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tommyznr
NR, WI
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shelbyfv wrote:For such a stupid notion, it seems V2G is better developed than I thought. Here's what Porsche is up to https://electrek.co/2022/04/08/porsche-proves-the-benefits-of-v2g-technology-by-pooling-its-evs-together-to-help-stabilize-electrical-grids/ Of course, they are probably math challenged morons who reached their peak in HS algebra!
Look, smart people work on stupid ideas all the time. Companies invest in stupid research ideas expecting to salvage something useful out of the research. In the case of your article on Porsche, it is briefly mentioned that this research could result in a product that competes with the Tesla Powerwall.
Previously Gritdog said "Or were you only referring to the EV owners that have their own wind farms and solar arrays?" It looks like this is Porsche's target with V2G.
Porsche already markets around the fringes so adding another fringe device is no big deal. Just don't expect it to be widespread by 2030 like at least one commenter on the article says.
Tom
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shelbyfv
TN
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tommyznr wrote:Look, smart people work on stupid ideas all the time. That may be true, but as a general rule I don't have the expertise to judge. That's what I find objectionable in this thread. Some folks who are clearly not qualified to offer more than a random uninformed opinion feel compelled to jump in and label ideas stupid and ignorant. We often don't know what we don't know. As Harry Callahan put it "A man's got to know his limitations."
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pianotuna
Regina, SK, Canada
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California is testing using "power walls" to help support the grid. The test case will connect 1500 power walls. They are going to pay $2.00 per KWH to the power wall owners.
That is, of course, not a sustainable price. But it may provide some information about how it will, or will not, work.
There is already 50 megawatts of "virtual" storage in California.
https://electrek.co/2022/09/02/tesla-virtual-power-plant-growing/
* This post was
edited 09/04/22 11:07am by pianotuna *
Regards, Don
My ride is a 28 foot Class C, 256 watts solar, 556 amp-hours of Telcom jars, 3000 watt Magnum hybrid inverter, Sola Basic Autoformer, Microair Easy Start.
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vern kelly
la crescenta, ca
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curb weight is 6500 lbs on the XLT trim Ford Lightning. Payload is slightly less than 2000 lbs. I see new registration weight fees for EVs in the near horizon to make up for gas tax and smog fees. Wonder what they will be?
How much would a true Superduty version weigh?
The GMC Hummer EV weighs a whopping 9200 lbs. Oh My!
That's as much as my 98 Dodge 2500 with my Lance camper.
Food for thought.
1998 2500 Dodge V10 3.55 Quad cab. Lance 5000 camper 9'10" and tow 17.5 ft Larson Boat
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free radical
Canada
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vern kelly wrote:curb weight is 6500 lbs on the XLT trim Ford Lightning. Payload is slightly less than 2000 lbs. I see new registration weight fees for EVs in the near horizon to make up for gas tax and smog fees. Wonder what they will be?
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Maybe instead of wasting many bilions $$ on lost case like Ukraine,we could pay for infrastructure here.
https://youtu.be/nCz84Qcvwg0
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pianotuna
Regina, SK, Canada
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ktmrfs
Portland, Oregon
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discussion of EV vehicles reminds me of the discussions about the first diesel trucks non turbo and how they would never be accepted by the masses, only good for economy.
Now, the energy density of hydrocarbon liquid fuel is a tough one to match either on a volume or weight standpoint. But I suspect that at some point in the not to distant future EV pickups for towing will become practical. As for charging, already for cars they are down to 15 minutes for 250-300 miles instead of overnight.
yes there are lots of infrastucture issues, charging issues, energy density issues to overcome. I suspect the current crop of EV pickups will do well with local construction companies etc. that put on 100 or less miles/day around town.
When we see UPS EV local delivery trucks we will be a long way towards practical EV MD trucks.
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Grit dog
Black Diamond, WA
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pianotuna wrote:California is testing using "power walls" to help support the grid. The test case will connect 1500 power walls. They are going to pay $2.00 per KWH to the power wall owners.
That is, of course, not a sustainable price. But it may provide some information about how it will, or will not, work.
There is already 50 megawatts of "virtual" storage in California.
https://electrek.co/2022/09/02/tesla-virtual-power-plant-growing/
So an expensive state funded high school level science experiment?
You do realize how ridiculous this sounds?
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Grit dog
Black Diamond, WA
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ktmrfs wrote:discussion of EV vehicles reminds me of the discussions about the first diesel trucks non turbo and how they would never be accepted by the masses, only good for economy.
Now, the energy density of hydrocarbon liquid fuel is a tough one to match either on a volume or weight standpoint. But I suspect that at some point in the not to distant future EV pickups for towing will become practical. As for charging, already for cars they are down to 15 minutes for 250-300 miles instead of overnight.
yes there are lots of infrastucture issues, charging issues, energy density issues to overcome. I suspect the current crop of EV pickups will do well with local construction companies etc. that put on 100 or less miles/day around town.
When we see UPS EV local delivery trucks we will be a long way towards practical EV MD trucks.
Except it reminds me nothing of the intro of light duty diesels. For every single reason I can think of.
To sum it up, the only reason early diesels weren’t practical was because they lacked power. They weren’t “new” technology per se, they didn’t require any meaningful change to the “grid” or in their case fuel supply.
They weren’t range limited. Just underpowered that’s all.
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Grit dog
Black Diamond, WA
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shelbyfv wrote:Well, you did call me a "Yosemite." Don't know what that is but probably not a compliment. Next there was "I can't even begin to explain how ignorant that notion is...." I think your rep here is keyboard bully. If you are going to dish it out, don't get butt hurt when you get some back. ![[emoticon]](http://www.rv.net/sharedcontent/cfb/images/awink.gif "awink") Anyway, back to V2G. Obviously it's not ready but it's being worked on by folks smarter than you and me. Turtle's link shows that the grid is taxed only a few hours a day. Storing energy and having it available when needed would keep us from having to increase the capacity of power plants just to satisfy a transient peak demand. Maybe think of it like a well filling a water tank.
This is a Yosemite.....or it's what they say when you can hear them...
"Amazing double display of: let me see,1) psychiatric paranoia of hearing voices? 2) Or failure of reading comprehension?
1. Seeing and hearing posts that's not made?
2. Lack of understanding of what's been posted?
Whichever..."
I should not have alluded to you being like him, based on similar responses from both of you. Apologies.
Sorry, not butt hurt nor the other things you're saying. Just being real.
Generally, no almost always, if the numbers don't add up, then neither does the idea. That is all I'm saying...
Like your idea of the well, I like it, as it makes perfect sense.
You can pull water from the well (power grid) at a certain rate defined by how the produces, and you can pull up to what the well produces, anytime (theoretically, like during non peak usage times) and you can store that "water" in a tank (your Tesla/Lightning/camper batteries, whatever) and use it later when the well won't produce enough water on demand.
However the same problem or limitations exist with actual wells as does a power generating system and grid (if capacity is not increased). The more you go to the well, the more you take and then you begin depleting the well and the pretty soon you're borrowing from Peter to pay Paul until Peter can't loan you no more money.....and then you have to expand the system to meet demands.
So yes this "could" potentially buy a little time IF there was complete (read mandatory, not getting political, but so easy to make that inference...lol) participation. But at the end of the day, it's just postponing drilling another well. AND it will cost us, all of us, more in the long run because filling the holding tank during off peak hours rather than addressing the problem head on is of diminishing returns.
AND in this case, not even remotely financially feasible for anyone, really, even as a stop gap, UNLIKE the actual well, IF it was a residential well and you didn't have 100 more neighbors drilling new wells and reducing your already reduced capacity.
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