RV.Net Open Roads Forum: Purchasing first TT, need a bit of sanity checking advice

RV Blog

  |  

RV Sales

  |  

Campgrounds

  |  

RV Parks

  |  

RV Club

  |  

RV Buyers Guide

  |  

Roadside Assistance

  |  

Extended Service Plan

  |  

RV Travel Assistance

  |  

RV Credit Card

  |  

RV Loans

Open Roads Forum Already a member? Login here.   If not, Register Today!  |  Help

Newest  |  Active  |  Popular  |  RVing FAQ Forum Rules  |  Forum Posting Help and Support  |  Contact  

Search:   Advanced Search

Search only in Travel Trailers

Open Roads Forum  >  Travel Trailers  >  General Q&A

 > Purchasing first TT, need a bit of sanity checking advice

Reply to Topic  |  Subscribe  |  Print Topic  |  Post New Topic  | 
Page of 4  
Prev  |  Next
Sponsored By:
jdc1

Rescue, Ca

Senior Member

Joined: 05/30/2011

View Profile


Offline
Posted: 05/12/22 09:31am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

All I can picture is my old next door neighbor hooking up his Chevy 1500 with a good looking offroad suspension to my 10,000 pound dump trailer. I just laughed when his truck's front end was pointing up to the sky. I was sure his front tires where going to come off the ground..... He would have had no steering capabilities had I let him continue. So, I loaned him my Dodge 2500. He then realized he had a car with a truck bed.

nickthehunter

Southgate, MI

Senior Member

Joined: 07/18/2005

View Profile


Offline
Posted: 05/12/22 10:15am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Gdetrailer wrote:

What you are missing is that spec on paper is BASE WEIGHT.

Base weight means and is derived from the absolute barebones configuration of the "base" of the vehicle.

The "base" of the vehicle is 4x2, smallest engine, regular cab short bed with the lowest trim level offered and zero other options.

Buy a crew cab, that adds weight.

Buy a long bed, that adds weight.

Buy 4x4, that adds weight.

Buy the larger engine above the base engine and that adds weight.

Buy the top level trim package with all the trimmings and that adds weight.

Buy any dealer add on options, that adds weight.

Add up all of those options above the "base" and there is your 600+ lb discrepancy and reduction of your available cargo weight of that amount..

Folks get caught up with that supposed tow rating advertised on paper while never reading and comprehending that the number thrown out there is not what you are going to get once you doll the thing up like a Christmas tree. That "tows up to number" is a number used to "market" the vehicle. The real number is just how much cargo capacity you have to work with which unless you bought the absolute barebones vehicle configuration will be considerably less in real life.

Fortunately you have discovered this before committing to a trailer which will be over your available cargo rating..
That's hyperbole, and mostly pure malarkey. Most towing charts for the last 20 years have accounted for a multitude of configurations. Here's 7 pages worth of configurations for the truck in question. Clicky

valhalla360

No paticular place.

Senior Member

Joined: 08/19/2009

View Profile



Good Sam RV Club Member


Posted: 05/12/22 01:54pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

nickthehunter wrote:

That's hyperbole, and mostly pure malarkey. Most towing charts for the last 20 years have accounted for a multitude of configurations. Here's 7 pages worth of configurations for the truck in question. Clicky


Crew cab 4x4 might be as high as 5887 depending on the trim package with a 940lb payload (that has to be a new record for minimalist payload).

That gets it down to a 200lb discrepancy and the OP already found at least part of that.


Tammy & Mike
Ford F250 V10
2021 Gray Wolf
Gemini Catamaran 34'
Full Time spliting time between boat and RV


kcstrom

US

New Member

Joined: 05/11/2022

View Profile



Posted: 05/12/22 09:14pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I appreciate all the feedback from the responses on this thread. Even though there isn't perfect consensus and some differing opinions on importance of the various considerations, I really appreciate everyone taking some of their time to share their knowledge with me.

Clarifying which truck I have exactly:

2013 RAM 1500 6'4" Crew Cab BigHorn 5.7L

There is an entry in the 2013 Ram towing capacity chart for each piece of that line. So the numbers I've copied from there are pretty specific to my truck options and trim package.

As mention earlier though, my actual measured base weight is unfortunately much higher than the spec sheet says. [emoticon] Repasting the limits from OP with some additions:

Towing capacity: 6500lb
Payload: 1650lb
GAWR (rear): 3900lb
GAWR (front): 3900lb
GVWR: 6800lb
Measured weight (rear): 2580lb
Measured weight (front): 3480lb

I estimate the actual payload I'll have available after SO and kids are in truck, and there is a full propane tank and a battery on the TT tongue is going to be closer to 300lb taking into account the extra mystery weight my truck has over the spec sheet.

If I wanted to be 100% sure to stay under GCWR, this means loaded hitch weight would have to be less than 300lbs. There are very few small trailers that sleep 5 that meet that.

I'm leaning towards not trying to stay completely with GVWR but trying to keep reasonably close to it as I definitely don't want to severely overload my truck and risk a lot of damage to it, or worse, causing it to be uncontrollable and leading to accident.

I didn't mention before that I rented a Wolf Pup 16BHS last year, and it seemed like it towed very well. I didn't feel like my truck was handling badly or lacked power or torque. That's part of why I started looking at "bigger" trailers. I wasn't going up and down mountains though, just some smaller hills in SD.

Going through this exercise, I realize I was almost certainly over GVWR some last year as well.

So...looking through a new set of TTs, I'm now thinking about going with the Wolf Pup 17JG (or 17JGBL).
UVW: 3879lb
Hitch weight: 430lb

This would leave about 1664lb before meeting the GCWR of 12100 for my truck. I don't see us packing more than 1000lb .

I know I'll be over GVWR by a couple hundred pounds, but I should still be within GCWR by several hundred.

Is this still too stupid to be considering?

Should I only be considering something smaller like the Wolf Pup 16BHS that will exceed GVWR less?
UVW: 3097lb
Hitch weight: 377lb
Estimate GCW left with this: 2446lb

I feel like the 16BHS was fine last year and pulled much easier than I thought it would. My basis for reference is probably not great though. I grew up on a farm and I'm pretty sure far exceeded GVWR/GAWR many times hauling cattle around. Those were much shorter trips though, and I have to consider possibly stranding myself and my kids hundreds of miles from home now.

Is the hitch weight difference of 53lb between the 17JG and 16BHS going to really matter that much? I'm guessing the UWV difference of 782lb is going to make a bigger difference.

Appreciate all the feedback. Thanks for sharing your thoughts!

Grit dog

Black Diamond, WA

Senior Member

Joined: 05/06/2013

View Profile


Offline
Posted: 05/12/22 10:17pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Dude, you could tow that wolf pup capably with a midisze SUV.
It's pretty clear you're freaked out about this. (And probably sick of my posts, since you're also clearly intimidated by this possible venture and really don't want to hear that it's ok)
So either go sink enough money into a new truck that you could just stay at a B&B every night you're camping for the next 10 years and not be any lighter in the wallet in the end, or maybe try this....
Do you know anyone with a big trailer. Camper, enclosed, big @ss flatbed, whatever. Find something that doesn't totally tank your rear springs for a nice test drive (since that is the weakest link in your truck's equation...but they won't break, they're springs, they'll just sag and maybe bottom out if you hit a bump...and like $200-300 to rectify that situation, permanently if you're so inclined).

Then go take that trailer for a drive and see if it's as awful as your mind is conjuring up.

Or, since you don't really understand what you're worried about, trucks are selling for alot of money right now. Sell yer 1500 and find a similar 2500 gasser. If you're staying in the same ballpark for years and miles, the cost will be negligible by comparison.
OR, a little trailer is cool. And easier to tow, which you already knew. But you wanted a bigger trailer, so...


2016 Ram 2500, MotorOps.ca EFIlive tuned, 5” turbo back, 6" lift on 37s
2017 Heartland Torque T29

BarneyS

S.E. Lower Michigan

Moderator

Joined: 10/16/2000

View Profile



Posted: 05/13/22 08:03am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I'm with Grit Dog on this one. You should have no problem towing the 17JG with your vehicle and I wouldn't worry about being over the GVWR by a couple hundred pounds. The difference between the two trailers you are considering is negligible and the floor plan is much better in the 17JG in my opinion.

I towed the trailer in my signature for quite a few years with a 1997 5.9L gas powered Ram 2500 which was overloaded by about 300lbs on the GVWR. All axle weights were ok and it was just the GVWR that was exceeded. Went probably well over 30,000 mile like that before I finally decided to get a diesel truck. Point is that the overload did not hurt me other than having to have the transmission rebuilt one time (very common for that year RAM).

Go for it! [emoticon]
Barney
Edited to fix engine size. Thanks Grit Dog.[emoticon]

* This post was edited 05/13/22 04:46pm by BarneyS *


2004 Sunnybrook Titan 30FKS TT
Hensley "Arrow" 1400# hitch (Sold)
Not towing now.
Former tow vehicles were 2016 Ram 2500 CTD, 2002 Ford F250, 7.3 PSD


dodge guy

Bartlett IL

Senior Member

Joined: 03/23/2004

View Profile


Online
Posted: 05/13/22 08:27am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

You will be fine! Don’t obsess about it. Remember you want 12% of the trailers loaded for travel weight.

Figure minimum trailer weight of 6000 lbs, closer to 6200. 12% of that for tongue weight would be approx 700lbs. That leaves you with 950 for the hitch and people. The Hemi and 8 speed will haul that without issue!


Wife Kim
Son Brandon 17yrs
Daughter Marissa 16yrs
Dog Bailey

12 Forest River Georgetown 350TS Hellwig sway bars, BlueOx TrueCenter stabilizer

13 Ford Explorer Roadmaster Stowmaster 5000, VIP Tow>
A bad day camping is
better than a good day at work!


nickthehunter

Southgate, MI

Senior Member

Joined: 07/18/2005

View Profile


Offline
Posted: 05/13/22 08:39am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Don't be so worried about hitch weight that you put a bunch of stuff in the back of the trailer so the hitch weight is lower. If you don't have about 12% hitch weight, the trailer will start to sway. Better to be 200 lbs over on the hitch weight than to have that sucker start swaying at about 70 mph.

Grit dog

Black Diamond, WA

Senior Member

Joined: 05/06/2013

View Profile


Offline
Posted: 05/13/22 09:00am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

BarneyS wrote:

I'm with Grit Dog on this one. You should have no problem towing the 17JG with your vehicle and I wouldn't worry about being over the GVWR by a couple hundred pounds. The difference between the two trailers you are considering is negligible and the floor plan is much better in the 17JG in my opinion.

I towed the trailer in my signature for quite a few years with a 1997 7.3L gas powered Ram 2500 which was overloaded by about 300lbs on the GVWR. All axle weights were ok and it was just the GVWR that was exceeded. Went probably well over 30,000 mile like that before I finally decided to get a diesel truck. Point is that the overload did not hurt me other than having to have the transmission rebuilt one time (very common for that year RAM).

Go for it! [emoticon]
Barney


Appreciate “someone” agreeing w me! Lol
But for the OPs edification, what you said about your old truck is largely inapplicable.
Aside from your confusion on what engine your old truck had (unless you transplanted an old Dodge 440 motor in it), your old Ram 2500 had double the axle and spring capacity of the OPs truck. Or to put it differently, OP truck is more capable pulling and the springs are the only issue that would need fixed and axle rating is light but still enough to do what he was asking about.

GrandpaKip

Flat Rock

Senior Member

Joined: 06/18/2013

View Profile



Good Sam RV Club Member

Offline
Posted: 05/13/22 09:23am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Maybe I missed it, but have you looked at the door sticker on your truck?


Kip
2015 Skyline Dart 214RB
2018 Silverado Double Cab 4x4
Andersen Hitch

Reply to Topic  |  Subscribe  |  Print Topic  |  Post New Topic  | 
Page of 4  
Prev  |  Next

Open Roads Forum  >  Travel Trailers  >  General Q&A

 > Purchasing first TT, need a bit of sanity checking advice
Search:   Advanced Search

Search only in Travel Trailers


New posts No new posts
Closed, new posts Closed, no new posts
Moved, new posts Moved, no new posts

Adjust text size:




© 2022 CWI, Inc. © 2022 Good Sam Enterprises, LLC. All Rights Reserved.