" out of the batteries seems just silly when using them per the manufacturer specs of voltage range 2.8vpc-3.65vpc should yeild a very long life of 2,000-5,000 cycles of 100% use seeing that most are just weekend worriors or on power poles most of the time and in those cases just get dead lead. I believe most will kill their lfp by mistakes of human error or the cells will age out.

Just my opinion from years of hands on experience in all environmental conditions and use and expect to get many more years out of the system.


12v 500ah (5,120Wh usable), 20 cells_ 4s5p (GBS LFMP battery system). 8 CTI 160 watt panels (1,280 watts)2s4p,Panels mounted flat. Magnum PT100 SCC, Magnum 3012 hybrid inverter, ME-ARC 50. Installed 4/2016 been on 24/7/365, daily 35-45% DOD 2,000+ cycles.

3 tons

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Posted: 04/13/22 09:45am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

“ I really have no horse in the race.”

Yet we still haven’t heard what your purported “Li device” is??…Please provide details [emoticon]

3 tons

* This post was edited 04/13/22 10:45am by 3 tons *

Y-Guy

Tri-Cities, WA

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Posted: 04/13/22 08:15pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

And we’re done. Closing the tread for a time out.

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