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Open Roads Forum  >  Tech Issues

 > How to rotate dually pickup truck tires

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bobbolotune

Chicago Area

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Posted: 08/06/22 02:57pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

The manual for my 2016 Ram 3500 dually shows tire rotation only side to side. Specifically, switch the driver front and the passenger front tires, switch the outer rear tires driver to passenger, and switch the inner rear tires driver to passenger. The picture in the manual showing how to rotate shows no rotation back to front.

The manual really doesn’t explain why not to rotate back to front. It does say the rear tires must be matched for wear. Possibly the concern is that if tires are moved back to front that wear won’t match.

The manual does explain why it says to keep the inner rear wheels inner and outer rear wheels outer. It is for the Tire Pressure Information System. To quote, "The Tire Pressure Information System uses unique sensors in the inner rear wheels to help identify them from the outer rear wheels, because of this, the inner and outer wheel locations cannot be switched".

With my last tires it turned out that I had an alignment problem (now fixed) that I wasn’t aware of until I noticed that the tires were wearing unevenly. Since I was rotating the front tires only side to side both front tires wore unevenly on the outer edges. By the time I noticed this the tires were unsafe and I had to replace the tires probably 6,000 or 8,000 miles early.

I had to have the tires replaced during a trip. I ended up at a tire shop in a rural area that seemed to have plenty of experience with duallys. He told me to ignore the manual. He said that they rotate back to front all the time. He says they take the best looking tires from the back and put them on the front.

If I had rotated like that it would have stalled the uneven wear that killed my last tires.

I am about to get the new tires rotated for the first time. I have been telling the mechanic to follow the manual. I am now totally unclear what to do. It would seem that only rotating side to side in the same positions really isn’t going to help much because every other rotation the tires end up back in the same location.

It could be what the manual says that if you don’t keep the inner tires inner and outer tires outer it will confuse the Tire Pressure Information System. But really how important is that? It is nice to have the tire pressures in the instrument cluster because I look at the pressures frequently as I drive, much more often than I would find myself checking tire pressure manually. But I don’t care much about location. If a tire is low (something that actually has never happened yet) I can find out which one by checking the tires manually.

Any opinions about the best answer to this question? Only switch side to side as the manual says, or rotate front to back at the tire place service manager said?

Note: I already posted this to the truck camper forum. But I am dropping the truck in for service tomorrow and am still unclear what to do. Please excuse my posting twice. I know you are not supposed to that that but I am still unclear what to do.


Lance 850 truck camper
2016 Ram 3500 regular cab long bed 4x4 DRW 6.4L HEMI gas

Lwiddis

Southern California :(

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Posted: 08/06/22 03:53pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

“I ended up at a tire shop in a rural area that seemed to have plenty of experience with duallys. He told me to ignore the manual”

I’d follow the manufacturer’s written recommendations as made by automotive/tire engineers over someone who seemed knowledgeable.


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Gdetrailer

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Posted: 08/06/22 04:28pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Per manual HERE it clearly states..

"The Tire Pressure Information System (TPIS) uses
unique sensors in the inner rear wheels to help identify
them from the outer rear wheels, because of this, the
inner and outer wheel locations can’t be switched.

After a tire rotation is completed, as shown below, the
system can auto learn the locations of each sensor ID.
Auto learning/localization occurs when the vehicle
ignition status is changed from Off to On and speeds of
greater than 5 mph (8km/h) are obtained and remain
over 5 mph (8km/h) for at about a 15 minute period.
You may need to drive for 20 minutes to account
slower speeds and stops.

If the tires are rotated incorrectly, The Auto localization
of the TPIS sensors will fail to locate correctly resulting
in incorrect locations for the pressure values displayed
in the Instrument Cluster.

"


Looks like you cannot manually "train" the sensor positions since it is done all automatically the rear inside and outside sensors are programmed different and identify as inside and outside for the rear positions only.

Since you cannot retrain the sensor positions moving the sensors around front to back will most likely result in a TPIS error..

Basically you have 3 sets of unique sensors, two for front, two for inside rear and two for outside rear..

Perhaps one way out of this mess maybe to see if there are programmable after market sensors available that could be trained for any position. But that may require you to buy a special programmer to reprogram each sensor after you rotate the tires..

Retired JSO

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Posted: 08/06/22 05:03pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

You can’t rotate front to rear. The wheels are made for one position either front or rear. I never rotate tires on any vehicle and on my DRW Ford is cost prohibitive since the amount of wear is hardly noticeable. The only way to truly rotate on a DRW truck is to unmount and remount on the appropriate wheel.





fj12ryder

Platte City, MO

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Posted: 08/06/22 06:34pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Retired JSO wrote:

You can’t rotate front to rear. The wheels are made for one position either front or rear. I never rotate tires on any vehicle and on my DRW Ford is cost prohibitive since the amount of wear is hardly noticeable. The only way to truly rotate on a DRW truck is to unmount and remount on the appropriate wheel.
Completely wrong. It may be so for your truck, but don't jump to the conclusion that is so for all dually's. My Ram has the steel wheels and any wheel can be located at any position. YTMV.


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Michelle.S

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Posted: 08/06/22 07:01pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

If that were really the case that you couldn't move wheels, you would then have to have two spares, one for the front and one for the rear.


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Gdetrailer

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Posted: 08/06/22 09:27pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Michelle.S wrote:

If that were really the case that you couldn't move wheels, you would then have to have two spares, one for the front and one for the rear.


Spares generally do not have sensors, so what happens when you need to run a spare, you simply get a TPM light indicating a missing sensor..

Not the end of the world and your vehicle is still usable.

Just an annoying reminder light you can choose to ignore or choose to get tire fixed and put back on.

Gdetrailer

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Posted: 08/06/22 09:37pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

fj12ryder wrote:

Retired JSO wrote:

You can’t rotate front to rear. The wheels are made for one position either front or rear. I never rotate tires on any vehicle and on my DRW Ford is cost prohibitive since the amount of wear is hardly noticeable. The only way to truly rotate on a DRW truck is to unmount and remount on the appropriate wheel.
Completely wrong. It may be so for your truck, but don't jump to the conclusion that is so for all dually's. My Ram has the steel wheels and any wheel can be located at any position. YTMV.


You CAN run them in any position if you want, but the vehicle may not be able to resolve the new positions correctly and the result will be either a missing sensor or wrong tire reported to you as low on pressure..

I don't know about Fords current DRW setup but at one time Ford did not offer TPMS on dually.. But on non dually, you can rotate tires to different positions, but you need to go through a retraining process to correct the sensor locations. Process goes a bit like this..

There is a key on/off routine to get into training mode, once in training mode, you let out the pressure until you get horn bump, start at drivers side front, go to passenger side front to passenger rear then drivers rear then if successful you will get another horn signal.. Fill tires up to desired pressure and done.

Fords Dually could be similar to RAM Dually if Ford went that route but in this day and age seems like a stone age approach to this. I am sure if I checked the Ford manuals I could figure out if the poster is right but doesn't seem appropriate action for a RAM question..

time2roll

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Posted: 08/06/22 10:03pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I have not rotated tire position in decades. New cars and tires hold alignment so much better and the tires wear flat across the tread with little effort. If there is a wear issue fix the alignment or tire pressure. If the fronts or rears wear faster, replace one axle at a time.


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Microlite Mike

NW Washington State

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Posted: 08/06/22 10:03pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

bobbolotune wrote:

The manual for my 2016 Ram 3500 dually shows tire rotation only side to side. Specifically, switch the driver front and the passenger front tires, switch the outer rear tires driver to passenger, and switch the inner rear tires driver to passenger. The picture in the manual showing how to rotate shows no rotation back to front.

The manual really doesn’t explain why not to rotate back to front. It does say the rear tires must be matched for wear. Possibly the concern is that if tires are moved back to front that wear won’t match.

The manual does explain why it says to keep the inner rear wheels inner and outer rear wheels outer. It is for the Tire Pressure Information System. To quote, "The Tire Pressure Information System uses unique sensors in the inner rear wheels to help identify them from the outer rear wheels, because of this, the inner and outer wheel locations cannot be switched".



With my last tires it turned out that I had an alignment problem (now fixed) that I wasn’t aware of until I noticed that the tires were wearing unevenly. Since I was rotating the front tires only side to side both front tires wore unevenly on the outer edges. By the time I noticed this the tires were unsafe and I had to replace the tires probably 6,000 or 8,000 miles early.

I had to have the tires replaced during a trip. I ended up at a tire shop in a rural area that seemed to have plenty of experience with duallys. He told me to ignore the manual. He said that they rotate back to front all the time. He says they take the best looking tires from the back and put them on the front.

If I had rotated like that it would have stalled the uneven wear that killed my last tires.

I am about to get the new tires rotated for the first time. I have been telling the mechanic to follow the manual. I am now totally unclear what to do. It would seem that only rotating side to side in the same positions really isn’t going to help much because every other rotation the tires end up back in the same location.

It could be what the manual says that if you don’t keep the inner tires inner and outer tires outer it will confuse the Tire Pressure Information System. But really how important is that? It is nice to have the tire pressures in the instrument cluster because I look at the pressures frequently as I drive, much more often than I would find myself checking tire pressure manually. But I don’t care much about location. If a tire is low (something that actually has never happened yet) I can find out which one by checking the tires manually.

Any opinions about the best answer to this question? Only switch side to side as the manual says, or rotate front to back at the tire place service manager said?

Note: I already posted this to the truck camper forum. But I am dropping the truck in for service tomorrow and am still unclear what to do. Please excuse my posting twice. I know you are not supposed to that that but I am still unclear what to do.


Tires in dual service MUST be equal not only in wear, but in diameter (ideally in circumference as well). Slight differences make for some nasty wear and sometimes premature failure.

Fronts are subjected to all kinds of wear forces so no go to rear in duals.


"Knowledge is realizing that the street is one-way, wisdom is looking both directions anyway."


~ Albert Einstein

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