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NORM WADDELL
PENSACOLA FL 32514
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Joined: 11/16/2000
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The 50A circuits ARE 230 volt.
Use your voltmeter and check one.
Your RV uses each of two hots
to neutral, 115 volts each.
They are 230 Volt, single phase
circuits. Each can supply 50A
if the loads are balanced (not
likely) with the currents meeting
and canceling at the neutral.
I have wired these circuits.
*This Message was edited on 01-Jun-02 06:27 AM by NORM WADDELL*
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Satman
McLoud, OK, USA
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Joined: 11/28/2001
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Steve,
That is true.
Dan & Vonieta Stogner
2003 Newmar Mountain Aire, Cummins 400 HP, ISL
2014 Honda CR-V Toad
1 Westies, Millie
Think of life as a terminal illness, because if you do, you will live it with joy and passion as it ought to be lived.
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Colette and Joe
Cashiers, NC
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Joined: 10/27/2001
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You have to be an electrician to plug a 30 amp
and a 20 amp into a RV service. ![[emoticon]](http://www.rv.net/sharedcontent/cfb/images/smile.gif "smile")
Smokyjoe
*This Message was edited on 02-Jun-02 06:17 AM by Colette and Joe*
2001 Travel Supreme 36' DP - "Smoky's Den"
2001 Automatic PT Cruiser, Blue Ox tow and break system and Remco trans. pump.
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JohnM.
Cowan Heights,CA
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Joined: 02/18/2002
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I noticed when hooking up the other day at the campground that the electrical box had what appeared to be a 220v outlet configuration, a standard 110v rv outlet that requires that funny adapter and a couple of 110v standard gfi setups that was to serve four camp sites. I was there first and was able to use the 110v rv hookup but I didnt even know if I could plug into the 220 outlet without blowing up anything even though I have the 50 amp service for my coach.
Satman, in a previous post above you said that the rv breaks down the two lines in the 220 circuit to two 110. Is that automatic or standard?. My manual says nothing about that. the main reason I am interested in this is that I have a 220v outlet 60ft from where I park my rig and my standard coach cord wont reach it. I was going to run another new outlet box for the rv to be hooked up and run the air in the summer if I want to but if I can use the 220 outlet I have already avavilable, (thats my welding hookup), just by buying a short extension cord, then that would be a breeze and save me some money. I've always wondered why the end of the rv cable is like a 220 plug with the adapters for the other outlets.
2002 Adventurer 35u, W22k 8.1/Allison 5 spd.
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Colette and Joe
Cashiers, NC
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Yes,you can plug into a 240 volt outlet.
Smokyjoe
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Les Repas
Nashville,TN
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Joined: 12/26/2000
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JohnM
If your welder plug is 3 prongs 240 Volt do not plug your RV into it. The 50amp RV plugs are 4 prongs with the following configurations.
The 50amp 120/240 RV plugs have 4 prongs. The half round is the ground the one directly bellow it is the WHITE or neutral and the other two 180 degrees apart are 120 volt HOT each. The ONLY way you get 220/240 volt out of this is to connect the two HOT wires together. In reality you have TWO 120 volt split service going into your RV.
If you can’t tell what you have I suggest you get a qualified person to wire your receptacle. The damage you can do to your RV could be costly.
Les R.
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J R
6 Mo. S.E. MI.-6 Mo. S.W. Fl
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Les,
You may want to reread your post regarding getting 220/240 volts by tying the two HOT wires together. What you may get is one big spark.
Neutralsmoke,
You mentioned about using two back to back 30 amp circuits feeding into the RV (one from the opposite site).
This can overload the neutral wire on your 50 amp cord and cordcap and smoke the neutral wire.
Using a 20A and a 30A supply only produces 50 Amps total on the 50A neutral. 30A plus 30A puts 60A on a wire rated for only 50 amps
J R
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Les Repas
Nashville,TN
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I guess my words are misleading. To get 220 volt from a HOME service requires 2 legs of the 110-volt legs USED together. This is usually used for a water heater, stove, welder etc.
Les R
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MELM
GA
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Joined: 12/11/2001
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This is long, but is an assembly of information about the 120 Volt AC power for RV's.
There are 4 receptacle configurations that you will run into in the campgrounds. From the ANSI/NEMA specification WD 6-1997:
15 Amp - the common duplex receptacle that you have at home and the plugs on the standard extension cords, etc. These are ANSI/NEMA 5-15R and 5-15P and are rated for 125Volts/15Amps. The National Electrical code allows the duplex receptacle to be connected to a 20 Amp breaker even though each receptacle and the plug that goes into it are only rated for 15 Amps; and in your home, several duplex recptacles may be connected to the same breaker (often all the outlets in a room will go to one breaker).
20 Amp - becoming more common in the GFCI protected circuits. The receptacles look much like the 15 Amp ones, except one socket on the receptacle looks like a T laid on its side. These are ANSI/NEMA 5-20R. The 20 Amp plug is an ANSI/NEMA 5-20P and looks much like the common 15 Amp plug, but has one blade rotated 90 degrees. These are rated for 125Volts/20Amps. The 15 Amp and the 20 Amp plugs will plug into the receptacle. Again, these can be connected to a 20 Amp breaker.
30 Amp - obviously designed for RV's. This is the common 30 amp RV connector with one half round pin and two large blades that are angled. The receptacle is an ANSI/NEMA TT-30R, and the plug is an ANSI/NEMA TT-30P. These are rated for 120Volts/30Amps (note that the NEMA rating is not 125 Volts on this configuration - interesting). The TT is for Travel Trailer as it is listed that way in the "Description" column in the NEMA table - I guess that's because there were a lot more travel trailers than motorhomes when this plug was put into use. I have seen these labeled "RV" instead of "TT" in catalogs and on the store shelves. These can be connected to a 30 Amp breaker.
50 Amp - the common four pin configuration used for larger RV's. The receptacles are ANSI/NEMA 14-50R and the plugs are ANSI/NEMA 14-50P. The half round pin is ground, the blade directly across from it is Neutral, and the other two blades each have 120 Volts. If wired per the National Electricat Code, the two 120 Volt feeds are of opposite phases so that you get 240 Volts when you read across them and 120 Volts between each of them and neutral or ground. Each of the two power sockets can be wired to a 50 Amp breaker - for 240Volts, the two breakers are "ganged" (the handles are connected together) or are of a special design with only a single handle. However, some campgrounds may only have 30 or 40 Amp breakers on the power feeds to these receptacles.
A disclaimer: the National Electrical Code is from the National Fire Protection Association and is not a law. However, almost all community building codes incorporate it into their code. Many amend it in some way. So not every campground - or RV - in the country is wired to the NEC. What follows is based on the NEC, and what I have found in almost every campground I've been in.
New electrical installations will have the 15 or 20 and 30 Amp receptacles with GFCI - either built into the outlet or in the breaker. The 50 Amp receptacle will not have GFCI (but I don't doubt that it's in the future). The requirement for GFCI on outdoor outlets became part of the National Electric Code in the early 70's. So any campgrounds that were built after that time, or had the electrical system upgraded, should have GFCI on the 15 Amp receptacles. The requirement for the 30 Amp outlets to be on GFCI is more recent, but I don't know when it started.
Some comments about items in this thread and some knowledge I've gained from this forum:
If the "cheater" will work, you can bet that the campground wiring is pretty old or not done to the National Electric Code.
From my own experience, and from statements in other threads, you can expect to find outlets incorrectly wired or with a wire not connected sometime in your camping experience. You may also find incorrect receptacles. I've seen receptacles that look a lot like the 30 Amp RV receptacle installed, but one or more of the sockets are not correct and the RV plug won't go in.
From another thread a couple of months ago, it became apparent that many RV's with the 50 Amp plug and cord have a power panel that does not allow for a 240 Volt circuit to be connected - it has two 120 Volt circuits available to the breakers in the panel, but no way to connect a "ganged" breaker or a 240 Volt application. (A forum member had to have an additional panel wired in so he could put in a 240 Volt dryer.) I suspect there are a number of variations on the power panels and main breakers that come in the wide array of RV's that have been manufactured over the years.
If you have a 50 Amp cable on your RV, you should be checking the receptacle before you plug in with a circuit tester or voltmeter. (Or install a power monitor system in your RV that will do it for you.) If the neutral wire is not connected to the receptacle and you plug in, something in your RV will probably "smoke" as, without going into the electrical details, it'll have about 240 Volts applied. Other forum members have been victims; I've seen 3 or 4 50 Amp outlets where the neutral wire had come loose and was not making contact and I am sure that a previous RV'er left with a problem. It is also wise to throw the breaker in the campground panel before you plug in. That way you can't get the hot pins connected before the neutal is connected, and it don't take long for elecricity to do it's damage.
Outlet testing. You can buy an outlet tester that has lights to indicate that the outlet wiring is normal or has problems for less that $5 at a hardware or building supply store. (Or you can buy a voltmeter and learn use it if you don't already know.) You can also buy much more expensive circuit testing devices that do the testing and measure the voltage and/or frequency. But all of them I've seen plug into the standard 15 Amp receptacle. So add a 30 Amp male to 15 Amp female adapter available at RV stores for less than $5 and you can plug the circuit tester into the adapter, and the adapter into the 30 Amp receptacle and check the 30 Amp receptacle. Add the 50 Amp male to 30 Amp female adapter, available at RV stores for $15 to $20, plug the 30 Amp adapter into it, the tester into the 30 Amp adapter and you can test 3 of the 4 wires in the 50 Amp receptacle - ground, neutral and one of the two power leads. Neutral is the critical one for an RV connecting to a 50 Amp receptacle. If the second power lead has no power, some thing(s) in the RV - like one air conditioner - won't work; but if neutral is missing, some thing(s) in the RV will probably need to be repaired or replaced.
GFCI - My simple explanation. The GFCI circuit has electronics in it that measures and compares the currents in the hot and neutral leads. If they are not equal, the circuit trips and removes power. That usually occurs when some power flowing through either the hot or neutral lead finds a path to ground. The tripping action is almost instantaneous and occurs with an extremely small amount of power difference - a few thousandths of an amp.
If I've got anything in this that is not correct, I'm sure some of the other members will point it out and I'll make a correction.
Mel & Mary Ann; Mo'Be (More Behave...) and Bella
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JohnM.
Cowan Heights,CA
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Joined: 02/18/2002
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Thanks MELM,
I will be very careful as I look into this further. JohnM
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