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Open Roads Forum  >  Tow Vehicles

 > California to Ban the Sale of New Gasoline Cars by 2035

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d1h

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Posted: 08/25/22 07:24pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

[image]

* This post was edited 08/26/22 12:12am by an administrator/moderator *

Grit dog

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Posted: 08/25/22 08:43pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

shelbyfv wrote:

I think it's a safe bet they are better with math than you or I.[emoticon]


Speak for yourself...


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free radical

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Posted: 08/25/22 08:47pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

schlep1967 wrote:

Just saw in the news today that They are shutting down EV chargers in certain cities in China so they can have electric for the households. Just what do you think is going to happen when the Hoover dam stops making electric because there are too many people living off of that pool of water in the desert?

1st mistake is beliving anything our media says about China

2 see Living in China chanel and or Reporterfy media travel.


3 enjoy https://youtu.be/GWZzwLFlDIQ

Grit dog

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Posted: 08/25/22 08:53pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

shelbyfv wrote:

Obviously vehicle to grid is not ready for prime time but indications are it will be part of the solution as we move from ICEs. Certainly as a concept it is not "laughable." The issues you mention are not unknown to those involved and they seem optimistic. I think it's a safe bet they are better with math than I.[emoticon]


Well obviously...lol. However, you are proving your point about the math thing.....

Since the gas station analogy must have gone straight over your head, I'll try again.
First, read my comment in the solar RV thread in response to the use a DCDC charger to replenish batteries in the solar RV while you're driving. That explains it pretty well. What he suggested was like a small v2g system. Maybe that will make sense to you.

And in the mean time, any antagonist is welcome to set up a nice example and run the numbers...if you can even recognize the main factors that need to be included.
I'd like to be wrong...I really would, however, if I was, I'd have a he!! of a lot more money than Elon Musk, because I'd be performing magic and cashing in.

free radical

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Posted: 08/25/22 09:02pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

FishOnOne wrote:

Like the title says "California to ban the sales of new gasoline cars by 2035". I can see it now all those used cars being hauled to Mexico will now be hauled to California.

Link

No need to ban it,there wont be any being built by that time. [emoticon]

Grit dog

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Posted: 08/25/22 09:23pm Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

For shelby and Thermoguy


Quick example, using F150 lightning (115kwh usable) and an avg small EV (about 60k usable)
We will call the avg 80kwh.
V2G, sell back 50% of battery capacity, 40kwh each day (no mention of how you get it full, will jsut assume its magically full when you pullin after work at home and plugger in to sell back some electrons during peak demand)
Gotta leave a "half tank" for the next day to get to work and back home in case your buddy beats you to the free mooch dock charging station at work...

Use LA county, avg 179^6 kWh used daily. So take a LOW avg during peak summer times of 200^6 kWh. (In reality it's higher during peak demand season / hot weather, but I don't want you to think I'm cooking the numbres)

Currently 35,000 EVs in LA county (approx).

To just supplement 1% of the peak daily demand all 35,000 people have to participate (or lets say theres actually double that many EVs and half the people do it, every day there is a demand).
So 1 % of the consumption (when the peak usage rises 20% plus over average(at least) or 5% of the increased demand can be supplied.

So this is 1 out of 20, 5% solutions needed, IF at least half of the EV owners do this (becasue it's somehow financially attractive, although the mooch docking power to sell back and the cost of wearing out your vehicle while going nowhere and getting $.10/kwh (they ain't going to buy it for more than they're chargin you) x 40 kwh = $4/day "profit" for an EV owner that spent an avg of (in my example) only say $60k for a rolling Duracell.

$120/month for a total of 3? months per year (because this makes even less sense when 1 Honda 2000 can run the AC, no need to buy the second one (since you RV types understand generators...))

So each EV owner gets an avg max of $360 for power that "someone" paid $576 for (@ avg $.16 elect rate in LA county). And it was likely you who charged at home or paid even more at the cool Tesla "gas pumps" because your buddy mooch docked the last extension cord at the office.
And the power company solves 5% of it's problem (or say even 20% when the number of cars increases by 400%) while making money off of the backs of EV owners or their employers, if the EV owners get up extra early and beat their buddy to the mooch dock at work.





Even the people who can't do math well will figure out they're losing money by the time that there are 150,000 EVs in LA county!


Show me where this actually adds up for the consumer?

* This post was edited 08/26/22 08:34am by Grit dog *

PButler96

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Posted: 08/26/22 02:29am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I see the sales of extension cords, and trip and fall personal injury lawsuits, increasing exponentially.

Perhaps they'll install charging pedestals 18' apart on every curb, along every residential street, in every urban area in the country.
[image]

* This post was edited 08/26/22 02:48am by PButler96 *


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schlep1967

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Posted: 08/26/22 05:25am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

free radical wrote:

schlep1967 wrote:

Just saw in the news today that They are shutting down EV chargers in certain cities in China so they can have electric for the households. Just what do you think is going to happen when the Hoover dam stops making electric because there are too many people living off of that pool of water in the desert?

1st mistake is beliving anything our media says about China

2 see Living in China chanel and or Reporterfy media travel.


3 enjoy https://youtu.be/GWZzwLFlDIQ

Bloomberg news is who published the story.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/........as-china-power-cuts-bite?srnd=hyperdrive

I don't appreciate being given a link that tells me I am a China Hater just because I mentioned a story about China struggling to meet electricity needs due to a drought and high temps. Especially since we are having the same issues in the US.


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2112

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Posted: 08/26/22 05:33am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

This is an initiative not cast in stone with the intent to drive innovation. It's a plan to move technology forward into the future.

This reminds me of when analog OTA TV was being replaced with digital. How many whine and cried about that? The government subsidised conversion boxes to make the transition less painful. Do you want to to back to analog?

Part or our problem is our antiquated top down power grid. The way we have pieced our power grid together over the last hundred years has somewhat painted us into a corner in regards to making a major conceptual change that would allow us to easily apply new technologies.

We need to consider decentralizing our power generation into a bottom up approach but the existing system makes that transition quite complex and costly. Not to mention special interest and corporation pushback.

Here is an interesting article on a bottom up decentralized power system. Once the micro grids are in place you can think of each power source as a black box. Each black box would be whatever plug & play power source comes along in the future.


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schlep1967

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Posted: 08/26/22 05:45am Link  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

There is a difference between subsidizing EV's and forcing the production and sales of ICE vehicles to stop.
I am all for electric vehicles where they are practical. And actually like the hybrids better simply because it increases the practicality. But taking away the ICE when there is no practical, affordable and reliable system to replace ALL of its uses is dangerous for our Country.

And where is the green gain when the overtaxed reservoirs can't produce electricity and we have to burn more fossil fuels to power all of the electric vehicles?

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