 |
|
|
|
pianotuna
Regina, SK, Canada
Senior Member
Joined: 12/18/2004
View Profile
 Offline
|
power max is top of the line.
Regards, Don
My ride is a 28 foot Class C, 256 watts solar, 556 amp-hours of Telcom jars, 3000 watt Magnum hybrid inverter, Sola Basic Autoformer, Microair Easy Start.
|
otrfun
On The Road
Senior Member
Joined: 09/08/2012
View Profile
Good Sam RV Club Member
|
Grit dog wrote:^ Are single stage battery chargers of any flavor a thing anymore? Whether talking converters, typical automotive chargers, marine chargers or small power equipment chargers/maintainers…
Every charger I’ve bought for the last 20lbs years has been a smart charger (well except the WFCO, it’s the Dollar Store of battery chargers and it came with the last RV I bought and it purports to be a smart charger as well. It’s just learning disabled…hence the recommendations here to get something else). In the lead-cell world, I agree.
In the lifepo4 world, not so much. Look closely at the "lithium/lifepo4 approved" converters and chargers now on the market. Many are single-stage (single voltage) 14.6v chargers. For instance, Progressive Dynamic, one of the largest OEM converter/charger manufacturers for the RV market, didn't start offering multi-stage (multi-voltage) lifepo4 converters/chargers until a year or so ago. There's still a large inventory of single-stage Progressive Dynamic lifepo4 converters still being sold.
* This post was
edited 03/22/23 03:25pm by otrfun *
|
StirCrazy
Kamloops, BC, Canada
Senior Member
Joined: 07/16/2003
View Profile
|
otrfun wrote:Grit dog wrote:^ Are single stage battery chargers of any flavor a thing anymore? Whether talking converters, typical automotive chargers, marine chargers or small power equipment chargers/maintainers…
Every charger I’ve bought for the last 20lbs years has been a smart charger (well except the WFCO, it’s the Dollar Store of battery chargers and it came with the last RV I bought and it purports to be a smart charger as well. It’s just learning disabled…hence the recommendations here to get something else). In the lead-cell world, I agree.
In the lifepo4 world, not so much. Look closely at the "lithium/lifepo4 approved" converters and chargers now on the market. Many are single-stage (single voltage) 14.6v chargers. For instance, Progressive Dynamic, one of the largest OEM converter/charger manufacturers for the RV market, didn't start offering multi-stage (multi-voltage) lifepo4 converters/chargers until a year or so ago. There's still a large inventory of single-stage Progressive Dynamic lifepo4 converters still being sold.
I think part of that is they were waiting for a consensus of what would be good for a second voltage on a two stage and to see which format (chemical composition) was going to become the leader for rv use. There are some companies that came out with 2 stages right off the bat.
2014 F350 6.7 Platinum
2016 Cougar 330RBK
1991 Slumberqueen WS100
|
StirCrazy
Kamloops, BC, Canada
Senior Member
Joined: 07/16/2003
View Profile
|
pianotuna wrote:power max is top of the line.
I don't know about that.. I have been looking at it and I see a lot of mixed reviews and their power factor is commonly referred to as being bad. I do like the fact that you can fine tune the top voltage but I wish you could tune the 2nd stage independently.
With some solar controllers you can program everything. Why hasn't anyone done this for converters yet?
Steve
|
otrfun
On The Road
Senior Member
Joined: 09/08/2012
View Profile
Good Sam RV Club Member
|
StirCrazy wrote:I think part of that is they were waiting for a consensus of what would be good for a second voltage on a two stage and to see which format (chemical composition) was going to become the leader for rv use. There are some companies that came out with 2 stages right off the bat. I'm a bit surprised any reputable converter/charger manufacturer would produce a single-stage 14.6v lifepo4 converter/charger.
The converter/charger industry transitioned from single-stage to multi-stage converters/chargers for lead-cell batteries many, many years ago.
Lead-cell and lifepo4 chemistries share the same, exact charging dilemma. There is no one, ideal charge voltage for lead-cell. There is no one, ideal charge voltage for lifepo4.
Why some converter/charger manufacturers completely ignored this simple concept by introducing single-stage (single voltage) lifepo4 converters/chargers for lifepo4's is beyond me.
|
|
|
Grit dog
Black Diamond, WA
Senior Member
Joined: 05/06/2013
View Profile
Offline
|
^Yeah. I wouldn’t have thought that for a minute. But we are talking about RV component mfgs here. Not exactly near the top of the list for innovation or technology and often quality as well.
Also thought it went without saying….as idk why anyone would purchase a single stage battery charger of any sort except for maybe a known dedicated purpose.
I got an old kick butt single stage charger. Only use it if I’m trying to recover a battery. But with smart chargers, haven’t killed one dead in a long time. Except occasionally the key or hand warmers get left on, on the mower or 4 wheeler.
And I bought my first LiFePO4 charger (smart charger) years ago. Not like the charging technology just got sorted out a couple years ago.
Weird stuff, these AreVees….
2016 Ram 2500, MotorOps.ca EFIlive tuned, 5” turbo back, 6" lift on 37s
2017 Heartland Torque T29 - Sold.
Couple of Arctic Fox TCs - Sold
|
time2roll
Southern California
Senior Member
Joined: 03/21/2005
View Profile
Good Sam RV Club Member
|
StirCrazy wrote:pianotuna wrote:power max is top of the line.
I don't know about that.. I have been looking at it and I see a lot of mixed reviews and their power factor is commonly referred to as being bad. I do like the fact that you can fine tune the top voltage but I wish you could tune the 2nd stage independently.
With some solar controllers you can program everything. Why hasn't anyone done this for converters yet?
Steve Do you have one? I don't think the adjustment holds for the multistage. I read PM is either fixed voltage adjustable or preset multistage.
2001 F150 SuperCrew
2006 Keystone Springdale 249FWBHLS
675w Solar pictures back up
|
otrfun
On The Road
Senior Member
Joined: 09/08/2012
View Profile
Good Sam RV Club Member
|
time2roll wrote:StirCrazy wrote:pianotuna wrote:power max is top of the line. I don't know about that.. I have been looking at it and I see a lot of mixed reviews and their power factor is commonly referred to as being bad. I do like the fact that you can fine tune the top voltage but I wish you could tune the 2nd stage independently.
With some solar controllers you can program everything. Why hasn't anyone done this for converters yet?
Steve Do you have one? I don't think the adjustment holds for the multistage. I read PM is either fixed voltage adjustable or preset multistage. We just purchased a new 75a Powermax. The unit can be switched to operate as a single-stage charger (i.e., power supply) or 3-stage charger.
There's a very small pot that adjusts voltage for *both* the single-stage mode and the *bulk* stage when in 3-stage mode. It can be adjusted from 13.0 to 16.5v. Comes from Powermax preset for 14.6v. Haven't confirmed it yet, but I believe the float (13.2v) and absorption (13.6v) voltages remain fixed and are not changed by this pot.
|
Ranger Tim
Idaho
Senior Member
Joined: 02/08/2004
View Profile
Offline
|
I do know what I want. Two LiFePO batteries and a converter that I can leave unattended while on shore power that will maintain them. I have no solar, a small generator and very low demand. We camp in varied locations from boondocking to KOA. I have gleaned enough info from the thread to be very useful and thank the contributors for their input.
Ranger Tim
2006 F-350 Super Crew King Ranch SRW Bulletproofed
2016 Wolf Creek 840
Upper and Lower StableLoads
|
StirCrazy
Kamloops, BC, Canada
Senior Member
Joined: 07/16/2003
View Profile
|
otrfun wrote:StirCrazy wrote:I think part of that is they were waiting for a consensus of what would be good for a second voltage on a two stage and to see which format (chemical composition) was going to become the leader for rv use. There are some companies that came out with 2 stages right off the bat. I'm a bit surprised any reputable converter/charger manufacturer would produce a single-stage 14.6v lifepo4 converter/charger.
The converter/charger industry transitioned from single-stage to multi-stage converters/chargers for lead-cell batteries many, many years ago.
Lead-cell and lifepo4 chemistries share the same, exact charging dilemma. There is no one, ideal charge voltage for lead-cell. There is no one, ideal charge voltage for lifepo4.
Why some converter/charger manufacturers completely ignored this simple concept by introducing single-stage (single voltage) lifepo4 converters/chargers for lifepo4's is beyond me.
wasn't just some, they all did single stage Li output for a bit, some went to dual stage quicker than others.. don't forget LiFePO4 isn't the original LI that the converters were intended for so the second stay wasnt considered necessary as the one voltage would cover the two or three types of Li out there. now that LFP has emerged as the most usual format you are seeing all the two stages coming out at around 14.6 and 13.6. Now would I buy a 2 stage... for me I don't know if it makes any sense. I use my BMS to control my charge so it would charge to the voltage I have set and then shut off the charge so the 2nd stage would never really come into play anyways. all the modern electronics, led or florescent lights will handle a 14.6V no issues. so for me I am not quite sure it makes sense, unless you can think of something I am missing. but for someone who is buying off the shelf batteries and cannot control the charging cut in and outs then ya a 2 stage is great as it will hit 14.6, do its balance thing, then drop off to 13.6 or whatever the second stage is.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
